Race Design Challenge

[Brullnux]

LA CENTESIMA FINAL STAGE: CASTELLANIA - MILANO

The final stage starts in the home town of Il Campionissimo. The greatest of all Giro champions: Fausto Coppi. While not as angelic or as good an off-the-bike role model, he was an incredible cyclist, winning the Giro 5 times. So why not dedicate a start of a stage to him? The first TV is in Tortona, where he grew up and had his first job.

After a long exploration of the southern Po valley, we arrive in Pavia, the home of one the best unis in Italy.

Then we reach Milan. After a short trip of Milan, passing in front of the Duomo, Scala and Via Solferino, HQ of the Gazza before doing our circuit.

I hope you enjoyed my Giro, after a sprint/late break teh Giro will be complete.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re: Re:

3 sprinter stages - I like it.

The only thing I dont particularly like is the your ITT. I think it could have been a little more flat considering the amount of mountain stages and your big mountain ITT. And Im not too fond of your Finestre-stage, but apart from that (I dont consider the cultural-thingy you guys seem to rate highly) I like it super much

I would have made it longer but there is a rule that says I must not do a TT longer than 25 k's on the last day when my transfer was longer than 75 kilometers. Barmaher has the advantage that he could made the TT harder by putting a mountain at the end, which unfortunately is impossible in Milan.
Yeah I'm also not sure if I maybe don't have enough TT kilometers but considering there is another flat one which is pretty long, the fact that good TTers are often good in MTT's too (as long as they can climb which should be given considering we are talking about the gc) and that there are only 3 1st category (from which only one would be HC) mtf's I think its okay.
Ps: Well there are only 3 pure sprint stages. I tried to make some which should cause a good fight between sprinters and attackers like stage 1, 10, 15, 18, maybe even 2 + 3 sprint stages means a possible number of 7 (maybe 8) bunch sprints which would actually be more than enough. But ofc the thing is that there could also only be 3 bunch sprints.

I was talking about the long hilly ITT, but its just nitpicking at that point. The real and only problem is the long false flat into Pra Martino, but you have slotted a flat stage in afterwards, so who knows.

I doubt we will see much more than 3 pure sprint stages since they you put a lot of spicy climbs at the end of a lot of stages. And I think thats how it should be, so that was a compliment

 

[Pricey_sky]

I had a feeling stage 21 was going to be a pain to score culturally with most featuring Milan!

 

[Eshnar]

Since most of you have a city circuit, I would recommend to post also the planimetry. It may be key to evaluate the stage.

 

[Brullnux]

Overview viewtopic.php?f=24&t=29806&p=1796805#p1796805

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

3 sprinter stages - I like it.

The only thing I dont particularly like is the your ITT. I think it could have been a little more flat considering the amount of mountain stages and your big mountain ITT. And Im not too fond of your Finestre-stage, but apart from that (I dont consider the cultural-thingy you guys seem to rate highly) I like it super much

I would have made it longer but there is a rule that says I must not do a TT longer than 25 k's on the last day when my transfer was longer than 75 kilometers. Barmaher has the advantage that he could made the TT harder by putting a mountain at the end, which unfortunately is impossible in Milan.
Yeah I'm also not sure if I maybe don't have enough TT kilometers but considering there is another flat one which is pretty long, the fact that good TTers are often good in MTT's too (as long as they can climb which should be given considering we are talking about the gc) and that there are only 3 1st category (from which only one would be HC) mtf's I think its okay.
Ps: Well there are only 3 pure sprint stages. I tried to make some which should cause a good fight between sprinters and attackers like stage 1, 10, 15, 18, maybe even 2 + 3 sprint stages means a possible number of 7 (maybe 8) bunch sprints which would actually be more than enough. But ofc the thing is that there could also only be 3 bunch sprints.

I was talking about the long hilly ITT, but its just nitpicking at that point. The real and only problem is the long false flat into Pra Martino, but you have slotted a flat stage in afterwards, so who knows.

