Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be banned?

[SafeBet]

Would be cool to have power meters delivering live data to the audience, but not to the athletes.
Not gonna happen though.

 

[memyselfandI]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like this. Using powermeter gives something but there's too much variables in racing situations that you may say you have upper hand to the race if you have powermeter.

You must ban teams, team tactics if you want race 'to live again'. I see problem in a different level teams, different team builds, different goal scenarios.

edit: not a 'problem' in different level teams aso but you can not win a team like SKY with a team like Tinkoff for example. Not even without powermeter :lol:

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like that.

Tell that to Nibali, and Contador.

http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/08/news/contador-quintana-want-power-meters-banned-racing_419500/amp

 

[vedrafjord]

Apparently the UCI is about to scrap the 3:1 rule: http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest-news/uci-set-to-scrap-rule-limiting-aero-bike-design-281563

The immediate impact is we're likely to see a ton of new aero/TT bikes in the next year. This (and rumours about the 6.8kg limit being lowered) also seems to signal that the UCI is not going to be as concerned about regulating technical developments as it has been in the past.

In this climate, plus Shimano power meters coming to a shop near you next year, I see a power meter ban being very unlikely.

 

[veji11]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like this. Using powermeter gives something but there's too much variables in racing situations that you may say you have upper hand to the race if you have powermeter.

You must ban teams, team tactics if you want race 'to live again'. I see problem in a different level teams, different team builds, different goal scenarios.

edit: not a 'problem' in different level teams aso but you can not win a team like SKY with a team like Tinkoff for example. Not even without powermeter :lol:

No one is saying that powermeters are doing the pedalling, neither are race radios... But what we say is that powermeters, race radios, very strong teams are crutches that help keep the riders in line with the plan, help keep the race under control, robs the race of its unpredictability. This is what sucks.

 

[memyselfandI]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

Team size reduction will do dramatic change to race dynamics. Not race radio ban.

 

[red zone]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like this. Using powermeter gives something but there's too much variables in racing situations that you may say you have upper hand to the race if you have powermeter.

You must ban teams, team tactics if you want race 'to live again'. I see problem in a different level teams, different team builds, different goal scenarios.

edit: not a 'problem' in different level teams aso but you can not win a team like SKY with a team like Tinkoff for example. Not even without powermeter :lol:

No one is saying that powermeters are doing the pedalling, neither are race radios... But what we say is that powermeters, race radios, very strong teams are crutches that help keep the riders in line with the plan, help keep the race under control, robs the race of its unpredictability. This is what sucks.

they know what many are saying but they keep deflecting since the power meters benefit there favorite rider/team

i also like how they continue to greatly down play there impact but then turn around and say everything else should change but banning them , which basically shows how important they feel they are to sky

 

[King Boonen]

The problem with power meters is not that it allows you to judge your effort. Anyone who rides a bike knows that some days you can do more and some days you can do less, the power meter just tells you how much by. The only boost it can give is psychological, although this can be big in of itself.

The problem with power meters is it gives you a very easy way to judge others against yourself. As Rogers pointed out, if a rider can look down at their power meter and see that they are doing 420W when an attacker jumps off the front they know it can't be sustained. However, if they have to judge for themselves it becomes much more complicated. Am I on a bad day? Are they on a bad day and bluffing? Is that jump sustainable? Should I stay at this power or lift? Should I follow or will I blow up? How are my team doing? Can they maintain this or will I drop them? A power meter is a massive benefit when trying to judge these kind of things. This is the main problem with them. I don't think banning them is suddenly going to be the great panacea, it's possible it will do nothing, but I think it's certainly worth a try.


Personally I would also do away with HRMs and speedometers.

 

[veji11]

Re:

The problem with power meters is not that it allows you to judge your effort. Anyone who rides a bike knows that some days you can do more and some days you can do less, the power meter just tells you how much by. The only boost it can give is psychological, although this can be big in of itself.

The problem with power meters is it gives you a very easy way to judge others against yourself. As Rogers pointed out, if a rider can look down at their power meter and see that they are doing 420W when an attacker jumps off the front they know it can't be sustained. However, if they have to judge for themselves it becomes much more complicated. Am I on a bad day? Are they on a bad day and bluffing? Is that jump sustainable? Should I stay at this power or lift? Should I follow or will I blow up? How are my team doing? Can they maintain this or will I drop them? A power meter is a massive benefit when trying to judge these kind of things. This is the main problem with them. I don't think banning them is suddenly going to be the great panacea, it's possible it will do nothing, but I think it's certainly worth a try.

Personally I would also do away with HRMs and speedometers.

