Official Valverde thread.

[samhocking]

For me Valverde's legacy is one of success and suspension, but not redemption. In fact probably a legacy of denial his own DNA even matched blood held in Fuentes clinic. I know there are other factors to his case, but fundamentally his legacy is only of Success & Suspension and I think he would do well to have admitted it at the time. However, doping is a legal matter and he satisfied what was required legally and it doesn't require redemption, so it's his choice, not the fans and the critics.

 

[Savant12]

He's not done yet for laughs.

2019 Giro or Vuelta GC Winner
2020 Olympic Gold

 

[58teeth]

ANYONE BUT HIM. ANYONE. This an absolute travesty, and the worst possible thing that could ever happen for pro cycling. I am so, so disappointed.

 

[samhocking]

The anti-doping rules don't require redemption from Valverde. Legally he satisfied all the rules required at the time, served his suspension and returned. He's denied he ever did anything wrong despite his DNA matching Fuentes blood bags, so maintaining his own omerta will be a large part of his legacy now. If we want lifetime bans to prevent ex-dopers winning bike races, then we should be requesting lifetime bans from UCI and accept redemption is no longer possible with that.

 

[Bardamu]

Re:

ANYONE BUT HIM. ANYONE. This an absolute travesty, and the worst possible thing that could ever happen for pro cycling. I am so, so disappointed.

What about former dopers who won and completely got away with it and are loved by the public? Atleast Valverde's legacy is stained.

 

[Bardamu]

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

 

[Singer01]

He's not done yet for laughs.

2019 Giro or Vuelta GC Winner
2020 Olympic Gold

He isn't getting within 100 miles of winning another gc. Especially not the giro with it's high altitude climbs. And if he couldn't win this year's vuelta which was basically his perfect parcours he isn't winning that either.
Olympic gold at 40, maybe.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

Valverde doesn't need to admit to anything. Doping was part of the sport, he played by those rules. In his head there's no wrong doing. He started his career in a dope fueled cycling and continued to do what was needed to win until he was caught. What amazes me is how can anybody think that he has gone cold turkey when he came back. He is the same or better after the suspension, he becomes better with age, he is 38. It defies logic to think that today Valverde is riding pan y agua.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

Valverde doesn't need to admit to anything. Doping was part of the sport, he played by those rules. In his head there's no wrong doing. He started his career in a dope fueled cycling and continued to do what was needed to win until he was caught. What amazes me is how can anybody think that he has gone cold turkey when he came back. He is the same or better after the suspension, he becomes better with age, he is 38. It defies logic to think that today Valverde is riding pan y agua.

Omerta doesn't die.

It's just easy money and PR for riders and journalists involved to pretend that it did. Nothing sells better than a good story, even if it's fiction.

 

[Bardamu]

Re: Re:

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

Valverde doesn't need to admit to anything. Doping was part of the sport, he played by those rules. In his head there's no wrong doing. He started his career in a dope fueled cycling and continued to do what was needed to win until he was caught. What amazes me is how can anybody think that he has gone cold turkey when he came back. He is the same or better after the suspension, he becomes better with age, he is 38. It defies logic to think that today Valverde is riding pan y agua.

I was more trying to point out the hypocrisy of people questoning some riders, even demanding them to admit past wrongdoings while continueing to look the other way with their own favourite riders.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

Valverde doesn't need to admit to anything. Doping was part of the sport, he played by those rules. In his head there's no wrong doing. He started his career in a dope fueled cycling and continued to do what was needed to win until he was caught. What amazes me is how can anybody think that he has gone cold turkey when he came back. He is the same or better after the suspension, he becomes better with age, he is 38. It defies logic to think that today Valverde is riding pan y agua.

I was more trying to point out the hypocrisy of people questoniong some riders, even demanding them to admit past wrongdoings while continueing to look the other way with their own favourite riders.

Don't get me wrong

I am salty about the wheelsucking mostly

 

[nayr497]

Wow, upon seeing the results, VERY happy I didn't spend any time trying to track down a live feed, or watching the race. Wow. Valverde.

 

[Breh]

Re:

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

Merckx tested positive but nobody cares

 

[Huapango]

Re: Re:

Michel Wuyts and Christophe Vandegoor sound quite sour on Sporza btw, saying that Valverde keeping silent is a sign of "old cycling" and that he has to admit his previous wrongdoings. They as journalists should be demand the same from the Belgian riders from the "old cycling" era, but they are too far up the butt of Boonen that they never will. The doctors of Quickstep are never questioned, yet those of Sky always are.

The Dutch are the same though, the only guy willing to question the performances of low-countries cyclists is Thijs Zonneveld. No wonder Lefevere hates him.

Merckx tested positive but nobody cares

Valverde winning worlds is better than Froome winning the TDF (or Wiggins & GT). I can tolerate S. Yates.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Well, at least Valverde has served his ban. Plenty of other clinic stars haven't and still win. I couldn't abide the man a few years ago but I have grown to respect and even like hime as a race now. He really is a bike racer .... unfortunately, that probably means doper. I love Bardet to bits ... and have always assumed him to be clean ... but he was just a gnat's chuff away from beating Bala today ... so, you know...

Never fired by his team, was still being paid and could make use of their training facilities. Not to mention he wasn't even banned for a full 2 years while he had one of the most serious infractions ever in the history of the sport. Never apologised or admitted guilt.

He was part of Kelme, the most disgusting team in the history of the sport.

???

Blood doping, EPO and other stuff were found in the blood bags. Can you think of more serious doping offense than that?

I never claimed it was an isolated case however.

 

[Blanco]

Re: Re:

Well, at least Valverde has served his ban. Plenty of other clinic stars haven't and still win. I couldn't abide the man a few years ago but I have grown to respect and even like hime as a race now. He really is a bike racer .... unfortunately, that probably means doper. I love Bardet to bits ... and have always assumed him to be clean ... but he was just a gnat's chuff away from beating Bala today ... so, you know...