I doubt we will see much more than 3 pure sprint stages since they you put a lot of spicy climbs at the end of a lot of stages. And I think thats how it should be, so that was a compliment

I think that TT looked harder than it was because emphasize of the profile was 50. I always do that in TT's because I think the profile looks better. However I will write a bit more about my route after the final score because I don't want to change the jury's mind by what I write (although I think it will mostly be self-criticism )

 

[Stromeon]

Giro di Stromeon Stage 21: Torino - Milano 151km

Although the time-trials will probably gather more technical points, I strongly dislike the idea of having a TT on the final stage of the race (I much prefer seeing riders battle it out head-to-head in the mountains for the win, and also if there is a TT at the end the riders will keep waiting and waiting hoping for a good performance on the last day, even if the TT is relatively short) and so thus I have gone for a traditional sprint finish in Milano. Although this is not as strongly an estalished tradition as a finish in Paris is in the Tour, considering that the first Giro both started and ended here and many others have in the past, it would seem wrong to me not to finish in Milano. Luckily for me, barmaher has covered Torino in great depth, and Gigs likewise with Milano, so all that's left for me to do is to is to point out that we have all that cultural awesomeness doubled and whacked together into one stage. Finish to the (hopefully) splendid and spectacular 100th Giro is, as usual, in front of the famous Duomo di Milano.


Torino:

Milano Piazza Duomo:

Have posted all the profiles in my original library post here, will try and get a summary + breakdown up tomorrow but may have time constraints!

 

[Billie]

Giro d'Italia Stage 21: Vercelli - Milano (146 km)

We've all done our best to honour the great moments from Giro history. Today I'll remember one of the more awful days in Giro History

(Sorry but I don't have the patience to click out 5 of these laps. They're completely flat.)

The run-in is quite normal for the traditional final stage. Flat which gives the riders time for the usual spumante and photo's.

Following those 70 kms is 5 local laps (15km) around Milan. It's the same lap that was used in 2009. That year the Giro finished not in Milan but visited during the second week for the 'Milano Show 100'. Unfortunately the roads were in quite bad condition and nobody was interested in racing. It was quite strange to see a crit halfway through a GT that's for sure. The lap in itself goes around Milano and ends with a long final straight where we should see all the sprinters fight it. Hopefully they've stayed in the Giro uptill now!

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Just like almost everybody else, I'm resolving my race with a sprint in Milan. And just like Billie, I'm using the 2009 circuit.

Stage 21: Novi Ligure - Milano, 141km

The main reasonings here are Novi Ligure has been selected to honour its favourite son, Costante Girardengo, one of the last campionissimi and/or icons of Italian cycling to get the treatment in the race, with Bartali, Coppi, Binda, Gimondi, Ganna and Pantani all having had their moments already. Girardengo was once so famous that it was decreed by Mussolini all trains passing through must stop in his hometown, an incredible honour at the time. Because Girardengo set up his team in the city, as well, many other great stars of the sport have been based out of the city, including Coppi; we therefore are able to start in front of the Museo dei Campionissimi, a great monument to the heroes of the bicycle. Also, we pass through Tortona, where Coppi died, early in the stage. The main crux of the stage, however, is the flat circuit in Milano, based on the original 1909 start/finish points.

 

[Finn84]

Here's what I got as distance of each Giro. I rounded every stage to nearest half-kilometre if the announced distance was something else than full or half.

Brullnux 3779,5
Barmaher 3724,5
Gigs_98 3618
Stromeon 3536
Finn84 3451
Billie 3329
Libertine Seguros 3256,5

 

[Eshnar]

Re:

Here's what I got as distance of each Giro. I rounded every stage to nearest half-kilometre if the announced distance was something else than full or half.

Brullnux 3779,5
Barmaher 3724,5
Gigs_98 3618
Stromeon 3536
Finn84 3451
Billie 3329
Libertine Seguros 3256,5

Thank you, great work I see a few people went a bit too far with the length

 

[barmaher]

My race summary is at the below link (2nd page on the topic).

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic.php?p=1796889#p1796889

Race Breakdown

3 x ITT (one downhill, one uphill, one flat and long)
6 "Flat" Stages. (3 with minimal difficulty, 3 with moderate difficulty or hills near end)
1 x Strade Bianche stage
5 x Medium mountain stages (4 with uphill finish, 1 with downhill finish)
6 x Mountain stage (3 descent finish, 2 MTF, 1 HTF)

 

[barmaher]

Re: Re:

Here's what I got as distance of each Giro. I rounded every stage to nearest half-kilometre if the announced distance was something else than full or half.

