Paris-Nice 2017, 5th-12th March

[spalco]

In a weird way I think Contador making these old-school attacks and NOT succeeding makes it even more impressive, because he keeps trying anyway; despite being a mere human and not some super-mutant cyborg like Sagan. Which makes his efforts even more memorable to me.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

It made sense for De La Cruz to work since he won the stage, but Bahrein worked to get a 4th place.

 

[Simurgh]

Re: Re:

Do people here not watch much cycling? Teams/riders work together for many different aims and today was no different. The way some are posting today reminds me of all the hate Gallopin was getting last year in this race when he was working to protect his place in the GC and in turn Thomas held onto the race lead by getting the tow. It's cycling people!!!

Gallopin did it because he "preferred" Thomas winning. Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Why would he sit in behind Thomas, just to make him lose? Also, WT points are important, even for 8th place.

His 8th place wasn't threatened by Contador (2nd GC), Wellens (14th GC, 3 minutes behind) or Porte (3rd GC), who were the front group, so yeah, he could take it easy, and counter a Yates or Bardet attack, the threats to his 8th place

 

[StryderHells]

Re: Re:

Do people here not watch much cycling? Teams/riders work together for many different aims and today was no different. The way some are posting today reminds me of all the hate Gallopin was getting last year in this race when he was working to protect his place in the GC and in turn Thomas held onto the race lead by getting the tow. It's cycling people!!!

Gallopin did it because he "preferred" Thomas winning. Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

French riders value top 10s in races like PN.. its the french mentality

Well he was losing WorldTour points because if he hadn't chase, he would have lost his top-10.

Colbrelli, on the other hand, had nothing to gain.

Outside of the chance even if was slim of a stage win

 

[Vasilis]

Re: Re:

Do people here not watch much cycling? Teams/riders work together for many different aims and today was no different. The way some are posting today reminds me of all the hate Gallopin was getting last year in this race when he was working to protect his place in the GC and in turn Thomas held onto the race lead by getting the tow. It's cycling people!!!

Gallopin did it because he "preferred" Thomas winning. Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Why would he sit in behind Thomas, just to make him lose? Also, WT points are important, even for 8th place.

His 8th place wasn't threatened by Contador (2nd GC), Wellens (14th GC, 3 minutes behind) or Porte (3rd GC), who were the front group, so yeah, he could take it easy, and counter a Yates or Bardet attack, the threats to his 8th place

I'm pretty sure there was a group between Thomas and Contador, which contained the riders you mention, so he helped Thomas and himself get back to that group.

 

[rick james]

Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

you're wasting your time, they don't want to understand your point

 

[Simurgh]

Re: Re:

Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Well if you gave someone a choice between 8th place and 12th place for example I guess most people would take 8th place. Why would you choose 12th? I can't think of a reason to choose the worse placing honestly.

His 8th wasn't threatened by neither by Contador, Porte nor Wellens. Therefore his reason to help Thomas couldn't be to defend his own 8th place, no matter what he said after the race

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

Do people here not watch much cycling? Teams/riders work together for many different aims and today was no different. The way some are posting today reminds me of all the hate Gallopin was getting last year in this race when he was working to protect his place in the GC and in turn Thomas held onto the race lead by getting the tow. It's cycling people!!!

Gallopin did it because he "preferred" Thomas winning. Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Why would he sit in behind Thomas, just to make him lose? Also, WT points are important, even for 8th place.

His 8th place wasn't threatened by Contador (2nd GC), Wellens (14th GC, 3 minutes behind) or Porte (3rd GC), who were the front group, so yeah, he could take it easy, and counter a Yates or Bardet attack, the threats to his 8th place

Gallopin, Thomas and Henao were behind the group with guys like Yates and Bardet. Therefore he had to help the chase to catch these guys.

 

[Scarponi]

It's amazing how teams gave up in the crosswinds when if they chased they might have had a slim chance of winning the stage

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re: Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

It made sense for De La Cruz to work since he won the stage, but Bahrein worked to get a 4th place.

