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Prime Lance vs. Contador ... Who Wins

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Jul 18, 2010
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ad9898 said:
Armstrong of 2000-2001 would have Contador beaten relatively easily, he could put minutes into his rivals, including Pantani, who is still lorded as probably the best pure climber, despite the dope issues.

Hautacam in 2000 stands out particularly, he dropped Pantani and Ullrich quite easily then rode across 2 mins to the best climbers in that tour (Virenque, Escartin, Jiminez), then dropped them by a minute plus.

Probably the most impressive climb in modern TdF history and IMO much better than Alpe in 2001. Contador has done nothing remotely comparable, although he's by far the most gifted rider around today.

It's common knowledge that Armstrong's focus was on the Tour alone. He'd save some energies for ToC and Tour of Georgia and still be building his form during the Dauphine. Contador typically races competitively from Paris-Nice thru the Tour. I imagine if he altered his priorities and saved all his energies for the Tour he would be even more dominant. Contrast that with Andy Schleck who shows up during the Ardennes and the Tour and then vanishes.
 
Jul 18, 2010
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flicker said:
Alberto needed to cheat in 2010 to beat Lance in 2010. I speculate that his entire Astana team were charged.

Contador on a big wheel would've beaten the tarmac obsessed Armstrong of 2010. Armstrong spent more time kissing the pavement than ACF does kissing a certain rider's bootay.;)
 
Oct 11, 2010
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Race Radio said:
Very few riders hit 60 and with Plasma expanders, drips, and advanced notice of testing it is easy to make 55 look like 49.5

Still some did (Pantani, Riis to name just a few) so you could take as much as you wanted before the 50% threshold. After the 50% rule you could not. So again, he could not take "all the drugs he wanted, whenever he wanted."
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Altitude said:
Still some did (Pantani, Riis to name just a few) so you could take as much as you wanted before the 50% threshold. After the 50% rule you could not. So again, he could not take "all the drugs he wanted, whenever he wanted."

No exactly. Riis' got his nickname of Mr. 60% from Virenque who figured to climb that fast he must be at 60%. The Festina riders were no allowed to be over 55% According to the Conconi Files Riis' HCT ranged from 41-56%.

Pantani had some High Hct's measured after a crash and a loss of blood but one of his most dominate performance was in the 99 Giro where the 50% level was in place. He only tested 52% on the next to last stage of the race.

Advanced notice of "Surprise" out of competition testing is huge. it opens up a wide variety of PED's that are great for building muscle and losing weight.
 
May 26, 2010
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Race Radio said:
No exactly. Riis' got his nickname of Mr. 60% from Virenque who figured to climb that fast he must be at 60%. The Festina riders were no allowed to be over 55% According to the Conconi Files Riis' HCT ranged from 41-56%.

Pantani had some High Hct's measured after a crash and a loss of blood but one of his most dominate performance was in the 99 Giro where the 50% level was in place. He only tested 52% on the next to last stage of the race.

Advanced notice of "Surprise" out of competition testing is huge. it opens up a wide variety of PED's that are great for building muscle and losing weight.

as is waiting 20 minutes for the rider to shower....:D
 

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Aug 17, 2009
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La Pandera said:
Contador on a big wheel would've beaten the tarmac obsessed Armstrong of 2010. Armstrong spent more time kissing the pavement than ACF does kissing a certain rider's bootay.;)

that is true however berto was on a little more than a big wheel in the 2010 TdF. Berto was obsecivly chasing my lords record
 
Oct 11, 2010
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Race Radio said:
No exactly. Riis' got his nickname of Mr. 60% from Virenque who figured to climb that fast he must be at 60%. The Festina riders were no allowed to be over 55% According to the Conconi Files Riis' HCT ranged from 41-56%.

Pantani had some High Hct's measured after a crash and a loss of blood but one of his most dominate performance was in the 99 Giro where the 50% level was in place. He only tested 52% on the next to last stage of the race.

Advanced notice of "Surprise" out of competition testing is huge. it opens up a wide variety of PED's that are great for building muscle and losing weight.

Pantani:

June 1994-- 58%
July 1994-- 57.4%
May 1995-- 57.6%
October 1995-- 60.1%

Difficult to imagine that Marco was the only one. Anyhow this is getting into a different discussion entirely.
 
Mar 18, 2009
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Altitude said:
Still some did (Pantani, Riis to name just a few) so you could take as much as you wanted before the 50% threshold. After the 50% rule you could not. So again, he could not take "all the drugs he wanted, whenever he wanted."

Okay, in the face of your continued (and perhaps a bit pedantic) objection, I will concede that my claim that Lance could take "all the drugs he wanted, whenever he wanted" may be a slight (but only a slight) exaggeration. I will, however, stick by my statement that if you put Contador on Lance's Ferrari program, he would be able to climb as fast a a bicycle duct-taped to the space shuttle. I know this is sheer hypothesis, since Alberto would never openly admit to being on any program, let alone Ferrari's, and NASA would never let anyone duct tape a bike to the shuttle (and I don't think any launches are scheduled for a while anyway), but theoretically, I feel quite strongly that the hypothesis is valid.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Altitude said:
Pantani:

June 1994-- 58%
July 1994-- 57.4%
May 1995-- 57.6%
October 1995-- 60.1%

Difficult to imagine that Marco was the only one. Anyhow this is getting into a different discussion entirely.

Festinia, Buckler, TVM and other teams put limits on the upper ranges of riders Hct. The introduction of the 50% level did little to slow down Pantani......perhaps that was because of his Doctor, Dr. Ferrari, or that he also got advanced notice of OOC testing.
 
Jun 25, 2009
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Five best VAM's

Lance Armstrong

Average grade under 9.0 %

1. VAM 1746 m/h, Hautacam, Tour 2000
2. VAM 1739 m/h, Alpe d'Huez, Tour 2004
3. VAM 1738 m/h, Luz Ardiden, Tour 2003
4. VAM 1722 m/h, La Mongie, Tour 2002
5. VAM 1720 m/h, Alpe d'Huez, Tour 2001

Average: VAM 1733 m/h

Alberto Contador

Average grade under 9.0 %

1. VAM 1855 m/h, Verbier, Tour 2009
2. VAM 1694 m/h, Plateau de Beille, Tour 2007
3. VAM 1687 m/h, Col de la Colombiere, Tour 2009
4. VAM 1676 m/h, Arcalis, Tour 2009
5. VAM 1653 m/h, Ax-3-Domaines, Tour 2010

Average: VAM 1713 m/h
 
Wallace said:
...and NASA would never let anyone duct tape a bike to the shuttle (and I don't think any launches are scheduled for a while anyway), but theoretically, I feel quite strongly that the hypothesis is valid.

Don't forget to use Ventoux instead of Alpe d'Huez. I think the shuttle would have a difficult time negotiating all those turns...
 

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