Richie Porte

[Ryo Hazuki]

yeah and in his first year in europe he placed 7th in the Giro and beat Canc in a ITT. He has only been riding road for 3-4 years now and is making fantastic progress, I wouldn't discount anything at this point.

Also that Australian climbing has been a pretty good revealer of talent over the years, much more so than the US circuit.

yeah 7th because of a break that gave him ridiculous time. like I said without that not even top 20. not by a long shot

 

[Winterfold]

Is this about Porte - or his advisors chasing the money? Porte is still a young guy. Does he know what is really best for him at this point? I would have thought another year with Riis and with Contador to learn from would be a pretty good move at this point in his career. For sure he will learn more than he would at Sky.

IMO Riis is laying the law down with the advisors. Even after showing some petulance this year Cancellara is old enough, wise enough and has the superstar creds for him and Riis to sit down and work out what is best for the relationship like grown-ups. And it looks like it's time to move on...

But when advisors to first year pros (no matter how much potential they have) start trying it on then Riis etc need to slap them down.

IMO

 

[theyoungest]

My point is not to talk him up but to warn people not to dismiss the guy as just another over hyped young rider. Richie is fiercely determined, to the point of weirdness, a bit of a ''champions persona' is you ask me.

Oh, I have no doubt about that... and I remember everyone on this forum asking after his Romandie TT "who the f$%k is this guy? There must be something wrong with the timing", so it's fun to see he's grown from a total unknown to a much touted if slightly overhyped talent in such a short period of time.

 

[roundabout]

Porte managed to get through the other stages pretty well. Kruiswijk got stuck in the mud on the way to Montalcino.

Being beaten by Hondo and a former pursuiter also doesn't add to the hype.

 

[roundabout]

yeah 7th because of a break that gave him ridiculous time. like I said without that not even top 20. not by a long shot

Er, you do know that Porte was 38 minutes ahead of 20th in the Giro?

 

[53 x 11]

yeah 7th because of a break that gave him ridiculous time. like I said without that not even top 20. not by a long shot

That's racin' bro. Sometimes you read it right and make a break, sometimes you get a flat, miss a shift, crash. I won my first race cos two sprinters took each other out and I was the strongest left, that's bike racing. In the end the results sheet don't give a toss.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

That's racin' bro. Sometimes you read it right and make a break, sometimes you get a flat, miss a shift, crash. I won my first race cos two sprinters took each other out and I was the strongest left, that's bike racing. In the end the results sheet don't give a toss.

you don't understand do you?? you think pereiro won eveyr year the tour cuz of a 30 minute break?? things like that happen maybe once or twice in your life. look at casar who did same in giro 2006 when he finished 7th because of a break. what has he done since>>

 

[theyoungest]

Porte managed to get through the other stages pretty well. Kruiswijk got stuck in the mud on the way to Montalcino.

Beaten by Hondo and a former pursuiter also doesn't add to the hype.

Kruijswijk didn't ride the Giro for GC. And he blew up while chasing Monier on that stage you're referring to, after which Hondo passed him--Monier actually being quite a good climber, if you didn't know.

 

[Sophistic]

Without that break, he "would have" finished 11th.
Add the 13 minutes from breakaway and he's 13th ->minus Sastre&Kiserlovski->11th.

 

[Mambo95]

you don't understand do you?? you think pereiro won eveyr year the tour cuz of a 30 minute break?? things like that happen maybe once or twice in your life. look at casar who did same in giro 2006 when he finished 7th because of a break. what has he done since>>

He wasn't alone in that break though. Half of the top 20 were in it.

And what has he done since: 10th San Sebastian, 4th Eneco, 4th Tour of Britain. He hasn't much other racing (Tour of Denmark)

 

[theyoungest]

Without that break, he "would have" finished 11th.
Add the 13 minutes from breakaway and he's 13th ->minus Sastre&Kiserlovski->11th.

And in this purely hypothetical world, he'd have missed the white jersey (by 5 seconds )

 

[The Hitch]

Well, I gotta say, I do like Porte but he's gotten an unreasonable amount of hype for that 7th placing. Steven Kruijswijk (1st year pro, 22 years old) rode his first GT as well, in fact he only heard a few days before that he would take the start, and did better than Porte on almost every climb. I don't hear anyone talking him up as the next great GC hope, though.

