Random Questions

[RedheadDane]

Don't know if a similar thread already exists out there. If so please point me towards it.

Anyway... the jersey HH was wearing when he crashed in TdS; it looks like the TdF KoM jersey, but from what I've read around here he's a sprinter (and why would a climber take part in a sprint anyway?)
So... Basically my question is;
What is it the jersey for?

 

[Cerberus]

Don't know if a similar thread already exists out there. If so please point me towards it.

Anyway... the jersey HH was wearing when he crashed in TdS; it looks like the TdF KoM jersey, but from what I've read around here he's a sprinter (and why would a climber take part in a sprint anyway?)
So... Basically my question is;
What is it the jersey for?

It's the TdS points jersey, they make it look like that to throw the foreigners of the scent. You see the Suisse know what the jersey is for thus giving them a small but significant advantage when the contenders for the Mountain jersey keep an eye on the guy in the polkadot jersey while the contenders for the point jersey keep looking for a green shirt. It's sneaky, but that's the Swiss for you.

 

[Magnus]

If you look at the stage report from stage 3 you'll se that Haussler was in the lead of one classification and your question will be answered.

 

[RedheadDane]

It's the TdS points jersey, they make it look like that to throw the foreigners of the scent. You see the Suisse know what the jersey is for thus giving them a small but significant advantage when the contenders for the Mountain jersey keep an eye on the guy in the polkadot jersey while the contenders for the point jersey keep looking for a green shirt. It's sneaky, but that's the Swiss for you.

Those tricky Swiss people!
Could imagine it's their way of saying "Our race is not the same as the TdF!"

 

[The Hitch]

The eurosport commentators fell for it too, saying there was a mistake and they had given Haussler wrong jersey, acting proud that they had shown off their cycling knowledge.

 

[The Hitch]

Heres a random question.
why do cyclists go faster in difficult long hilly time trials than in short flat prologues.

In the 2009 51 km hilly world tt in mendrisio, which included a hard climb that had to be done thrice, cancellaras average was above 50km/h.
In the 2010 giro flat 8 km amstertham tt wiggnis came first in something like 47km/h.

My guess is the Amstertham tt had more corners, and they might have been saving themselves for the giro. but wiggins was going specifically for the tt, and surely the corners cant take as much out of cyclists as swiss hills.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Depends. How tight were the corners? Cancellara monstered the Worlds ITT too. And the Worlds TT parcours was designed almost solely with Cancellara in mind. Cancellara is a better time triallist than Bradley Wiggins nine times out of ten.

Also, though they did have to do the climb three times, the fact that it was a circuit meant that they got to go downhill too. And also - when you have more corners, especially tight ones when there's lots of road furniture (like in Holland, say), every time you lose speed you have to increase it again.

My random question is, how many scandals and positive tests will it take for Liberty Seguros to finally actually give up on cycling as a method of promoting their company, since they've taken over an amateur team that apparently hopes to become UCI Continental next year?

 

[The Hitch]

Depends. How tight were the corners? Cancellara monstered the Worlds ITT too. And the Worlds TT parcours was designed almost solely with Cancellara in mind. Cancellara is a better time triallist than Bradley Wiggins nine times out of ten.

Also, though they did have to do the climb three times, the fact that it was a circuit meant that they got to go downhill too. And also - when you have more corners, especially tight ones when there's lots of road furniture (like in Holland, say), every time you lose speed you have to increase it again.

My random question is, how many scandals and positive tests will it take for Liberty Seguros to finally actually give up on cycling as a method of promoting their company, since they've taken over an amateur team that apparently hopes to become UCI Continental next year?

Well larsson came second to Cancellara in that tt and got over 50km/h as well (though yes he did follow cancellara for most of the tt).
And Larsson did the giro tt and got a slower speed as well

Also wiggins was well on his way to a fast time in the world tt before he got a puncture 45 km in. He would have also gone faster in the 50k than he did in the 8k. And in the tds 9km prologue which cancellara also won he went slower than he did in the mendrisio 50k last year.

So this riders going faster in long time trials seems to be quite consistant.

