Ryder Hesjedal - GC Chances

[131313]

You thought he would out climb Cadel? That's OK I guess, Cadel can really blow sometimes. But you thought he would out climb Andy?? ho ho ho.. put the maple syrup down bro, you've had too much.

OK, now that's funny. But I'm not even Canadian! Then again, Hesjedal isn't a real Canadian anyway. We Americans claimed BC long ago. And Victoria? Please...

But no, I didn't think he'd outclimb AS, but I did think he had an outside chance of hanging with the front group (which he almost did) if the politics worked out, and that Cadel may have a bad day.

I didn't really see Astana or Saxo killing themselves to get the jersey this early in the race. Teams that actually are trying to win the race don't want it.

As far as tour potential, if you can finish in the top 10, you're a bada$$ in my book. Maybe some people feel otherwise. I think the Tour is a pretty hard race, and that would be a pretty solid result.

 

[Steel4Ever]

We Americans claimed BC long ago.

Just as China now owns America?

And Victoria? Please...

And your neck of the woods produces exactly how many world class cyclists?

Perhaps if he hailed from the cycling mecca of Dallas or Reno or perhaps even Columbus, Ohio you would consider him"worthy"?


The Good: he fires well when it counts and grabs a top 10.

The Bad: he just can't quite hang with the big boys and manages a top 15.

The Ugly: he cracks on a crucial day and drops outta the top 20.

Whatever happens, I think Garmin will have to look at Ryder in a different way next season. At the very least give the boy a raise!

 

[santacruz]

You did watch stage 3 right? I'd say he launched the odd attack, and when he was caught by some of the best riders in the world, including Cancellara, he attacked for the win in the last km. Didn't win mind you, but he did beat Canc.

Yah that was awesome, I had my fingers crossed for him. That's his style, winning in an epic break away, or snagging a stage win that ends with a punchy little climb (my favorite kind of stage) where you are shouting at the TV screen "no no you are going too early Ryder!! noooo!! oh wait, wait, wait!! HE'S GONNA MAKE IT GO GO GO GOOOO!!" Ryder is an exciting rider, and he should go for stage wins, he should only be a GC rider right now because that's what Garmin needs him to be... but hopefully this is just a one time deal for him.

Unless he starts eating nuclear rice cakes, then by all means go for the GC.

You don't even have to be Canadian to drink too much maple syrup when Ryder is around, by the time stage 3 was over I looked around and I was surrounded by empty Log Cabin maple syrup bottles, I didn't even know what happened, I'd probably be dead right now if he had won that stage.

Here's hoping he sticks around on stage 9 with the leaders and wins the sprint after the descent. Remember how he sprinted past George Hincapie in the Tour of California this year for the win? That was ridiculous, George looked like such a moron, like he forgot someone might try and come from behind him, ha ha.

 

[Steel4Ever]

The Good: he fires well when it counts and grabs a top 10.

The Bad: he just can't quite hang with the big boys and manages a top 15.

The Ugly: he cracks on a crucial day and drops outta the top 20.

From the Col de la Madeleine:

16:11 CEST

Carlos Sastre has been dropped by the yellow jersey group. The 2008 Tour winner has wilted under the pace that is now being set by Astana. Hesjedal also dropped.

Guess that answers that.

Maybe big hills + high pace = too much for him.

 

[Cobblestones]

From the Col de la Madeleine:

16:11 CEST

Carlos Sastre has been dropped by the yellow jersey group. The 2008 Tour winner has wilted under the pace that is now being set by Astana. Hesjedal also dropped.

Guess that answers that.

Maybe big hills + high pace = too much for him.

Yup, pretty much.

 

[roundabout]

Given the difficult start of the day that he had he rode very well, imo. Should probably aim for a stage though, as he's a quite good finisher.

 

[theyoungest]

From the Col de la Madeleine:

16:11 CEST

Carlos Sastre has been dropped by the yellow jersey group. The 2008 Tour winner has wilted under the pace that is now being set by Astana. Hesjedal also dropped.

Guess that answers that.

Maybe big hills + high pace = too much for him.

He was struggling almost from the start, so I guess he's just one of those guys who can't handle rest days very well.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

no disrespect but a top ten seemed very unrealistic to me.