Yep your right about Kruijswijk. ANd bear in mind Bauke Mollema is the same age as Porte and he beat Porte on the climbs. And the guy who placed 3rd despite no 13 minute break and is now a gt champion is also Portes age. Thats before you look at the Schlecks, Gesinks, Kreuzigers, Velits, also developing, also Portes age, and way better. So even if Porte is improving i cant see him catching up to these guys.
And thats just his generation. Porte will be in his mid 30s by the time COntador and Valverde and Anton are finished, and the upcoming generation - Henao, TJVG is also going to break that top layer soon.

So for me 7th in a gc a young riders jersey and 2 days in pink is likely as good as its going to get for Porte and its never going to get this good again.

 

[The Hitch]

That's racin' bro. Sometimes you read it right and make a break, sometimes you get a flat, miss a shift, crash. I won my first race cos two sprinters took each other out and I was the strongest left, that's bike racing. In the end the results sheet don't give a toss.

THis argument works when you are talking about who the strongest guys in a race were. Porte got into the break so well done and he got his 7th. So in this case the results sheet doesnt lie.


But if you are looking to the future you have to look more closely at what happened and make allowances.

Nibali isnt going to have the strongest rider crash out every gt he enters, Bradley wiggins isnt going to get soft pedaling up climbs every gt he enters, Capechi isnt going to get team leadership every gt he enters and however great he is, Porte is not going to get a 13 minute time bonus over 3/4 of the peloton, every gt he enters.

 

[hfer07]

I think he should stay and honor his contract-- as some fellows here wrote-he's got a unique chance to ride along with the current world's best rider, and get a sense of what is like to be at that level of the game. If everything goes fine, next year he'll be free to ride for Pegasus, Sky or the team of his liking.....
on the other hand- I perhaps understand his preoccupation, since the new team is far away from what it was, and having Contador & his lieutenants must have been a bit estrange to fit in....

 

[Mambo95]

Nibali isnt going to have the 1st place crash out every gt he enters, Bradley wiggins isnt going to get soft pedaling up climbs every gt he enters and however great he is, Porte is not going to get a 13 minute time bonus over 3/4 of the peloton, every gt he enters.

Contador isn't going to have the Yellow Jersey withdrawn by his team every time he does the Tour......

Just because they get a bit if luck, it doesn't mean they can't go on to do great rides in the future.

 

[The Hitch]

Contador isn't going to have the Yellow Jersey withdrawn by his team every time he does the Tour......

Just because they get a bit if luck, it doesn't mean they can't go on to do great rides in the future.

I was thinking the same thing (the contador analogy). Sure riders can go on to improve. The point is, to those who say that we should look at his 7th in the giro and want to base future results on this, i say, congratulate him on his giro, but if you want to base his future results on it, bare in mind he wont have the 13 minute bonus next time. Those 13 minutes for 7th place are going to have to come from time trials, mud stages, and most of them, from some way better performances in the mountains.

 

[The Hitch]

And in this purely hypothetical world, he'd have missed the white jersey (by 5 seconds )

And (in this hypotherical world ) he wouldnt have worn the pink either. So his and saxos 2 best things from the giro - jerseys, are gone, his performance is seen as less impressive and for saxo bank it means their greatest achievment from the giro becomes the terminillo mtf.

But as i have said, as far as this giro goes, he deserves it. Well done for getting into the break. Its only for looking at the future does the 13 minutes downlplay portes potential.

 

[Nick C.]

Isn't Porte's Giro superficially similar to Cadel's first Giro albeit less dramatic get into break inherit pink jersey via break lose pink jersey in mountains?

 

[Angliru]

My point is not to talk him up but to warn people not to dismiss the guy as just another over hyped young rider. Richie is fiercely determined, to the point of weirdness, a bit of a ''champions persona' is you ask me.

I'm looking at Porte as the 2nd coming of Wiggins circa 2009. Has a great result in a grand tour, is still under a contract that doesn't reflect the result and is looking to cash in before reality sets in to show that just maybe his surprising performance is just a flash in the pan. He could prove to be the real thing but for me, he needs another year to do so.

 

[jaylew]

He should remember he is one bad season away from going back to nobody.

