• The Cycling News forum is looking to add some volunteer moderators with Red Rick's recent retirement. If you're interested in helping keep our discussions on track, send a direct message to @SHaines here on the forum, or use the Contact Us form to message the Community Team.

    In the meanwhile, please use the Report option if you see a post that doesn't fit within the forum rules.

    Thanks!

Race Design Thread

Page 187 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
STAGE 8 - AX-LES-THERMES-SUPERBAGNERES

KOM: Col de Port (Cat 2), Col de la Core (Cat 1), Col du Portet d’Aspet (Cat 2), Col de Menté (Cat 1), Superbagnères (HC).



Now is the toughest stage in this year’s TdF…so far: don’t let the beautiful surroundings like the town of Seix (who doesn’t like Seix?) fool you: It’s no vacation. We should have a great Saturday stage.

Some of the previous stages provoked skirmishes, and with what’s coming tomorrow (muhahahaha!), the risk is to see little GC action until our final climb, the very tough montée to Superbagnères.



However, in the BOD, some top 10-15 contenders may either try to make up for early time losses or try to pull a Chiappucci. Again, put in today’s words, Sky will have to work.

The toughness of the climb to Superbagnères has always produced a great winner. Here are the six who prevailed on these slopes in Tour history: Massignan (’61), Bahamontes (’62), Fuente (’71), Hinault (’79), LeMond (’86), and Millar (’89). Hats off to the climber of all climbers:
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 8 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 8 PROFILE.png
    83.9 KB · Views: 612
  • STAGE 8 FINALCLIMB.jpg
    STAGE 8 FINALCLIMB.jpg
    80.7 KB · Views: 612
  • STAGE 8 FB.jpg
    STAGE 8 FB.jpg
    99 KB · Views: 611
STAGE 9 – LOURDES-PIC DE BEILLURTI

KOM: Col d’Ahusquy (Cat 1), Col de Burdincurutcheta (Cat 1), Col d’Arnostéguy (Cat 1), Pic de Beillurti (HC).



Fasten your seatbelts, or just find a good spot on the couch: we finish our Pyrenées journey with the Sunday monster stage. Who needs the Aubisque, the Tourmalet, when you have this:

It boggles my mind that these nasty, nasty climbs in an otherwise beautiful part of France keep being ignored by ASO. And being in the Pays Basque, I must pay tribute to a team and a fan base that are particularly dear to my heart: Euskaltel-Euskadi and the Basques. I hope that the team resurrects: I want to see the orange tide again.

The start takes place in Lourdes, in front of the Notre-Dame de Lourdes Basilica. No doubt that many riders will make a few prayers, hoping to survive the grueling day ahead. And then, the peloton will have 90K to think about what’s coming their way. The course offers opportunities for an all-out assault, long range attack. Yes, for the GC contenders, it’s time to show the cards. For most, it will be all about survival.

The first climb of the day is the Col d’Ahusquy, Via Alçay, up the road from Tardets-Sorholus. Some steep sections should begin the breakdown of the peloton and make the upcoming narrow roads not too big of an issue. The Col de Burdincurutcheta comes just after the descent: it’s brutal. By the time the GC group reaches the summit, many leaders will be isolated. I can’t imagine 3-4 riders from the same team in the lead group (or I move the route to The Clinic).



The descent is very sharp. No time to rest. And before reaching Estérençuby, the riders will make a left turn and climb again. Near the crossroad is the ideal vacation spot for hardcore cyclists: the Atzain Etchéa, a.k.a. Artzain Etxea. This small, comfy hotel deserves a little free advertising. It is the perfect base if you want to tackle the huge climbs nearby. And the food is amazing: lambs from the farm next door, trouts from nearby Iraty, pastries from the Artizarra bakery, local charcuterie and cheeses, and let’s not forget the good wine from Irouléguy. All of this at an affordable price. These delights may be too much of a temptation for Carlos Betancur… DNF?

The next climb is hard, but this side of the Col d’Arnostéguy is nowhere near as difficult as the Arnéguy side (that the riders will descend - see stage profile): but it’s no picnic. It will further break apart the GC group. I wouldn’t be surprised if it is less than 10 riders strong as we reach the summit. Some of the big names may be in difficulty, and the descent is super steep. Not many ways to rest and get back. And the worst is yet to come: the Pic de Beillurti.



I think we all agree: big gaps are to be expected :cool: .
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 9 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 9 PROFILE.png
    89 KB · Views: 718
  • STAGE 9 COLDEB.png
    STAGE 9 COLDEB.png
    163.2 KB · Views: 717
  • STAGE 9 PIC DE B.gif
    STAGE 9 PIC DE B.gif
    95 KB · Views: 715
Stage 10 – ROYAN-SAINT-NAZAIRE



During rest day, I can guarantee that power estimates will get analyzed, the forums will go crazy, accusations will fly, several members will get banned, and Benotti69 will send at least 200 posts a day.