Matthews and Abu Dhabi also worked to then get dropped on the first sight of a slope, but thats quickly forgotten. Thats called bias which unfortunately is clouding the discussion.

As the poster Ruudzor pointed out, you'd most likely see that Contador received more help form other team than Henao did.

 

[Red Rick]

Bahrain didn't even need to work for the 4th place. There were only 3 riders up the road.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Re: Re:

Do people here not watch much cycling? Teams/riders work together for many different aims and today was no different. The way some are posting today reminds me of all the hate Gallopin was getting last year in this race when he was working to protect his place in the GC and in turn Thomas held onto the race lead by getting the tow. It's cycling people!!!

Gallopin did it because he "preferred" Thomas winning. Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Why would he sit in behind Thomas, just to make him lose? Also, WT points are important, even for 8th place.

His 8th place wasn't threatened by Contador (2nd GC), Wellens (14th GC, 3 minutes behind) or Porte (3rd GC), who were the front group, so yeah, he could take it easy, and counter a Yates or Bardet attack, the threats to his 8th place

Gallopin, Thomas and Henao were behind a group of contenders.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

It made sense for De La Cruz to work since he won the stage, but Bahrein worked to get a 4th place.

So everyone in the stage who worked apart from de la Cruz shouldn't have bothered; Contador wasted energy and worked just to get 2nd place? You don't give up chasing down a tired and fragmented three man breakaway 30 seconds up the road, on the final stage of the race, when you have the strongest sprinter. Even if the result is ultimately just 4th place.

 

[jaylew]

Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

I don't think anyone is saying that. Soler and De La Cruz certainly didn't need to work once it was clear they were going to stay away.

 

[staubsauger]

Re:

Alberto will be remembered as the most exciting GC rider in there. Sometimes it pays (Fuenté Dé) sometimes not. Chapeau !

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Well if you gave someone a choice between 8th place and 12th place for example I guess most people would take 8th place. Why would you choose 12th? I can't think of a reason to choose the worse placing honestly.

His 8th wasn't threatened by neither by Contador, Porte nor Wellens. Therefore his reason to help Thomas couldn't be to defend his own 8th place, no matter what he said after the race

Eh? It was threatened, there was a huge group ahead of Thomas containing loads of threats. He only worked up until they were neutralized. Bit of a selective memory there.

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

Calling people cancerous, aid s or asking for SKY to die is just dreadful...mods ??

Why are these coments allowed on here...everyone rode the race as they chose and that is cycling

Bravo Alberto but also great great ride by Henao who never gave up ...chapeau

if only Contador fans had 1% of his class

Did you report the comments? Or do you expect me to go back and read almost 1900 comments to find them...

I expect you to moderate and not tolerate abusive language...its not up to me to go back and point out the obvious to you ..and it was just in the more recent 20 posts

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

It made sense for De La Cruz to work since he won the stage, but Bahrein worked to get a 4th place.

Matthews and Abu Dhabi also worked to then get dropped on the first sight of a slope, but thats quickly forgotten. Thats called bias which unfortunately is clouding the discussion.

As the poster Ruudzor pointed out, you'd most likely see that Contador received more help form other team than Henao did.

Not saying that Contador didn't get help. The point of my post was that I disagree with Armchair cyclist since it made sense for De La Cruz/Soler to work while it didn't make any sense for Bahrein.

 

[Simurgh]

Re: Re:

Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

Well if you gave someone a choice between 8th place and 12th place for example I guess most people would take 8th place. Why would you choose 12th? I can't think of a reason to choose the worse placing honestly.

His 8th wasn't threatened by neither by Contador, Porte nor Wellens. Therefore his reason to help Thomas couldn't be to defend his own 8th place, no matter what he said after the race

Eh? It was threatened, there was a huge group ahead of Thomas containing loads of threats. He only worked up until they were neutralized. Bit of a selective memory there.

Not selective, but bad y'all were right about that. A lot happened that day :redface:

 

[staubsauger]

Thomas and Gallopin are pals. That's why he helped chasing. They share the same hobby I think.