Never fired by his team, was still being paid and could make use of their training facilities. Not to mention he wasn't even banned for a full 2 years while he had one of the most serious infractions ever in the history of the sport. Never apologised or admitted guilt.

He was part of Kelme, the most disgusting team in the history of the sport.

???

Blood doping, EPO and other stuff were found in the blood bags. Can you think of more serious doping offense than that?

I never claimed it was an isolated case however.

It was only one blood bag, you clearly don't know what a hell are you talking about!

 

[roundabout]

and among the 8 out of 99 which had EPO in it

 

[samhocking]

His legacy will be tainted by the non-admission and denial in my mind. It's obviously too late now even if he wanted to repair all the damage he caused cycling. He will remembered by many as a great bike rider, but who never redeemed himself, just like Contador in may ways.

Take Michael Woods recent comments to the media:
"You only talk about the golden generation - Valverde, Contador, Sanchez. Valverde was Busted in Operation Peurto, Contador a positive test and now Sammy Sanchez. Golden Generation? You know, I wish these guys would just disappear"!

 

[Puckfiend]

How exactly did he "damage cycling"?

 

[Benotti69]

Re:

How exactly did he "damage cycling"?

Same way Sky have, positive tests, lies, testosterone patches, etc....

That is what Sam wanted to say.

Only thing that can damage the sport now is the outing of motors ammongst the pros and well the UCI have already thought of that by introducing eMTB to head people off and say look over here at this exciting racing......while everyone says "Motors" and switches over to MotoGP

 

[movingtarget]

His legacy will be tainted by the non-admission and denial in my mind. It's obviously too late now even if he wanted to repair all the damage he caused cycling. He will remembered by many as a great bike rider, but who never redeemed himself, just like Contador in may ways.

Take Michael Woods recent comments to the media:
"You only talk about the golden generation - Valverde, Contador, Sanchez. Valverde was Busted in Operation Peurto, Contador a positive test and now Sammy Sanchez. Golden Generation? You know, I wish these guys would just disappear"!

A bit like Vino......at least Kohl and Jaksche made admissions. But the so called Operation Puerto investigative non event is still reverberating today and wasn't it only cyclists. Some high profile footballers can probably count their blessings as well that the most damning evidence and all of the physical evidence wasn't admissable.

 

[Blanco]

His legacy will be tainted by the non-admission and denial in my mind. It's obviously too late now even if he wanted to repair all the damage he caused cycling. He will remembered by many as a great bike rider, but who never redeemed himself, just like Contador in may ways.

Take Michael Woods recent comments to the media:
"You only talk about the golden generation - Valverde, Contador, Sanchez. Valverde was Busted in Operation Peurto, Contador a positive test and now Sammy Sanchez. Golden Generation? You know, I wish these guys would just disappear"!

Michael Woods?! A guy who came out of nowhere and finished hardest one day race in years on the podium! A guy who rides for Jonathan Vaughters team Maybe he would like Jonathan to disappear also?
Seriously, you need credibility to talk about such riders, you need to carry some weight in your name. Only champions should speak about champions, not some freaking Michael Woods!

 

[Singer01]

His legacy will be tainted by the non-admission and denial in my mind. It's obviously too late now even if he wanted to repair all the damage he caused cycling. He will remembered by many as a great bike rider, but who never redeemed himself, just like Contador in may ways.

Take Michael Woods recent comments to the media:
"You only talk about the golden generation - Valverde, Contador, Sanchez. Valverde was Busted in Operation Peurto, Contador a positive test and now Sammy Sanchez. Golden Generation? You know, I wish these guys would just disappear"!

Michael Woods?! A guy who came out of nowhere and finished hardest one day race in years on the podium! A guy who rides for Jonathan Vaughters team Maybe he would like Jonathan to disappear also?
Seriously, you need credibility to talk about such riders, you need to carry some weight in your name. Only champions should speak about champions, not some freaking Michael Woods!

So we close the clinic down now then? As far as i'm aware nobody on here, those who throw around insinuations like confetti, have won jack.

 

[LaFlorecita]

His legacy will be tainted by the non-admission and denial in my mind. It's obviously too late now even if he wanted to repair all the damage he caused cycling. He will remembered by many as a great bike rider, but who never redeemed himself, just like Contador in may ways.

Take Michael Woods recent comments to the media:
"You only talk about the golden generation - Valverde, Contador, Sanchez. Valverde was Busted in Operation Peurto, Contador a positive test and now Sammy Sanchez. Golden Generation? You know, I wish these guys would just disappear"!

Thanks for proving exactly why I dislike Michael Woods and the rest of that new, clean cycling Vaughters North American smug little club. I was almost starting to think this was just another irrational dislike.

Edit: can you post a source for these comments?

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Yep, that golden Italian generation with Rebellin, Bettini, Simoni, Alessandro Petacchi, Stefano Garzelli, Leonardo Piepoli and Paolo Savoldelli was way better than that golden Spanish generation. And of course, that golden American generation with Armstrong, Leipheimer, Hincapie, Landis and Hamilton might have been tainted, but thank goodness we got some more trustworthy riders in the following generation with Vande Velde, Danielson and Zabriskie... [/sarcasm] we have to remember that these were the Spanish 'golden generation' because they were the ones that had to rebuild Spanish cycling after Puerto flushed away the preceding generation with Heras, Sevilla, Mancebo, Gil, Casero, Terminaitor and so on. There's also five years' age gap between Samu and Alberto, you may as well throw Sastre and Mosquera in there too. And Cobo too, he's older than Contador.

Besides, what does Purito have to do to merit a mention alongside them, Rusty?