Paul Seixas

[Tim Cahill]

Nah, those are the exact same type of "analysts" we see accusing Pogi, the only difference is who they like more (or less).

But don’t get me wrong, I respect most opinions here (as long as they don’t involve imaginative motor theories). On the other hand, social media is a total dump, so you’ll find negative comments in pretty much every imaginable situation.

I think it's a function of all riders fans to be honest, and a large part of why anti-doping discourse on here and in other spaces ends up going round in a bit of a circle. Often genuine concerns and interesting points are drowned out by those who might use The Clinic as an extension of their own fan ships, who's interest in PED's will pique when their favourites aren't doing so well.

It was the same with Armstrong, Contador, Froome, as it will one day be with Seixas, Pogacar, Vingegaard and whoever else. I still follow and speak to some of the people who raised objections back then, many were just using antidoping as a stick to beat those they didn't like with, whatever good points they raised were often undermined by their intentions. Others had real gripes, and were engaging in good faith discussion but ended up giving up when they realised they were banging their heads against a wall.

I'm no different, and at some point most of us will have been there. I remember being outraged at how Lance kept thumping my favourite 'Big Jan Ullrich' (cleanz to this very day, framed in 2006), so I thought the best course of action, with absolutely no proof at all, was to hit the streets and tell anyone who would listen that Armstrong was on some serious tech. If you searched hard enough you could find the posts of an outraged @Samu Cuenca somewhere on the archives of a Danish newspaper, furious at the cheating antics of Alexandre Vinokurov in the 2007 Tour.

There isn't too much dirt on Seixas so far other than his comical performances and the sudden jump of his team that has been mentioned. I'm sure there's something out there, I look forward to reading some of their theories and digging around that the younger Pogacar fans experiencing loss for the first time might cook up, there could be some clinic legends amongst them. If he does end up losing that is, there could yet be another rabbit out of the hat.

 

[Cookster15]

The first thing that came to mind was how Seixas rode away off the front and beat Pogacar's best time on Mur de Huy by 3 seconds. He didn't get a lead-out on anyone's wheel.

 

[KoopaCycling]

His rise is just a tad too meteoric for my taste. But can't fight the waves i guess.
Definitely a talent crossed with being a super responder.

 

[pelotonIQ]

The performance of all Decathlon cyclists is absurd considering they don't have impressive signings . If you look at it name by name, the team is far behind the rosters of other dominant teams, but their ratio is that of a team full of stars.

Their names are not famous but Decathlon domestiques have had decent placings in big one-day races. They are not scrubs. But also of course there has been a moment where if Seixas had better domestiques he could have won stage 4 in Itzulia race for example.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

If you searched hard enough you could find the posts of an outraged @Samu Cuenca somewhere on the archives of a Danish newspaper, furious at the cheating antics of Alexandre Vinokurov in the 2007 Tour.

If anyone does manage to find that blog post, I would like to know if it's somewhat coherent or if it just comes across as some whiny rambling from a 14 year old boy who was angry because Haimar Zubeldia and Kim Kirchen had been denied the chance of winning a Tour stage. I very much fear it's the latter, so please don't go look for it!

 

[Ilmaestro99]

The key is just to support only *** riders, and then you can freely accuse the good ones of doping.

 

[MountainGoatW]

He is slower than Valverde and Alaphillippe, he is definitely cleans.

Seriously though, this is some insane progression that has no close precedent, I am actually shocked how the entire team took a massive leap after ditching AG2R and Lavenu

I agree that also the team has taken a leap, but you really don't have to look that far away to see a close precedent. We all remember Pog after hooking up with Gianetti&UAE in 18/19 and then again when he learned to "train" at the tender age of 25 in the few winter months of 23/24. We also can't forget Vinge the Fishmans transformation. So post Covid it has been happening a lot, it is an arms race and there is some new juice and/or some, if i dare to say, sophisticated e-assistance going around, which makes the guy riding a petrostate owned bike the biggest suspect.

Not so fond of Seixas and his rise either, but at least he has been considered a super talent for some time already. Almost the only anomalies in this context are Pog and Vinge, from semi/promising talents to world beaters after joining the right team and people. Maybe i am just too skeptical knowing cyclings history, but for me it is not hard to connect the dots here. Vinge at least is not a PR-golden boy, but with Poggie they really have made it look perfect, so that most of the social media generation just accepts as it is, you can really beat everyone, all year round, on every parcour, when ever you feel like it and with not really having fatigue or a limit. Saunier-Duval(Gianetti&Matxin) really learned their lesson and with some serious money&influence(corruption) this is what you get.