For the peloton, a long stage awaits up the Atlantic coast. No way to escape it: the French geography is…what it is. And it is tempting to make stages extremely long (i.e. ’84 TdF Nantes-Bordeaux 338K – winner: Jan Raas) in order to cover the Atlantic coast asap. So I skipped Bordeaux and designed a stage that is “only” 258K long, starting in Royan, close enough for the Bordelais to pay us a visit.

This is a sprinter stage, at least for the fast guys who survived the Pyrénées. The intermediate sprint comes quite early, in Rochefort. The peloton continues on and le ravitaillement takes place in the beautiful town of Luçon.



The running to the finish will offer a spectacular sight, a marvel of modern architecture: the Bridge of Saint-Nazaire, used by the TdF on one previous occasion, in ’11.



Who wins stage 10? The poll would read Cav, Greipel, Kittel, maybe Bouhanni and/or Demare, Degenkolb, Sagan…or Vino.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 10 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 10 PROFILE.png
    30 KB · Views: 714
  • STAGE 10 LUCON.jpg
    STAGE 10 LUCON.jpg
    27.5 KB · Views: 713
  • STAGE 10 ST-N.jpg
    STAGE 10 ST-N.jpg
    91 KB · Views: 712
STAGE 11 - CARNAC-DINARD



Today’s stage begins in Carnac, featuring one of France’s most amazing sites: the stones erected by pre-Celtic natives some 6,000 years ago. The megalithic structures include rows of menhirs, dolmens, as well as several cromlechs (stone circles).



Brittany (and Normandy for that matter) tends to be left out of many TdF routes: peninsulas offer no way through. Once you commit to one of them, it could be a two-stage affair. Facing this dilemma, I chose to visit la Bretagne and caress Normandy. I did avoid the now Kardashianesque finish at the MDB. Instead, we’ll go through the town of Plouay famous for its criterium, before heading north for a booby-trapped finish.

The peloton will reach the shore near Saint-Brieuc and ride through the town of Yffiniac, birthplace of a great, ballsy champion, before heading to a place, that through the ages, has been a nightmare for ships and sailors: le Cap Fréhel . I went there on a “quiet” day, covered up, and felt naked. The wind was piercing through my coat, stabbing me between the ribs, and coming out the other side. Yikes! The peloton will have to face strong head then side winds. Bordures are very likely. On the way, helicopter views will show the breathtaking coastline and of course Fort La Latte, featured in the ’58 movie “The Vikings” with Kirk Douglas and Tony Curtis.



The stage finish in Dinard should be the stage for another sprint, but the main question is: will any of the favorites lose time in the crosswinds?
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 11 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 11 PROFILE.png
    36.6 KB · Views: 714
  • STAGE 11 CARNAC.jpg
    STAGE 11 CARNAC.jpg
    28.2 KB · Views: 714
  • STAGE 11 FLL.jpg
    STAGE 11 FLL.jpg
    146.5 KB · Views: 712
STAGE 12 – LE MONT ST-MICHEL-DEAUVILLE

KOM: Côte de la Cour de l’Arbre (Cat 4)



It may be a bit overused, but I couldn’t resist the start at Le Mont Saint-Michel. I just love this place.



And while at Le Mont Saint-Michel, there’s a must-visit: La Mère Poulard. The omelettes are absolutely fantastic, and so thick! How thick? Well, thicker than Dr. Ferrari’s and Dr. Fuentes’ address books stacked on top of each other. Unreal!



This is your typical flat/transition stage, passing through Saint-Lô and Caen.

The only categorized climb of the day is la Côte de la Cour de l’Arbre with under 20K to go. It shouldn’t disrupt the sprinters’ teams as they race towards the finish in the resort town of Deauville.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 12 MSM.jpg
    STAGE 12 MSM.jpg
    94.3 KB · Views: 712
  • STAGE 12 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 12 PROFILE.png
    38.8 KB · Views: 712
  • STAGE 12 LMP.jpg
    STAGE 12 LMP.jpg
    17.7 KB · Views: 712
STAGE 13 – NEUFCHATEL EN BRAY-VALENCIENNES



I am a big fan of a cobbled stage in the TdF. And this one comes on Friday and on stage 13, so it should be bloody as teams are weaker. The start is in Neufchâtel-en-Bray and will head to Abbeville for the first of two intermediate sprints.