Brullnux 3779,5
Barmaher 3724,5
Gigs_98 3618
Stromeon 3536
Finn84 3451
Billie 3329
Libertine Seguros 3256,5

Thank you, great work I see a few people went a bit too far with the length

Really? I saw the regulations to say that you can have an average of 180km per stage. With 21 stages, that gives maximum total distance of 3780km. Neither Brullnux nor I had a podium, so I would have thought we were all good?

 

[Eshnar]

Re: Re:

Here's what I got as distance of each Giro. I rounded every stage to nearest half-kilometre if the announced distance was something else than full or half.

Brullnux 3779,5
Barmaher 3724,5
Gigs_98 3618
Stromeon 3536
Finn84 3451
Billie 3329
Libertine Seguros 3256,5

Thank you, great work I see a few people went a bit too far with the length

Really? I saw the regulations to say that you can have an average of 180km per stage. With 21 stages, that gives maximum total distance of 3780km. Neither Brullnux nor I had a podium, so I would have thought we were all good?

Major tours
2.6.011
The maximum length of major tours is 3500 km.

...Anyway it is a rule that have been circumvented a million times in RL, so yes you're good.

 

[barmaher]

OK, I stand corrected. Thanks.

 

[Gigs_98]

So, will we get the votes for the stage today and the votes for the route tomorrow?

 

[barmaher]

Can I just take the opportunity during this lull in proceedings to state:

The judges are great
All of my competitors (especially Gigs and Libertine) are cruel to kittens

 

[fauniera]

Best transfer: Sulden to Milano, some 250 km.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re:

Can I just take the opportunity during this lull in proceedings to state:

The judges are great
All of my competitors (especially Gigs and Libertine) are cruel to kittens

I've heard by a very reliable that Barmaher likes Gerrans.

Best transfer: Sulden to Milano, some 250 km.

Well Alp d Huez - Paris is about 600 km's

 

[Eshnar]

So, will we get the votes for the stage today and the votes for the route tomorrow?

yes, that's the idea.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Here's what I got as distance of each Giro. I rounded every stage to nearest half-kilometre if the announced distance was something else than full or half.

Brullnux 3779,5
Barmaher 3724,5
Gigs_98 3618
Stromeon 3536
Finn84 3451
Billie 3329
Libertine Seguros 3256,5

Thank you, great work I see a few people went a bit too far with the length

Sh*t, forgot about that rule

 

[fauniera]

Re: Re:

Best transfer: Sulden to Milano, some 250 km.

Well Alp d Huez - Paris is about 600 km's

Sure, but that's ahead of a meaningless parade, not an all deciding time trial. And i thought i had read about a 75 km transfer limit, but apparently there are exceptions to that. Which certainly is a good thing, as 75 km is quite tough. I do need more than that on a few occasions at my own Giro.

 

[Eshnar]

Judge 1:
Brullnux T:2/5 C:2/5
Barmaher T:4/5 C:5/5 (It works well because your final mountain stage features a hard MTF)
Gigs_98 T:3/5 C:3/5
Billie T:1/5 C:4/5
Finn84 T:3/5 C:3/5
Libertine: T:1/5 C:4/5
Stromeon T:2/5 C:2/5

Judge 2:
This was really tough and I'm sorry to those who I scored low, it's was almost impossible to split some stages. My personal preference is for a sprint on the final day so the 2 iTT's got scored the lowest.
Brullnux T:3/5 C:3/5
Barmaher T:2/5 C:2/5
Gigs98 T:2/5 C:3/5
Billie T:5/5 C:4/5
Finn84 T:4/5 C:4/5
Libertine T:4/5 C:5/5
Stromeon T:3/5 C:2/5

Judge 3:
Brullnux T:2/5 C:4/5
Barmaher T:4/5 C:5/5 (I think it's a little too long for my taste, considering you just had Pila)
Gigs_98 T:5/5 C:3/5 (Here I thought your Giro lacked a properly flat ITT... this gets you points)
Billie T:3/5 C:2/5
Finn84 T:4/5 C:2/5 (as a final sprint stage, the shorter, the better)
Libertine: T:3/5 C:3/5
Stromeon T:2/5 C:4/5

GC AFTER STAGE 21 (only the overall evaluation left):
Gigs 570
Barmaher 565
Libertine 562
Brullnux 543
Stromeon 537
Billie 498
Finn 437

Tomorrow evening there'll be the final score, along with the podium ceremony

 

[barmaher]

To the judge that reckons my ITT should be shorter; you're right. It was 13km initially. Then I got the calcio idea, which made it longer. I got greedy for cultural points. Which worked bar one judge.