 

[Johnny Rotten]

Lets Be Real

Ryder is awesome but Garmin is gutted. He has no team support and is basicly riding solo. There is no one able to ride for him and to help protect him.

Quote From An Story In Cycling News today, "Clearly, he had been out on his own during the final kilometres of the stage". He has zero team support.

Other then Van Summeren the entire team is out the backdoor, done, cooked like dinner, riding like they are touring the french countryside.

 

[Steel4Ever]

He was struggling almost from the start, so I guess he's just one of those guys who can't handle rest days very well.

I'm the exact opposite.

Rest Days = Supreme Awesomenessness!
Race Days = ...well...I don't race anymore, that should tell you something.

 

[131313]

What has he ever done in the mountains to make people think he could do top-10?

figured I should bump this one

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

I can remember him doing some nice climbing in the Vuelta a few years back, I believe it was 2007.
He was among the 10 best in the first few mountain stages.

But after that he never came close to that level in real mountains. So it was a genuine question by Theyoungest

The 8th place is a big suprise if you go by past results, it would be crazy to disagree with that.
And weird to 'attack' someone on that.

 

[ingsve]

Although he has ridden well this Tour I have a hard time seeing him repeat it in another GT. It simply feels like a perfect storm kind of result.

 

[131313]

I can remember him doing some nice climbing in the Vuelta a few years back, I believe it was 2007.
He was among the 10 best in the first few mountain stages.

But after that he never came close to that level in real mountains. So it was a genuine question by Theyoungest

The 8th place is a big suprise if you go by past results, it would be crazy to disagree with that.
And weird to 'attack' someone on that.

settle down now...

I wouldn't say I'm "attacking him", I was just bringing this thread up since there were a ton of dismissive comments about Hesjdal's ability. I think he'd pretty clearly demonstrated that he had the chops to be up there if he wasn't forced to work for someone else. His results over the last 2 years, and his rides in support of others pretty clearly demonstrated that, at least to me.

I guess I get tired of guys simply being viewed on reputation, or people looking at someone's GC placing and saying "he only finshed 48th before", when there's a lot more to it than that. Sorry to offend anyone.

 

[131313]

Although he has ridden well this Tour I have a hard time seeing him repeat it in another GT. It simply feels like a perfect storm kind of result.

I totally disagree. This wasn't last year's tour, and he's not Wiggens.

I disagree this was a perfect storm. He didn't get huge time in a break (he got some on stage 3, but he lost more than that when was in the break all day and cracked on the final climb). He's always been solid over 3 weeks and he can climb and TT.

What were the circumstances that conspired for him to have a good ride. His incredible team?

 

[ansimi]

I totally disagree. This wasn't last year's tour, and he's not Wiggens.

I disagree this was a perfect storm. He didn't get huge time in a break (he got some on stage 3, but he lost more than that when was in the break all day and cracked on the final climb). He's always been solid over 3 weeks and he can climb and TT.

What were the circumstances that conspired for him to have a good ride. His incredible team?

I agree. He'd already established that he's strong, consistent, and versatile. The only thing fluky was him getting a chance to ride for himself. I suspect the same applies to quite a few others in the peloton.

I know I said before that I'd rather see him lose time and go for a stage win than try for GC but I'm happy with how he played it. He wasn't boring.

 

[Steel4Ever]

The Good: he fires well when it counts and grabs a top 10.

The Bad: he just can't quite hang with the big boys and manages a top 15.

The Ugly: he cracks on a crucial day and drops outta the top 20.

Whatever happens, I think Garmin will have to look at Ryder in a different way next season. At the very least give the boy a raise!

Well...I guess I have to eat my shoe or something!

One bad day does not ruin three weeks of consistent riding.

Chapeau.

 

[never-nude]

I hope this has earned him a permanent role as team leader. Vande Velde seems like a super nice guy and he can hang with most guys when his form is good but I've never seen that he has a real drive to win.

 

[marinoni]

Need to Check Your Facts

I can remember him doing some nice climbing in the Vuelta a few years back, I believe it was 2007.
He was among the 10 best in the first few mountain stages.

But after that he never came close to that level in real mountains. So it was a genuine question by Theyoungest

The 8th place is a big suprise if you go by past results, it would be crazy to disagree with that.
And weird to 'attack' someone on that.

I agree that this result is a bit of a surprise but he did win a mtn stage in the Vuelta last year so your point about him never really reaching that level doesn't make much sense.