We are now in “Le Nord”, home of the “Chtimis”, as the rest of the French call them. It’s not a cliché to state that the people love blue-collar sports, football/soccer and cycling, and for sure they like sharing a few (or more) beers with friends. As singer Enrico Macias eloquently sung (I translate in context), “the folks from the north have in their heart the sun that doesn’t shine in their skies”. The coal plants and factories have shut down, manufacturing has moved to China, yet the Chtimis show resiliency and hope for the future. Great people. Love. The second intermediate sprint is in Lens.

Finally, le dessert, four cobbled sections for a total of 7.3K of them in the last 20K before the finish in Valenciennes.



Sars-et-Rosières to Tilloy 2.4K +++
Tilloy-lez-Marchiennes to Brillion à 1.1K ++
Bousignies to Millonfosse 1.4K +++
Trouée d'Arenberg, 2.4K +++++ how about that, so close to the finish.

Some favorites may find bad luck on stage 13...
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 13 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 13 PROFILE.png
    55.5 KB · Views: 714
  • STAGE 13 PV.png
    STAGE 13 PV.png
    157.6 KB · Views: 714
  • STAGE 13 ABVL.JPG
    STAGE 13 ABVL.JPG
    72.2 KB · Views: 712
STAGE 14 – MAUBEUGE-LONGWY

Côte de Braumont (Cat 4), Côte du Vieux Château (Cat 3).



I paid tribute to the last French TdF winner, and now let’s celebrate the first TdF winner: Maurice Garin, who joined the Maubeuge cycling club in 1892, and days later raced to a 5th place in Maubeuge-Hirson-Maubeuge. As we all know, Garin was a true precursor of modern cycling: after winning the inaugural TdF, he won again but was stripped of his ’04 TdF win for cheating. LaFlo is a big fan of his.



After Hirson, the peloton will go eastwards and reach Charleville-Mézières for the intermediate sprint and then we can enjoy an impressive medieval fortress: the once impregnable Château Fort de Sedan.



The last 80K are ups and downs through the Ardennes, including one categorized climb, la Côte de Braumont. The finish is quite tough, with three back-to-back-to-back (uncategorized) climbs and an uphill finish atop la Côte du Vieux Château in Longwy.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 14 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 14 PROFILE.png
    49.3 KB · Views: 713
  • STAGE 14 SEDAN.jpg
    STAGE 14 SEDAN.jpg
    16.8 KB · Views: 713
  • STAGE 14 MG.jpg
    STAGE 14 MG.jpg
    32.2 KB · Views: 713
STAGE 15 – METZ-LE CHAMP DU FEU

KOM: Le Donon (Cat 2), Col du Hanz (Cat 3), Col de la Salcée (Cat 2), Col du Champ du Feu (Cat 1), Le Champ du Feu (HC).



The second week, without mountain ranges, wasn’t that dull after all. A long stage, a Bretagne windy stage, another long flat stage, a cobbled stage, and one uphill finish... And now it’s Sunday, the mountains are back, and moves are to be expected on the GC front before rest day. It’s a Vosges stage that remains on the north side of the mountain range. Featuring the south end of the Vosges coming from the south the following year would work out great.

The start will take place by the Porte des Allemands (Gate of the Germans) in Metz.

After the ravitaillement in Badonwiller, the real action begins, with a solid climb, Le Donon, quickly followed by two smaller ascents. I would gauge that the BOD possesses a 5-10 minute lead at this juncture. Once we get to Villé and its medieval castle, it’s live action.

The riders will climb the toughest side of le Col du Champ du Feu.



Tough climb indeed, and quite long... The descent to Rothau may bring a few riders back in the GC group, just in time for the final climb, up the Col du Champ du Feu again, this time via Foudray. For logistical reasons (spectators’ traffic in-out), the finish isn’t quite all the way to the top and the profile was edited/cropped accordingly. Yet, there’s enough gradient for attacks throughout the last 7K, including a mid-section at 8.18% for 3.6K.



I don’t foresee big gaps between the main protagonists, but it could be a good morale boost to gain back time before rest day. For sure, some in the second tier will lose any top-5 aspiration.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 15 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 15 PROFILE.png
    163.3 KB · Views: 713
  • STAGE 15 CDCDF.png
    STAGE 15 CDCDF.png
    185.8 KB · Views: 713
  • STAGE 15 FINAL CLIMB.png
    STAGE 15 FINAL CLIMB.png
    175.2 KB · Views: 713
Stage 16 – DOLE-MONT D’OR

KOM: Côte de By (Cat 3), Côte de Cernans (Cat 3), Côte du Tartre (Cat 4), Côte de Longeville (Cat 3), Côte de Hautepierre (Cat 2), Côte du Larmont (Cat 3), Longevilles-Hautes (Cat 3), Mont d’Or (HC).



