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Paris-Nice losing prestige?

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53x11 in DC

53x11 in DC

Mar 10, 2009
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Jamsque said:
I'm really fed up with people calling Cadel Evans a wheel sucker and a whiner. Granted, he did not cope very well with the media pressure that comes with being the favourite at last year's TdF, but he also had a really nasty crash and from that point onwards in the race was clearly suffering all day every day. I think that would be enough to make anyone cranky.

As for the wheelsucker comment, I can't really argue with you if you think that Cadel is not a particularly exciting racer to watch. That's your opinion and you are entitled to it, but I think you need to bear in mind that Cadel is not a superman like Armstrong and Contador who can seemingly dominate every aspect of a race. He went in to the TdF knowing that he was far from the best climber in the race, and that his team was not the strongest, so his plan from the start was to minimise his losses in the mountains and make back time in the TTs. What you call wheel-sucking I would call playing to his strengths. It would have been pointless for him to attack in the mountains, because he could never have stayed away from Menchov, Valverde, Sastre or the Schlecks.
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I agree with you 100% on Evans' tactics. They were absolutely what he needed to do to maximize his placing. He could have attacked, blown and finished 6th, or did exactly what he did and earn a well-deserved trip to the podium. Perhaps he's the Aussie "Pou Pou", though I don't think that's where he or his fans want him to be!!

Now - as for the whining...
 
Angliru

Angliru

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*G*K*S* said:
Too bad about Pauriol. I hear he's out for up to six weeks. Did you see where Veikkanen finished today? Almost dead last, 17 minutes back. If he's not sick, I look for him to be in a break away tomorrow.
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Yeah, it appears every time I give one these up and coming guys a shout out they have bad luck! I'm going to hold off on my comments on the youngsters till P-N is over (Okay after the following:) Yeah I was disappointed to hear about Pauriol. He seemed to have excellent form to make some noise, same with Veikkanen. I agree, he'll likely make his presence felt today and in later stages.

Another forum to distract me from work!:D
 
Angliru

Angliru

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53x11 in DC said:
I agree with you 100% on Evans' tactics. They were absolutely what he needed to do to maximize his placing. He could have attacked, blown and finished 6th, or did exactly what he did and earn a well-deserved trip to the podium. Perhaps he's the Aussie "Pou Pou", though I don't think that's where he or his fans want him to be!!

Now - as for the whining...
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Okay the wheel sucking comment was carried over from years past and I'll admit that he used the only tactics that he could to ensure his placing in the gc of the 2008 Tour.

The whining I can't retract. Yes he was under pressure as one of the pre-race favorites but his bizzare actions in front of the media....well they speak in a very high pitched voice for themselves. There were other riders under similar pressure that handled it with way more grace than Evans. Maybe dude just isn't media savvy and hopefully last year's public embarrassments will be a learning experience for him.
 
53x11 in DC

53x11 in DC

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Angliru - I'm going to send you a list of my least favorite client's names, names of my least favorite ex-girlfriends, a New York Yankees roster, etc. When you receive them, please start posting very positive, upbeat, optimistic comments about them in a public domain. Thanks in advance! :D
 
Angliru

Angliru

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Jamsque said:
As for the wheelsucker comment, I can't really argue with you if you think that Cadel is not a particularly exciting racer to watch. That's your opinion and you are entitled to it, but I think you need to bear in mind that Cadel is not a superman like Armstrong and Contador who can seemingly dominate every aspect of a race. He went in to the TdF knowing that he was far from the best climber in the race, and that his team was not the strongest, so his plan from the start was to minimise his losses in the mountains and make back time in the TTs. What you call wheel-sucking I would call playing to his strengths. It would have been pointless for him to attack in the mountains, because he could never have stayed away from Menchov, Valverde, Sastre or the Schlecks.
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Neither Armstrong or Contador were in the 2008 Tour so that analogy doesn't really hold water. Evans has shown that he can climb with everyone with the exception of Contador and a select few. Otherwise he is right there with the contenders in the major Tour climbs. I retracted the wheelsucker comment but I find I can't warm up to Evans because of his riding style. I think his fans like to minimize his climbing ability in comparison to others to counter any comments that are made about his lack of aggression on the climbs. Evans can obviously climb with the elite riders in grand tours if he sticks to his diesel engine style of climbing. Yes he was often isolated in the mountains but so were some of his other competitors, they just didn't whine about it like Evans did. He whined in 2007, he whined in 2008 and he will likely whine this year also when he's confronted with an even more formidable opponent in Astana than he had to deal with in the 2008 CSC trio. His consistent schtick about the weakness of his team as it compares to his opponents gets old after a while.