+1 it robs the race of a big part of its psychological aspect : uncertainty creates stress and stress for the riders is what can lead to mistakes, bad decisions and even sometimes just bad legs. Powermeters, cardios, race radios are crutches, pratical but also psychological crutches that take away from the man to man combat on the road.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Red Hook Crit stage racing... It could be awesome (at least a front brake should be fitted though...).

Who in the peleton would sign up for this without batting an eye, Laurens ten Dam and Mark Cavendish maybe?

Must be a few nutters up for it, it might even make me take up racing

 

[Isaak-Gabriel]

To me, many people - including great cyclists - are obsessed, even frustrated concerning Froome, and this attitude is quite unhealthy because it's not the good way to enjoy a race; this polemic doesn't smell good. Technology isn't made for getting back in years, whole riders got power meters and are satisfied by this, so the problem is away. In cycling history, each element of bike was a subject of debate but everyone was finally agreed to tell that this sport and all the riders were the real winners thanks to these innovations. A guy like Froome sufers a lot, realise the same sacrifices than others riders to be in top shape, he mustn't be the scapegoat of cycling. I call this hypocrisy.

 

[myrideissteelerthanyours]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like this. Using powermeter gives something but there's too much variables in racing situations that you may say you have upper hand to the race if you have powermeter.

You must ban teams, team tactics if you want race 'to live again'. I see problem in a different level teams, different team builds, different goal scenarios.

edit: not a 'problem' in different level teams aso but you can not win a team like SKY with a team like Tinkoff for example. Not even without powermeter :lol:

That wont be enough. If the wrong rider wins or the wrong nationality they will continue to change the rules since the idea is to manipulate the outcome of the race to make it more entertaining for a vocal minority.

 

[memyselfandI]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like this. Using powermeter gives something but there's too much variables in racing situations that you may say you have upper hand to the race if you have powermeter.

You must ban teams, team tactics if you want race 'to live again'. I see problem in a different level teams, different team builds, different goal scenarios.

edit: not a 'problem' in different level teams aso but you can not win a team like SKY with a team like Tinkoff for example. Not even without powermeter :lol:

That wont be enough. If the wrong rider wins or the wrong nationality they will continue to change the rules since the idea is to manipulate the outcome of the race to make it more entertaining for a vocal minority.

Funny thing too, how long we've had powermeters on top teams top athletes and now it's a problem. Years and years before Team Sky and no trouble at all :lol:

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann

It's such a stupid way to think that banning powermeters really change things that much. I guess there's not many racing cyclists here when everyone is claiming things like this. Using powermeter gives something but there's too much variables in racing situations that you may say you have upper hand to the race if you have powermeter.

You must ban teams, team tactics if you want race 'to live again'. I see problem in a different level teams, different team builds, different goal scenarios.

edit: not a 'problem' in different level teams aso but you can not win a team like SKY with a team like Tinkoff for example. Not even without powermeter :lol:

That wont be enough. If the wrong rider wins or the wrong nationality they will continue to change the rules since the idea is to manipulate the outcome of the race to make it more entertaining for a vocal minority.

Funny thing too, how long we've had powermeters on top teams top athletes and now it's a problem. Years and years before Team Sky and no trouble at all :lol:

I really expect you to know why less fuss was made pre-team SKY domination. If any help is needed, it might be the fact that their domination and slow strangulation of the Tour is partly based on this use of power meters.

 

[meat puppet]

Re:

The problem with power meters is not that it allows you to judge your effort. Anyone who rides a bike knows that some days you can do more and some days you can do less, the power meter just tells you how much by. The only boost it can give is psychological, although this can be big in of itself.

The problem with power meters is it gives you a very easy way to judge others against yourself. As Rogers pointed out, if a rider can look down at their power meter and see that they are doing 420W when an attacker jumps off the front they know it can't be sustained. However, if they have to judge for themselves it becomes much more complicated. Am I on a bad day? Are they on a bad day and bluffing? Is that jump sustainable? Should I stay at this power or lift? Should I follow or will I blow up? How are my team doing? Can they maintain this or will I drop them? A power meter is a massive benefit when trying to judge these kind of things. This is the main problem with them. I don't think banning them is suddenly going to be the great panacea, it's possible it will do nothing, but I think it's certainly worth a try.


Personally I would also do away with HRMs and speedometers.

Excellent post, thanks for fleshing out what in my post was lumped under "pacing" in general.

Also, I too don't think powermeters will be banned or that doing so would be a panacea. Yet inducing uncertainty, even if in small doses, would in my view improve things in a sport that is becoming more and more controlled in part due to devices such as the pm.