I must admit: what (at first) pushed me to design a TdF was frustration: every year, I wait for ASO to come up with a Jura stage and it never comes. And what I mean by that is a French Jura stage, instead of a Besançon-to-Alps mid-Tour liaison stage 8 to 12. Maybe it’s more tempting to explore the Bugey (which ASO never did and where we’re heading next BTW) or go east to Switzerland for longer/steeper climbs and money. Yet, the French Jura offers a lot of shorter but nice climbs that can make for great cycling. Over the months, I came up with 15 or 20 designs that were a lot more difficult (one had 16 categorized climbs), but way too long for a stage race. I needed to stay real: not try to make it what it’s not. However, it can be a brutal medium mountain affair. So here it is…

La Franche-Comté became part of France in 1678, and one of the first actions taken by the French was to weaken Dole, seat of the parliament and home of a famous university. Dole was the symbol of the Comtois resistance, its people fighting to the bitter end during the 1479 siege against the French, and later prevailing against the armies of the Prince de Condé when besieged again in 1636. “Comtois rends-toi! Nenni ma foi!” became the motto for an entire people. This motto expressing the never-give-up, never-surrender attitude deeply rooted in the Comtois’ culture appeared on many cycling and general news forums across France when another Comtois (who had his fair share of detractors in Franche-Comté) refused to quit the '15 TdF in the face of misfortune and adversity. The fact that he stood up and fought on gained him the respect and support of all.

This is a perfect BOD stage. A 15th place GC guy may want to sneak into the top-10. For the top-5, it’s solid pace and patience. We leave Dole, hometown of Louis Pasteur, and ride through Arc-et-Senans, the utopic city and masterpiece of architecture designed by Claude-Nicolas Ledoux.

We are now reaching the westernmost ripple of the Jura chain. When LS designed a TdF route for the Fantasy Doping Draft thread, it brought me back 4 decades: I was 5 and we were visiting an old friend of my Dad who lived in By; the son offered me to ride his bike, and here I went, riding a bike for the first time, down the slope. It feels great to place la Côte de By as my first climb: it was my beginning on a bike. I taught both of my kids how to ride a bike with no training wheels, down a slope. But let’s go back to the race as the peloton heads down for the (nothing new) sprint in Salins-les-Bains. In ’77 I was roadside in Salins (on the route de Champagnole – gentle incline), and I saw Eddy; it inspired me. That’s why I took on cycling a few years later, and probably why I’m on this forum today.

Before leaving Salins, the riders take a left onto the Route de Blégny, ride in front of my late Gran-Ma’s house. This variation makes the Côte de Cernans a little shorter and a little steeper. More climbing until we reach the Loue River and its crossing guarded by le Château de Cléron.

Up and down the canyon we go until the end of the gorges and the really hard Côte de Hautepierre. Then we head south, with the infamous Château de Joux in Pontarlier giving viewers will provide TV add to the stress.



One interesting feature of the castle is its 500ft deep circular well dug by forced laborers, travelers that Lord Amaury, Sieur de Joux, captured when they ventured on his land.

Two ascents come next, first the steepest part of the Larmont and after a tricky descent, the (more gentle - uncategorized) climb towards Les Fourgs. We now enter the final part of the stage…

The Mont d’Or offers three climbing sides (from north to south): Longevilles-Hautes, NW, and W (actually there’s a fourth side, south, less difficult from Rochejean): the two on the north side (LH and NW) meet with about 2.5K left. All three share the last kilometer or so. I picked the natural order so roads don’t intersect. Easiest side (LH) uphill, second hardest side (NW) downhill, hardest (west side) uphill to the finish…



The last kilometer is super steep, 15% average with 18% stretches. It will be a dramatic finish…and create gaps. That’s my Jura stage. When the course is made public, Alexis Vuillermoz will mark it big time. So will Thibaut.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 16 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 16 PROFILE.png
    95.1 KB · Views: 710
  • STAGE 16 CHATEAU DE JOUX.jpg
    STAGE 16 CHATEAU DE JOUX.jpg
    105.8 KB · Views: 710
  • STAGE 16 MDO PROFILE.gif
    STAGE 16 MDO PROFILE.gif
    12.4 KB · Views: 708
STAGE 17 – SAINT-CLAUDE-GRAND COLOMBIER

KOM: Col de la Vie Neuve (Cat 2), Col de Cuvery (Cat 1), Col de Richemond (Cat 3), Col de la Biche (Cat 1), Grand Colombier (HC).