And your right about downhills, but up hill takes a lot more speed out of cyclists than downhill gives them.

 

[Magnus]

Heres a random question.
why do cyclists go faster in difficult long hilly time trials than in short flat prologues.

In the 2009 51 km hilly world tt in mendrisio, which included a hard climb that had to be done thrice, cancellaras average was above 50km/h.
In the 2010 giro flat 8 km amstertham tt wiggnis came first in something like 47km/h.

My guess is the Amstertham tt had more corners, and they might have been saving themselves for the giro. but wiggins was going specifically for the tt, and surely the corners cant take as much out of cyclists as swiss hills.

First of all, the tt in mendrisio wasn't on the same route as the rr. It had only 120 m of height difference per round (360 m total).

Fabian was peaking for the worlds in Mendrisio. Wiggins was training at the giro.

And wasn't it raining at the giro prolouge besides all the twists and turns?
The TdS prolouge was up and down and the descent was on a narrow wet road. And Fabian wasn't exactly at his peak.

 

[The Hitch]

First of all, the tt in mendrisio wasn't on the same route as the rr. It had only 120 m of height difference per round (360 m total).

Fabian was peaking for the worlds in Mendrisio. Wiggins was training at the giro.

And wasn't it raining at the giro prolouge besides all the twists and turns?
The TdS prolouge was up and down and the descent was on a narrow wet road. And Fabian wasn't exactly at his peak.

Thanks, some very good points there though i dont know if even that would account for such a big gap in speed.

I guess we will se in the tdf how the rotherdam prologue compares to the later one.

 

[Magnus]

Thanks, some very good points there though i dont know if even that would account for such a big gap in speed.

I guess we will se in the tdf how the rotherdam prologue compares to the later one.

A big part of the explanation is also that there's very little difference in the output a rider at his peak can maintain for 10 min and an hour.

In London Fabian rode at 54.5 km/h and as far as I remember Boardman did some prologues at around 55 km/h.

 

[The Hitch]

A big part of the explanation is also that there's very little difference in the output a rider at his peak can maintain for 10 min and an hour.


In London Fabian rode at 54.5 km/h and as far as I remember Boardman did some prologues at around 55 km/h.

Thats true. the speed marathons are run at is more or less the same as the speed the 10 00m is run at.

 

[Big GMaC]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmR9k8UAohs&NR=1

why in the video of indurain destroying armstrong is armstorng wearing the WC jersey? He was reigning Road Champ in '94, never TT champ

 

[Magnus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmR9k8UAohs&NR=1

why in the video of indurain destroying armstrong is armstorng wearing the WC jersey? He was reigning Road Champ in '94, never TT champ

The first TT world chapionships was in 94. I guess the road champ wore the wc jersey in tt's before that.

 

[ThorFolerSegSterkIDagDu]

How many watts do the top sprinters do upto the finish line?

 

[Bag_O_Wallet]

The first TT world chapionships was in 94. I guess the road champ wore the wc jersey in tt's before that.

You are correct, sir. Here are the two World Champs prior to Armstrong in TT's. No distinction between road and TT, because there wasn't any yet.

 

[Bag_O_Wallet]

What's a stagiaire?

I've heard the term a number of times over the years, and most recently with Phinney the Younger. It sounds like it would be something like an apprenticeship, but that's just a guess.

 

[joy118118]

What's a stagiaire?

I've heard the term a number of times over the years, and most recently with Phinney the Younger. It sounds like it would be something like an apprenticeship, but that's just a guess.

Last year CN had an article about it.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/training-time-in-the-big-leagues

 

[The Hitch]

Question:
Considering how much effort is put into aerodynamics, shouldnt colour be more of an issue for cycling teams.

Is it not beneficial for teams to wear black jerseys which disperse heat than white jerseys which reflect it.
Dont caisse have an advantage over saxo

 

[warmfuzzies]

Question:
Considering how much effort is put into aerodynamics, shouldnt colour be more of an issue for cycling teams.