 

[burning]

I agree that also the team has taken a leap, but you really don't have to look that far away to see a close precedent. We all remember Pog after hooking up with Gianetti&UAE in 18/19 and then again when he learned to "train" at the tender age of 25 in the few winter months of 23/24. We also can't forget Vinge the Fishmans transformation. So post Covid it has been happening a lot, it is an arms race and there is some new juice and/or some, if i dare to say, sophisticated e-assistance going around, which makes the guy riding a petrostate owned bike the biggest suspect.

Not so fond of Seixas and his rise either, but at least he has been considered a super talent for some time already. Almost the only anomalies in this context are Pog and Vinge, from semi/promising talents to world beaters after joining the right team and people. Maybe i am just too skeptical knowing cyclings history, but for me it is not hard to connect the dots here. Vinge at least is not a PR-golden boy, but with Poggie they really have made it look perfect, so that most of the social media generation just accepts as it is, you can really beat everyone, all year round, on every parcour, when ever you feel like it and with not really having fatigue or a limit. Saunier-Duval(Gianetti&Matxin) really learned their lesson and with some serious money&influence(corruption) this is what you get.

The "first" leap that you mentioned is not that shocking, considering Pogacar was on a random Slovenian conti team and was climbing with good climbers in the 2018 Tour of Slovenia. The entire UAE team took a huge jump in 2024 though, they basically wiped out their Tour team except Adam Yates.

Pogacar was definitely on people's radar for at least since 2017, and was mentioned as a big-shot during early 2018: https://u23cyclingzone.wordpress.com/2018/03/09/get-to-know-tadej-pogacar/

 

[MountainGoatW]

The "first" leap that you mentioned is not that shocking, considering Pogacar was on a random Slovenian conti team and was climbing with good climbers in the 2018 Tour of Slovenia. The entire UAE team took a huge jump in 2024 though, they basically wiped out their Tour team except Adam Yates.

Pogacar was definitely on people's radar for at least since 2017, and was mentioned as a big-shot during early 2018: https://u23cyclingzone.wordpress.com/2018/03/09/get-to-know-tadej-pogacar/

Yes very true and he was on his way to be a good stage racer with a good ceiling for development. Nothing was suggesting to the super human things we are seeing now thought. I don't believe that MDVP, WVA etc. are clean either, but come on...all the sudden this Slovenian semi talented allrounder beats the biggest talents of the generation on their own terrain and also does Tour, Giro etc. on autoplay mode. All this after hooking up with Gianetti, Matxin&Co and UAE. It just smells like bs like nothing I have witnessed in cycling since the past 30 years.

 

[Unchained]

My theory is that last year we saw Del Toro's physical prime. He may improve in consistency with age, and his level, but his physical peak for his age was last year.

Nowhere close

 

[Unchained]

The first thing that came to mind was how Seixas rode away off the front and beat Pogacar's best time on Mur de Huy by 3 seconds. He didn't get a lead-out on anyone's wheel.

I am wondering which race you guys are talking about? I don't have a clue, I can't find any race he did as described this year, in Fleche Wallon, he barely squirted off the front with @300 meters to go was part of a group of @30-40 with 20 k to go.. No pushing, no selection, he just beat @3-4 riders in a @5-600 meter drag race were he outlasted them on steep uphill finish. The other @199.2 k he was another racer..if anything he made dozens of others filled with confidence as they were able to hang with the new it kid, new wonderboy..he was very impressive in the last 1 k of the 200k race, with 6-8 obvious standouts sitting out the event..

 

[burning]

Yes very true and he was on his way to be a good stage racer with a good ceiling for development. Nothing was suggesting to the super human things we are seeing now thought. I don't believe that MDVP, WVA etc. are clean either, but come on...all the sudden this Slovenian semi talented allrounder beats the biggest talents of the generation on their own terrain and also does Tour, Giro etc. on autoplay mode. All this after hooking up with Gianetti, Matxin&Co and UAE. It just smells like bs like nothing I have witnessed in cycling since the past 30 years.

I think we disagree on the phrase of "semi talented", I actually think he is a talented guy that is a super-responder and UAE upgraded their program between 2023 and 2024.

 

[the asian]

The "first" leap that you mentioned is not that shocking, considering Pogacar was on a random Slovenian conti team and was climbing with good climbers in the 2018 Tour of Slovenia. The entire UAE team took a huge jump in 2024 though, they basically wiped out their Tour team except Adam Yates.

Pogacar was definitely on people's radar for at least since 2017, and was mentioned as a big-shot during early 2018: https://u23cyclingzone.wordpress.com/2018/03/09/get-to-know-tadej-pogacar/

Pogi and Team UAE changed coaches in 2024. Moved from Inigo San Milan to Javier Sola.