Another Jura stage. Muhahahaha! It was all part of my evil plan…well, actually it makes sense as we head towards the Alps. And let me start by stating that the ’16 TdF route didn’t do enough to satisfy my yearning for a real showdown in the Bugey. Culoz…WTF.

Note: I didn’t want to be too greedy and put the three Kardashians on this stage. Note #2: after I wrote the beginning of this narrative, Andrew posted his TdF stage and went all out with all three climbs. Greedy you, Andrew! Actually I’d rather have two back to back than three with that gap before MDC. South to north would be a different story…

The start will take place in a town that is the origin of my family. We can trace our presence there all the way back to the 13th century. This is where my father was born: Saint-Claude. This is Alexis Vuillermoz’s home town too. Throughout the middle ages, its abbey was very famous and a pilgrimage to Saint-Claude was considered a major act of faith. Today, the small town of Saint-Claude is known as the World capital of pipe making.



The start line is located Place du 9 Avril 1944, when on Easter Sunday 1944, Nazis led by Klaus Barbie rounded up the people. 302 were sent to Buchenwald: 186 including some of my folks never came back. After the grief, We head south, but not through the usual passes (Faucille or Serra). Instead, the peloton will take on le Col de la Vie Neuve. Next is the Col de Cuvéry, a steady 6-7% ascent, then the Col de Richemond: not a big climb, but well placed on the map: its decent leads to the hardest side of le Col de la Biche (via Giniez). That’s where some top-10 or top-5 riders will suffer, where domestiques of the big teams start to drop, where guys down a few minutes in the GC should make a move.

A long downhill ensues, leading to Artemare. No flat. The finalclimb is no other that the Grand Colombier via Artenare and la rampe de Virieu for a brutal MTF.



Note: tough MTF on the logistics’ side, but it’s been done many times in the Tour de l’Ain.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 17 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 17 PROFILE.png
    108 KB · Views: 709
  • STAGE 17 SC.jpg
    STAGE 17 SC.jpg
    49.2 KB · Views: 709
  • STAGE 17 GC.png
    STAGE 17 GC.png
    71.7 KB · Views: 708
STAGE 18 –CHAMBERY-MONT DE LANS

KOM: Côte de Brie (Cat 4), Côte de Laffrey (Cat 1), Col d’Ornon (cat 2), Montée de l’Alpe d’Huez (HC).



I discarded the Tourmalet, the Ventoux, and would have done the same with l’Alpe d’Huez if it wasn’t for the descent of the Col de Sarenne. It’s stage 18, it is time for desperate people to attempt desperate things and for the cautious to pay the price. Bravo Riblon for winning after this close-call on the descent in ‘13:



The GC action will begin after we leave Grenoble and the sprinters fight for precious points; many riders will drop in the ascent of a little-renown but very challenging climb: la (difficile) Côte de Laffrey.



I spare you the profile and description of l’Alpe d’Huez. But more riders will be in difficulty, including top-10 guys. A favorite may attack, try to create a buffer before the nasty, nasty final descent. There’s a definite risk/reward factor, and with the win or a podium in the balance, some will take big risks. Something will happen. The running to the finish is a small uphill stretch to Mont-de-Lans.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 18 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 18 PROFILE.png
    108.3 KB · Views: 709
  • STAGE 18 CDS RIBLON13.jpg
    STAGE 18 CDS RIBLON13.jpg
    33 KB · Views: 709
  • STAGE 18 CDLAFFREY.gif
    STAGE 18 CDLAFFREY.gif
    4.8 KB · Views: 709
STAGE 19 - LA GRAVE-MONTEE DE LACHAT

KOM: Col du Galibier (HC), Col de la Croix de Fer (HC), Col de la Madeleine (HC), Montée de Lachat (HC).



Last MTF, and it’s a very tough one:

The stage should start in Bourg d’Oisans, but I have zero confidence that the tunnel will be repaired any time soon: barges will have to do, and the start of the stage will take place in La Grave.

The opening climb, a long stretch of the Galibier is “over-ranked” here, but in the KOM scheme of things, I want to put extra points on the table. It’s likely that two, maybe three riders still have a chance. Let them fight for the “maillot à pois”. The grind continues, domestiques should be worn out, and le Col de la Croix de Fer will add more to their misery. And no time to rest, as the riders descend to La Chambre before climbing le Col de la Madeleine from its toughest side.



The originality of this stage resides in an ascent that was mentioned in a “climb that the TdF should feature” thread on a French website. Coming from this side provides a possibility for a long range attack. The descent is not that long before a sharp left turn/hairpin (altitude 1035m - see arrow on Profile), towards a beast of a climb, la Montée de Lachat. Nice summit area, again I’ll use my Spanish crew if need be, and the road is not bad. But gosh, is it steep…and quite long.