 

[Ruudz0r]

Re: Re:

Wow a lot of butt hurt fans.

In reality I think Contador had more help from other teams than Henao over the stage.
Matthews started riding with Contador while Contador needed it most, if Matthews had not done that the COntador group likely would not have made it and Matthews could have sprinted for the win. And the UAE guys helped Contador for no real reason as Ulissi himself was also pulling and because of that could not stay with the group. De la Cruz also took pulls to take Soler back but that was logical as it was for his own gains.
Henao had help from a rider from Delko for a bit (till Henao decided to drop back to the group with Seb Henao and Nieve) and in the end a bit from the Bahrain guys who had a reason to ride (though the chances of getting back were obviously very slim).

A great race and in the end a deserved winner (Contador would deserve it as well ofc)

I think you'd end up making that conclusion rewatching the stage being neutral, actually.

The big mistake was that Trek didn't get ONE rider in the break. That would most likely have swung it in Contador's favour.

I agree Contador received some help, but I don't see how you're coming to the conclusion that he had more help than Henao. Contador received very brief assistance but led the way 95% of the last 50km. Henao had teammates and other parties pulling for significant portions, plus the advantage of numbers on the descent.

I was talking about help from other teams, Of course Henao his teammates are going to help him . Its a race and it was Henaos tactic to drop back and receive help from their teammates. If it was a man to man fight Contador would have won, but this aint a 50 km time trial its a road race.
Henao wasnt helped much by other teams but it was just in the end (and a bit by the Delko guy before) which is remembered most as there the time was pulled back. COntador was helped more earlier on and in the end I think he received more help than Henao from peole who should not have helped them.

 

[jaylew]

Re: Re:

Calling people cancerous, aid s or asking for SKY to die is just dreadful...mods ??

Why are these coments allowed on here...everyone rode the race as they chose and that is cycling

Bravo Alberto but also great great ride by Henao who never gave up ...chapeau

if only Contador fans had 1% of his class

Did you report the comments? Or do you expect me to go back and read almost 1900 comments to find them...

I expect you to moderate and not tolerate abusive language...its not up to me to go back and point out the obvious to you ..and it was just in the more recent 20 posts

Actually, it is up to you (us) to report posts that we think violate the terms of the forum. You can't assume a mod has read an offending post whether he's been involved in the thread or not. Posts can easily be missed.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Do people here not watch much cycling? Teams/riders work together for many different aims and today was no different. The way some are posting today reminds me of all the hate Gallopin was getting last year in this race when he was working to protect his place in the GC and in turn Thomas held onto the race lead by getting the tow. It's cycling people!!!

Gallopin did it because he "preferred" Thomas winning. Why would a rider of his calibre defend a friggin' 8th in Paris-Nice?

French riders value top 10s in races like PN.. its the french mentality

Correct - As i posted last year this move also allowed Gallopin to finish over Bardet in the standards - You want to be the first French rider in GC.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

So the position of the Contador fans is that Soler and De La Cruz are morally obliged to work with Contador, but everyone in the second group is morally obliged to make Henao work alone?

It made sense for De La Cruz to work since he won the stage, but Bahrein worked to get a 4th place.

So everyone in the stage who worked apart from de la Cruz shouldn't have bothered; Contador wasted energy and worked just to get 2nd place? You don't give up chasing down a tired and fragmented three man breakaway 30 seconds up the road, on the final stage of the race, when you have the strongest sprinter. Even if the result is ultimately just 4th place.

You can't really mean this seriously. It makes sense to work if you have the chance to win, so it made sense to work for Soler and De La Cruz. Or do you want to say that Bahrein had a chance to catch the Contador group when they started to work?

 

[woodburn]

It makes sense for Bahrain to chase and try to win the stage. I don't get why they were sprinting in such an aggressive manner to contest fourth place after it was obvious the group wasn't going to be caught. But I don't think it was anything malicious against Contador.

Sometimes there are no conspiracy theories. Just differing views.