Is it not beneficial for teams to wear black jerseys which disperse heat than white jerseys which reflect it.
Dont caisse have an advantage over saxo

Black absorbs heat, which in a single variable world would negatively impact performance on warm days. Of more subtle impact would be how heat radiates off black, and how that impacts the flow of air around a rider. My guess would be a slight negative. Any aerospace credentialed viewers available for insight?

 

[The Hitch]

Black absorbs heat, which in a single variable world would negatively impact performance on warm days. Of more subtle impact would be how heat radiates off black, and how that impacts the flow of air around a rider. My guess would be a slight negative. Any aerospace credentialed viewers available for insight?

I know it absorbes heat but i also once read somewhere that they did tests on black and on white helmets and found that in heat air travels faster in the black helmets, especially at altitude, which led them to conclude that it would be more beneficial for cyclists to wear black.
For me, on hot days, i always feel better afterwards when i have cycled in white because it reflects heat, but i dont live at altitude, or cycle as fast. Also considering that the wind can have a cooling effect, especially when cycling at that speed, perhaps it wouldnt be such a problem when wearing black to feel a bit more warm.

 

[Fester]

Interesting debate here. I think clothing colour probably accounts for an extremely marginal gain. However:

Given Dim's excellent explanation I would like to throw in a few ideas of my own:

Cyclists loose heat mainly through the latent heat of evaporation and cycling clothes facilitate this by their "skin tight" nature. Several factor come into play: Including agitation by photons, partial pressure, agitation and being "whipped away" by wind movement and of course the bodies very own heat energy.

In terms of "drying" shall we say by solar radiation then blacks the winner. But in avoiding getting hot in the first place white wins; clearly shown in Mythbusters. Partial pressures I don't think come into it, although in a humid environment black would clearly loose it's edge. And in terms of air movement whipping molecules away it's a draw. In terms of storing of dispelling heat energy generated by the body, I don't think colour comes into it by the fact cycle clothing is "skin tight" an extension if you will of the system... it would be a bit like asking "does the red bloody underside of the skin refract heat energy?".

I would still back white, due to the skin tight nature of cycle clothing.

 

[AngusW]

My random question is this:

The King of the Mountains prize in the Tour de France used to be sponsored by a chocolate company called Poulain. According to a caption on a Graham Watson photo of Lucho Herrera, the winner of the KOM received as part of his prize his body weight in chocolate. In the late 1980s the KOM sponsor was Cafe de Colombia and the winner received his weight in coffee beans. The photo I was referring to was of Lucho Herrera, the 1987 KOM, sitting one side of the scales as a jar on the other side was filled with coffee beans.

Does anyone know when this practice ended? Or did subsequent winners receive their weight in Coca Cola (Chiappucci) or Supermarket products (Virenque)?

 

[The Hitch]

My random question is this:

The King of the Mountains prize in the Tour de France used to be sponsored by a chocolate company called Poulain. According to a caption on a Graham Watson photo of Lucho Herrera, the winner of the KOM received as part of his prize his body weight in chocolate. In the late 1980s the KOM sponsor was Cafe de Colombia and the winner received his weight in coffee beans. The photo I was referring to was of Lucho Herrera, the 1987 KOM, sitting one side of the scales as a jar on the other side was filled with coffee beans.

Does anyone know when this practice ended? Or did subsequent winners receive their weight in Coca Cola (Chiappucci) or Supermarket products (Virenque)?

When Rasmussen won it, they weighed him and found out the equivalent of his body weiight in chocolates was nothing.

It hasnt been used since.

 

[ultimobici]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmR9k8UAohs&NR=1

why in the video of indurain destroying armstrong is armstorng wearing the WC jersey? He was reigning Road Champ in '94, never TT champ

Because there was no official TT championship at that time, rather there was a real race infinitely more prestigious & tough called the Grand Prix des Nations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Prix_des_Nations

A combination of a change of course and the UCI introducing their TT championship almost killed it off by but it survived, albeit in a diminished capacity.

Far better IMO would be to bring back the Super Prestige Pernod in its original 80's form. That always saw a worthy season long winner.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Prestige_Pernod_International