I think that's exactly the reason he and his agent are looking to re-work or buy out his contract. He could be hurt next year, sick, underperform, etc...I'm not a big fan of it, but it happens all the time in the big team sports.

Steven Kruijswijk (1st year pro, 22 years old) rode his first GT as well, in fact he only heard a few days before that he would take the start, and did better than Porte on almost every climb. I don't hear anyone talking him up as the next great GC hope, though.

Well, he hasn't shown the TT potential of Porte. That's the other part of the equation. I agree with you that the Tour will probably be the best GT for him.

yeah 7th because of a break that gave him ridiculous time. like I said without that not even top 20. not by a long shot

Arithmetic says different.

Without that break, he "would have" finished 11th.
Add the 13 minutes from breakaway and he's 13th ->minus Sastre&Kiserlovski->11th.

Actually, 9th or 10th (you're including Porte's placing), so still in the top 10. He would have been passed by Pinotti and Cunego and would have been virtually even with TGBM. No telling how that would that would have played out if they were within a few seconds of each other - maybe Porte hangs on the climbs a bit longer, maybe Mollema goes a few seconds better in the TT.

Yep your right about Kruijswijk. ANd bear in mind Bauke Mollema is the same age as Porte and he beat Porte on the climbs. And the guy who placed 3rd despite no 13 minute break and is now a gt champion is also Portes age. Thats before you look at the Schlecks, Gesinks, Kreuzigers, Velits, also developing, also Portes age, and way better. So even if Porte is improving i cant see him catching up to these guys.
And thats just his generation. Porte will be in his mid 30s by the time COntador and Valverde and Anton are finished, and the upcoming generation - Henao, TJVG is also going to break that top layer soon.

So for me 7th in a gc a young riders jersey and 2 days in pink is likely as good as its going to get for Porte and its never going to get this good again.

We'll find out, of course, but I think you're really selling the guy short. I believe he's going to improve a bunch in the next several years. He may be 25, but has nowhere near the experience and miles in his legs as most of the above. And this year's Giro was an exceptionally difficult one. To go top 10 there in your 1st year was impressive, I don't care how old you are. If that had been his only result this year I might not be as high on him, but he's been impressive since then (10th at San Sebastian, 4th at Eneco, 4th at Britain) and shown an agressive, attacking style.

That said, I expect a drop off next year as he puts too much pressure on himself and/or overtrains. I figure he'll be be better in 2-3 years.

 

[roundabout]

Isn't Porte's Giro superficially similar to Cadel's first Giro albeit less dramatic get into break inherit pink jersey via break lose pink jersey in mountains?

No. Cadel got the jersey outright and lost it in the final mountain stage.

 

[Nick C.]

No. Cadel got the jersey outright and lost it in the final mountain stage.

You are right, I remember reading the stateg reports etc. and somehow assumed he was in the same break as Heppner. That must have been an odd Tour Garzelli, Simoni and Casagrande all removed for different reasons during the race.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Yep your right about Kruijswijk. ANd bear in mind Bauke Mollema is the same age as Porte and he beat Porte on the climbs. And the guy who placed 3rd despite no 13 minute break and is now a gt champion is also Portes age. Thats before you look at the Schlecks, Gesinks, Kreuzigers, Velits, also developing, also Portes age, and way better. So even if Porte is improving i cant see him catching up to these guys.
And thats just his generation. Porte will be in his mid 30s by the time COntador and Valverde and Anton are finished, and the upcoming generation - Henao, TJVG is also going to break that top layer soon.

So for me 7th in a gc a young riders jersey and 2 days in pink is likely as good as its going to get for Porte and its never going to get this good again.

The guy is a neo pro and others have said that he could drop a kilo or two.

 

[Ferminal]

yeah 7th because of a break that gave him ridiculous time. like I said without that not even top 20. not by a long shot

You are weird, without the break he would've moved down a grand total of three places (10th). On climbing alone, he would have finished around 11th (behind Pinotti, Cunego, Mollema and Gadret).

 

[Sydney21]

I don't blame richie for trying to get out of his contract. I do think that it is important to show respect to the man who plucked him out of nothingness but the Saxo team he signed for a year ago is a completely different team to SBS today. I also want to reiterate that the Giro wasn't his only race he did well in. He was matching it with contenders at San Sebatian who were riding with form off the back of the TDF. They may have been tired but had plenty of time to recover during races.