This stage has the potential to turn the GC upside-down.
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 19 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 19 PROFILE.png
    218.1 KB · Views: 710
  • STAGE 19 FINAL CLIMB.png
    STAGE 19 FINAL CLIMB.png
    27.6 KB · Views: 710
  • STAGE 19 CDLM.gif
    STAGE 19 CDLM.gif
    16.6 KB · Views: 708
STAGE 20 – VEZELAY-ITT



This is probably the TdF tradition that I like best: the second-to-last day ITT. Climbers can build a cushion, hope that the advantage is big enough, start behind the better ITT specialists and get split times. From a design standpoint, you need to find an area that the rest of the course has neglected, somewhere between the finish of stage 19 and the Ile de France (Paris area). How about Vezelay in Bourgogne?

Not a pan flat course, but not hilly either: it’s a course for tough guys. BigMig or Ulle would have loved it. On the course is a medieval castle that ranks in the top-20 of the French monuments according to polls in France.



I’ll let Phil and Paul introduce le Château de Bazoches…



Phil: what a beautiful castle indeed.
Paul: it was built in 1180, and later became the residency of the great military architect Vauban.
Phil: was he related to Robert Alban?
Paul: not at all. And it deserves to be mentioned that Philippe Auguste and Richard the Lionheart stayed at the castle on their way to the 3rd crusade.
Phil: yes indeed, Richard, seven-time winner of the King of the Mountain classification.
Paul: wtf?

Just about 60K and the potential for an ITT specialist to make up 3, maybe 4 minutes...
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 20 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 20 PROFILE.png
    40.3 KB · Views: 706
  • STAGE 20 BAZOCHES.JPG
    STAGE 20 BAZOCHES.JPG
    240 KB · Views: 706
  • STAGE 20 P&P.jpg
    STAGE 20 P&P.jpg
    204.3 KB · Views: 705
STAGE 21 – VERSAILLES-PARIS

KOM: Côte des 17 Tournants (Cat 4), Côte de Cernay (Cat 4), Côte de Gometz (Cat 4), Côte de la Belle Image (Cat 4) Côte de l’Homme Mort (Cat 4), Côte de Meudon (Cat 4).



It’s time to finish the three-week journey, but let’s not pop Champagne corks just yet. This stage is not the usual Champs-Elysées conclusion. I’d like to alternate from year to year. Montmartre, unfortunately, isn’t practical, although it could be preceded by cobbles on the north side of the city, around the Porte de Clignancourt, and/or Porte de la Chapelle. I chose la Tour Eiffel.

I enjoyed designing this stage. It passes in front of the house we lived in after we moved from Franche-Comté. These were my training and racing roads, my climbs, first of which is la Côte des 17 Tournants, viewed as a miniature ADH by the local riders (17 turns is almost 21, right?). The Côte de Cernay is a nice short climb. The next one is more interesting (to me at least): the Côte de Gometz was my warm up climb on solo training days. It is dead straight, mentally difficult for the first-timer: it never seems to end. Back in the day motorcycle companies held uphill TT races there.



For some reason, la Côte de la Belle Image was my favorite, straight and steep, then twists and turns, a final kick, it was Tour de France-ish. As far as The Dead Man’s Climb (Côte de l’Homme Mort), its very name makes it a local icon and one of my favorites. The Côte de Meudon is the last chance for a KOM win, or a GC Vino-style attack like in ’47 or ’68. After the descent, about 15K to go; the peloton will ride past the Trocadéro, cross la Seine via le Pont Alexandre III and head back west for the finish at the foot of the Eiffel Tower.



I really had a blast. Big thanks to fr-fr.topographic-map.com, Google Earth, Cronoescalada, and to all of you!
 

Attachments

  • STAGE 21 PROFILE.png
    STAGE 21 PROFILE.png
    63.5 KB · Views: 707
  • STAGE 21 CDG.JPEG
    STAGE 21 CDG.JPEG
    192.6 KB · Views: 707
  • STAGE 21 FINISH.png
    STAGE 21 FINISH.png
    221.6 KB · Views: 704
Jun 22, 2009
11
0
0
Visit site
Tonton said:
Stage 10 – ROYAN-SAINT-NAZAIRE

The running to the finish will offer a spectacular sight, a marvel of modern architecture: the Bridge of Saint-Nazaire, used by the TdF on one previous occasion, in ’11.
Hi Tonton ... The 2000 Tdf ran its 70km TTT into St. Nazaire, where some teams (including USPS) exploded on the bridge, with 65km in the legs and strong crosswinds raging.
A fantastic place to end a stage ... I seem to remember the bridge classified as a Cat 4 at some point but can't find anything to back it up.
 