Obviously I'm not a fan but I still can respect his talent and his accomplishing 2 consecutive Tour 2nd places overall is impressive. I just don't get excited by the prospect of watching him race.
 
Angliru

Angliru

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53x11 in DC said:
Angliru - I'm going to send you a list of my least favorite client's names, names of my least favorite ex-girlfriends, a New York Yankees roster, etc. When you receive them, please start posting very positive, upbeat, optimistic comments about them in a public domain. Thanks in advance! :D
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53X11 my kind of voodoo is expensive. I will bill you accordingly!;)
 
Jamsque

Jamsque

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I honestly enjoy watching Evans race much more than watching Contador. I'll take a flawed rider fighting against the odds, even if he does whine a bit, over boring domination from a suspicious rider any day. I should add that I visited a stage of the Vuelta a Andalucia last year and watched Cadel attack the field on the final climb and win solo.
 
Angliru

Angliru

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Jamsque said:
I honestly enjoy watching Evans race much more than watching Contador. I'll take a flawed rider fighting against the odds, even if he does whine a bit, over boring domination from a suspicious rider any day. I should add that I visited a stage of the Vuelta a Andalucia last year and watched Cadel attack the field on the final climb and win solo.
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Using that logic, Evans having spent time on T-Mobile, a team that had a systematic program of doping, means Evans should be one of those "suspicious riders" too? That description sounds suspiciously like the boring domination from a potentially suspicious rider that you speak of. Its like a vicious cycle that has come full circle to smack you in the face.

I envy your seeing that Andalucian stage and the one time in the history of our sport that Evans actually attacked. :p (I'm kidding about the second part!)

Seriously, do you have any photos to share of the action in Andalucia?
 
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umfundisii

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What a great day of riding yesterday. I love seeing a good strong team take charge of the race; especially when it's NOT Johan and company. Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge fan of the Armstrong camp, but I love seeing good strong tactics get the better of the rest of the race. Too bad Juan "Almost won" Flecha couldn't pull it off for his teammates.

Yesterday showed that bike racing is still bike racing. If Kid Contador's gonna make up some time, he's got to get his own team involved.
 
53x11 in DC

53x11 in DC

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Angliru said:
This sounds like one of the more exciting P-N in years. Hopefully Versus will show some decent highlights come Sunday. In the meantime I'll have to be happy with the live feed.
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Are you not on cycling.tv? It's a godsend. You can watch it "as live" later, on demand.
 
Jamsque

Jamsque

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Angliru said:
Using that logic, Evans having spent time on T-Mobile, a team that had a sytematic program of doping, means Evans should be one of those "suspicious riders" too? That description sounds suspiciously like the boring domination from a potentially suspicious rider that you speak of. Its like a vicious cycle that has come full circle to smack you in the face.

I envy your seeing that Andalucian stage and the one time in the history of our sport that Evans actually attacked. :p (I'm kidding about the second part!)

Seriously, do you have any photos to share of the action in Andalucia?
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18-02-08_1437.jpg


There he is, about 300m from the line, on his own, powering to the win.
 
53x11 in DC

53x11 in DC

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I use both, and yes, I do think cycling.tv is worth the money. The hi-speed (1600bps feed is fine. I don't need to count teeth on a cog to enjoy the racing! :)
 
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ATBScott

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Lots of great comments and insight on this everyone. Also the obligatory Troll that, well, wouldn't make it a forum if we didn't have them, would it?
Anyone that uses a term like that, spelled backwards as their handle must have joined with trolling in mind and nothing more. To all the rest of you, enjoy the interaction and more in the future. As far as the topic, you don't have to have the "big names" in a race to make it exciting. Sometimes the best racing comes from a group of "no names" that are out there duking it out. As long as it's close and exciting is all that matters. This race is living up to that so far!
 
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