Looking at others' routes now. Some real crackers

 

[Stromeon]

Number-crunching

Giro di Stromeon: Roma - Milano

Total distance: 3536km
In Italy: 3426km
In France: 110km

Longest stage: Stage 8 Chieti - Castelraimondo (238km)
Shortest road stage: Stage 14 Vigo di Fassa - Passo Pordoi (139km)

Average stage length: 168km
Average road stage length: 191km


90km of ITT: 69km flat and 21km mountainous
4 MTFs plus an MTT and a HTF at Guardiagrele



56 categorised climbs (in order of appearance, summit finish)

1 Cima Coppi (Passo dello Stelvio)

17 1st category (Rionero Sannitico, Passo della Maielletta, Sassotetto, Passo Rolle, Passo San Pellegrino, Passo Sella, Passo Valparola, Passo Giau, Passo Fedaia, Passo Pordoi, Tre Cime di Lavaredo, Passo del Mortirolo, Passo Gavia, Passo del Vivione, Colli di San Fermo, Col de Vars, Col d'Izoard)

20 2nd category (Agerola, Valico di Chiunzi, Monte Sant'Angelo, Pietransieri, Passo San Leonardo, Poggio Civitella, Passo Croce a Mori, Passo della Calla, Valico della Faggia, Passo Croce d'Aune, Passo Valles, Passo Tre Croci, Aprica, Passo della Presolana, Colle del Gallo, Colle di Nava, Colle di Casotto, Colle della Maddalena, Passo del Monginevro, Sestriere)

8 3rd category (Santopadre, Lentiscosa, Nuppolara, Croce di Casale, Crispiero, Barbotto, Passo Gardena, Colle San Bartolomeo)

10 4th category (Colli Albani, Villa Santa Lucia, Piccolo Vesuvio, Ascea, Mottola, Guardiagrele, Montepulciano, Monte Finocchio, Le Manie, San Giacomo)


Library of profiles


Some general number-crunching

Total race length:

1. Brullnux - 3776km
2. barmaher - 3725km
3. Gigs_98 - 3618km
4. Stromeon - 3536km
5. Finn84 - 3455km
6. Billie - 3329km
7. Libertine Seguros - 3257km

Average road stage length:

1. barmaher - 202km
2. Gigs_98 - 196km
3. Brullnux - 193km
4. Stromeon - 191km
5. Finn84 - 187km
6. Billie - 187km
7. Libertine Seguros - 172km

ITT kilometres:

1. Billie - 149km
2. Libertine Seguros - 120km
3. Brullnux - 109km
4. barmaher - 98km
5. Gigs_98 - 97km
6. Stromeon - 90km
7. Finn84 - 86km

MTFs (ie proper summit finishes on mountain stages):

1. Brullnux - 6
2. Finn84 - 5
3. Stromeon - 4
= Gigs_98 - 4
5. Libertine Seguros - 2
= barmaher - 2
= Billie -2

Uphill finishes (all uphill finishes including TTs)

1. Brullnux - 9
= Finn84 - 9
= barmaher - 9
4. Gigs_98 - 8
5. Stromeon - 7
= Libertine Seguros - 7
7. Billie - 5

Longest stage:

1. Billie - stage 20: Cuneo - Pinerolo (253km)
2. Brullnux - stage 19: Fenis - Torino (249km)
3. Gigs_98 - stage 17: Susa - Pinerolo (247km)
4. barmaher - stage 18: Tortona - Sanremo (244km)
5. Finn84 - stage 17: Bergamo - Passo dello Stelvio (238km)
= Stromeon - stage 8: Chieti - Castelraimondo (238km)
7. Libertine Seguros - stage 19: Susa - Cuneo (232km)

_____

Trust life that as soon as the Giro finishes I start having some free time