Re:

Bye Bye Bicycle said:
I stopped reading after the fourth stage or so. I've seen better jokes in this thread.
You didn't like the Lance Froome/Chris Armstrong comment (Stage 4)? Sorry if I offended you, Sir Dave :p . I don't aim at a career in stand up, that's just how I am. My mind wanders at time, and there's no sacred cow. I hope you liked what you saw of the route, though.
 
Jul 26, 2015
145
0
0
Visit site
Thats a very nice Tour Tonton :

-First, i have to admit that after a long reflexion, i think that i have to change my point of view about cobbled/white roads stage past Week-1, as it is in contradiction with other points i believe in.
From, i dont really know if its the best way to use them to the more banana skins we have, the better.

-I dont really care for the weekly exchange of jerseys in Week-1 that is of no real interest overall, but i understand the need to preserve some uncertainty on Day 1. I'm intrigued because on one hand, you got the atrocious habits of the peloton with riders that dont take risks until its too late. But on the other hand, you got a stage that is difficult with the yellow jersey up for grabs, which is a powerful incentive. I believe that several smaller climbs are probably a better fit for that scenario though.

-I like the Le Puy-Aurillac stage. Wish it was slightly harder before the Puy Mary. Thats almost the biggest problem for me in modern routes, the lack of stages using lot of cat.2-3 climbs. They're much more open than the others, and horrific to control. But as race organizers are usually way too soft on those, we have to deal with a sad breakaway and a peloton finishing 8:30 later...

-Surprised to not see the Pic de Nore + descent all the way to Mazamet, as you already had a similar finish at la Croix-de-Bauzon days earlier, another one in the same kind of trip to Mont-Louis the next day and that descent is interesting cycling-wise.

-The second week is a brave choice, but i think an Ardennes-like stage would have appropriate there. Thats probably the only thing missing in your Tour.
A combo of back-to-back simili-classics is possible in Brittany or around Sedan.
As explained earlier, an uphill sprint...is still a sprint. Even at Huy, it is that way, unfortunately.

-Where do you race between Royan and St-Nazaire ? Is it close enough to the coast (with Luçon in the equation, im not sure)? Hopefully, it can be a windy day.

-Loved the Jura stage...but the Mont d'Or might be too difficult compared to the rest of the stage, which might trouble the initiatives. I think its hard enough, though, to prevent that kind of issue.

-A big applause for Sarenne and Beillurti.

-La Grave-Lachat is glorious.

-No criterium to finish, thats a good note for me too.





STAGE 4 : Erevan - Lake Kari, 149km.

New country today, Armenia, the least populated of all the former soviet republics.
Trapped in the Caucasus, with a lot of mountains...a lot. The landscape is really great there as its quite preserved from us and our destructive habits.
If today, it is a very small country, in the past, it was certainly not. It was the first country to adopt Christianity as its religion.

Armenia-665.jpg

Khor Virap Monastery, with the Mount Ararat on the background

The country stayed independent or semi-independent pretty much until the mongols came (13th century).
Persia and Russia finally ruled over the area much later, until 1991.

Erevan is the capital, and it is a huge city, as 1/3 of the armenian population live there.
The soviet explosion explains partially that kind of ratio (economical depression, immigration, poverty...) as the city is much more dynamic than the rest of the country.

yerevan.jpg

Erevan

Lets talk about the stage, which is quite simple :

We'll simply climb the Mount Aragats, which is the highest point of Armenia.
Yes, there is the Mount Ararat, national symbol and holy place for armenians, but today in Turkey, and the Mount Aragats, highest point of the country. They're both volcanoes, by the way.

One climb to do, but the only problem for the riders is that we'll have to do it several times.

119.png


We start with 30km of training between Erevan and Ashtarak, right at the bottom of the ascent.
And then, welcome in hell, as we're here for several hours of pain. Over 50km of climbing today for the first mountain stage, thats tough, i know.

We'll start a first time, only to stop shortly before the mid-way point, near the research station of Nor-Amberd.
Named after an old fortress in the vicinity.

1369143992_0-Amberd.jpg

Amberd Fortress. Supposedly, that means fortress in the clouds. How poetic is that ?

12km over 7.5% in average gradient, thats a good way to shake things up. The run-in to the bottom being slightly different, the second ascent doesnt have the same data, but its the same road being used for the last 12 km...only to stop again.
Yeah, why stop the fun right now ?

araga2.jpg


araga1.jpg



Anyway, the third time will be the right time to go all the way to the top of the road, to the Lake Kari, which is 3183 meters high. There is a research station there, which explains why there is such a good road.