 

[Unchained]

Look the ultra dodgy thing about Seixas is that allegedly Macron is already working to keep him under French propaganda employ, and not the beating of a few pubcrawlers in Belgium.

Yeah, the president should stick to the subjects he's familiar with and cycling is not among them.
It's clear that moving to UAE and learning from the GOAT is the best for the youngster.

It would appear that people don't pay attention to a major component of the cycling business model, governments spend millions, hundreds of millions over the years using cycling and other sporting events as part of tourism campaign.
France is unusually one of or the top spot. Is it bike racing? TDF? Probably not the main attraction, but landmarks, food, culture, museums, beaches, mountains and sports are all part of somebody's ideal vacation or buying a place in France because where they live has no sun, bunch of cold rain and @@@@@ food and boxed wine.
The French President showing interest in a national attraction, no matter how new it is, still a teenager can be looked at as intelligent, forward thinking by many.
If you watch lots of bike races on Eurosport, many ( too many) TV commercials are for tourism, Turkey, Portugal, parts of Italy and Spain, those countries even focus commercials on specific regions of the country. Croatia spends lots of money telling people that they are bike friendly.
Most bike racing TV production and writing has major tourism element to majority of the broadcast, with graphics at the ready and blurbs about famous churches, castles, government buildings, other landmarks and helicopter pilot and camera crews have flight path that has them hover over some church or garden while a graphic pops up.. It's a part of almost every race, might just be that some watching don't know they are being actively marketed while following a bike race.
If there is some way that the French President can influence a young French promising sports star to race for a French team what an intelligent, prudent decision for France and French business,

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/most-visited-countries

 

[Unchained]

The first thing that came to mind was how Seixas rode away off the front and beat Pogacar's best time on Mur de Huy by 3 seconds. He didn't get a lead-out on anyone's wheel.

Did he ride solo for more than @600 meters?

View: https://m.youtube.com/shorts/XpCXKWyS5p4

I guess in my definition is nobody is in the picture with you, no other rider( dozen+) are anywhere near you..
What were other riders times, if people are overwhelmingly impressed with 3 seconds, what about all those guys right behind Seixas, mass awesome performance.. Seixas won by a few meters but everyone else was flying also..the selection looks like @20 riders

 

[ColonelKidneyBeans]

Pogi and Team UAE changed coaches in 2024. Moved from Inigo San Milan to Javier Sola.

Which created kind of a funny situation, since they were hailing San Millan as a genius with his "Z2" and using him as the explanation for pog already impressive performances before 2024. The narrative switch was... not self consistent.

Pogacar was already looking imperial in 2023 before is Liege crash anyway (First RVV victory, Amstel/Fleche, PN with 3 stages while cruising...)

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Pogacar was already looking imperial in 2023 before is Liege crash anyway (First RVV victory, Amstel/Fleche, PN with 3 stages while cruising...)

It's true his RVV was by far his best one-day race at that time. IMO the first ET classic by him (considering he beat peak MVP). Without the setback I think he would've been really close to Vingegaard for the whole Tour (he was for 16 stages): likely he would've lost but by a small margin (Combloux ITT was superb by Vingo and Pog wouldn't have hurt him on Loze anyway).

 

[canina82]

It's true his RVV was by far his best one-day race at that time. IMO the first ET classic by him (considering he beat peak MVP). Without the setback I think he would've been really close to Vingegaard for the whole Tour (he was for 16 stages): likely he would've lost but by a small margin (Combloux ITT was superb by Vingo and Pog wouldn't have hurt him on Loze anyway).

And he would probably smash LBL in 2023. He was very dominant that spring too.
If we don't count the TTT in PN, he won 12 races out of 17 races before LBL. Win rate = 71%.

 

[Escarabajo]

I thought that Seixas was Portuguese?

Oh well, this thread has 8 pages already. It will increase by the days.

 

[carolina]

I thought that Seixas was Portuguese?

Oh well, this thread has 8 pages already. It will increase by the days.

His grandfather is portuguese.

 

[Notarobot]

19 and already on the magic stuff.

 

[Abedfo]

At least its a battle at the front now.

 

[hq87]

13 seconds faster on the redoute for both of the aliens today. Seems legit

 

[Ilmaestro99]

Does anyone want to teach me some stuff about gene doping. Even with a top programme I don't understand how a 19yo does this?

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I was right a few days back: new mutant on the block!
The kid is an absolute monster, by far the best U20 I've seen.
One year after being a promising junior, the guy is going toe to toe with the best rider since Merckx (whose clinical reputation is legendary!).