80865284_Kari_lake_from_south_summit.jpg


And to reach that small lake, the third climb will be 29km long, still at 7% average. Thats awfully long.
The altitude is also going to be a factor (18km of climbing over 2.000m), and there will be disappointed riders already after today.

It is going to be mandatory to be in top shape very early in the race because if you may have kinda survived in Alexandrette, here, the cost of a poor day will be much much higher.
The race is done by riders, we all know how conservative they tend to race before the end of the first mountain finish, but i think that the profile of the stages will help. There is already two very tough stages done to Alexandrette and Agri, they'll already know enough about their position relative to others.
There is no extreme gradients, even though it is very hard, you can throw teammates at the front, there is no absurd amount of flat, and the stage is relatively short.

MV44UIx.png


(Mount Aragats gradients, km 1-12 : 4.5 - 8.5 - 8.5 - 8.5 - 6.5 - 3.5 - 8 - 8.5 - 9 - 7.5 - 9 - 8.5 - 7.5)
(Mount Aragats gradients, km 12-29 : 6.5 - 6 - 9 - 3.5 - 8 - 7 - 7.5 - 7.5 - 7 - 5.5 - 5.5 - 6 - 5 - 2.5 - 8.5 - 9.5 - 4.5)

BhgChnI.png
 
I like the fact that you are deviating from the almost near certainty script that is no really hard MTF's, +100 kilometers of flat ITT and downhill finishes or easier finishes with harder climbs preceding, the Mortirolo-Aprica concept. While that's great in theory and also is in the right circumstances, too much of that would also hamper the action drastically days in and days out. Thats more or less everything I have seen in this thread so far, but your Tour is everything but that with those monster MTF's. I would love to witness those first 9 days of yours, allthough some would argue its a bit too rough..... and simply put, quite unrealistic, but I like that your 2 week basically is the 1st week. Mixing it up like that is nice... Also considering the crash festivals.
 
DACH Rundfahrt stage 21: Bern - Bern (150 km)

difficulty: **

W2dRMLz.jpg

qaFvUGr.jpg


Yeah, this is very very lazy, but I just didnt want to design such a stage, because thats always one hell of a work. So I just take this stage from this years tdf as the last stage of my DACH Rundfahrt. This isnt a hard stage, but its still harder than the normal last road stage of a gt. However it still wont change anything in the final gc.

Bern:
KIbXBEu.jpg
 
Gigs_98 said:
@Tonton
Why did you descent from the Biche to Artemare and then climbed to Grand Colombier from there on? You can combine Biche - Colombier with no flat between and even only a short descent.

Great point. I was considering other transitions/shortcuts between the two, and chose to go all the way down to Artemare, since that side hasn't been done before in a TdF. It could be done, definitely. Hey, there's always next year ;) .
 
I think the bigger issue is simply that 11 uphill finishes in 21 stages and the kind of slopes being used is solely a Vuelta preserve, and going with legit HC mountains right from stage 1 (and a big style MTT on stage 2) meant I rather read through the race thinking of Eshnar's All-Mountain Giri, unfortunately a lot of these hell-slopes simply don't have the room to host the larger caravan that the Tour brings with it. Unipublic are quite prepared to cram everything in, and Zomegnan is prepared to move hell or earth to get the right finish to work (the logistical planning around Kronplatz being the main example).

Valv.Piti pointed out that a lot of the dedicated traceurs on here have more or less come to a formula in the design of limited MTFs, Mortirolo-Aprica concepts and 100km+ of ITT, but I think that's borne out of a combination of two things. One, between the lot of us we've rather come to conclude this is the kind of route we enjoy, and two, perhaps the level of inventiveness has been toned down as the thread has gone on in an attempt to produce routes that could feasibly be provided by ASO, RCS or Unipublic yet still fulfil the criteria of a race we'd like. The difference from the norm in the pacing is an interesting idea, but with the last two TDFs in this thread having opened with a legit high mountain stage and a 60km ITT, these are obviously formulae that the real race organizers would never go for.

It really depends what you're looking for with your routes, to showcase the boundaries of possibility or to present immediately achievable suggestions for races, and everything in between. We've had races consisting of 21 straight mountain stages to show that there are possibilities all over the country, and we've had re-tracings of genuine stages to show how real race stages and routes could have been realistically altered. Some of the ideas I've put forward are aimed at changing up the formulae of race pacing, but still being wary of what race organizers would be genuinely willing to do; others have been impractical realm-of-possibility fare like my Vuelta featuring transfers to Ibiza, Mallorca, Melilla, Ceuta and three different Canary Islands.