 

[Parrot23]

Ryder has been knocking on the door for a while:

2009

Vuelta stage win

5th at San Sebastien

8th at Tirreno overall

11th at Liege

2010

2nd Amstel Gold

5th Tour of California (w stage win)

9th Fleche Wallone.


This isn't somebody who has popped out of nowhere, other than being Canadian, LOL

Consistent rider getting stronger who has never had the opportunity to ride a GT for himself until this Tour.

 

[Steel4Ever]

Don't forget about his Eroica/Montepaschi Strade Bianche campaigns:

2008 and 2009 - 10th
2010 - 5th

 

[Master50]

Ryder can not climb with AC AS or even CE. There is only a slight chance some breakaway shenanigans could happen and land him a spot in yellow for 1 day. But yah, Ryder FTW, I want him to beat AC also lol.

The only previous Tour winner he is stronger than is Oscar Pereiro, lol! But that means he has a chance!

Ok it is after the ultimate climbing stage and just 3 days to the end.

For the doubters about Ryder's abilities, he has shown he is a capable climber and his biggest talent is how he has been getting stronger. I expected he could get a 12th to 16th place and I admit that is an underestimation. The last couple of years he has been riding the Grand tours in support of other objective and still finished quite credibly. This year through Vande Velde's misfortune Ryder got the opportunity I am sure he was looking for. He is showing his potential and at 29 he has a few good years available to him.. These things can transform a young man. I believe he can rise another place or two so I am rooting for 6th in Paris.
Go Ryder and there is going to be a party when you get home. Even the most redneck guys on construction sites knew how well you did today. Victorians are very proud of the home town kid in the tour.

 

[Steel4Ever]

From the 2009 Tour:

Stage 18 40.5km ITT

Contador 48:31
VDB +2:25
Ryder +2:50
Kreuziger +3:16 (-0:26 on Ryder)
Menchov +4:11 (-1:21 on Ryder)


As it now stands (in terms of Ryder moving places):

MENCHOV 0:00
VAN DEN BROECK +1:34
GESINK +2:48
RODRIGUEZ +3:10
HESJEDAL +5:25
KREUZIGER +6:19 (-1:34 on Ryder)
HORNER +6:44 (-1:59 on Ryder)


2010 Tour Stage 19 51km ITT....

Not sure where all this is going ...but RH could very well move up into 6th (based upon past TT performances only).

 

[ingsve]

I totally disagree. This wasn't last year's tour, and he's not Wiggens.

I disagree this was a perfect storm. He didn't get huge time in a break (he got some on stage 3, but he lost more than that when was in the break all day and cracked on the final climb). He's always been solid over 3 weeks and he can climb and TT.

What were the circumstances that conspired for him to have a good ride. His incredible team?

So you think he can consistently finish in the top 10 in GTs from now on?

The perfect storm coment wasn't referring to getting lucky by getting in a long break or anything like that, that's not what I meant. What he has done he has done on his own.

What I mean is a few things. First of all he is in the shape of his life and if he turns up just a little out of shape he'll fall out of the top 10 like a rock. Riders that could be considered consistent top 10 riders have a little more margin of error. People like Menchov, Sanchez, Contador and Schleck will fight for the win if they are in top form but can still finish top 10 if they are slightly out of form.

The way Ryder has ridden this Tour has been a long fight on the edge of his ability pushing himself to keep up. On many occasions he has looking completely exhausted only to fight on and finish in his own tempo. He has done that very well but it's difficult to be consistent with such on the margin efforts. It only takes one bad day for him to end up in the grupetto losing 25 minutes but he has managed to claw his way through his roughest days without losing too much. If you compare this to say Damien Monier who was also fighting on the edge of his ability in GC you see an example of how small the margin is. Had he stayed consistent he would have been top 20 now but he cracked and ended in hte grupetto and lost lots of time. That's how small the margin is.

Ryder is also 30 now so he is in the peak years of his career. He won't be getting much better from now and in a few years he will start to drop.

Then there is of course the issue of VdV dropping out so he could ride for his own chances. Even though Garmin might very well get a chance to ride for his own chances he will also be riding for someone else in some GTs I imagine which will reduce the amount of chances he gets to repeat.

Overall this adds up to a perfect storm finish for me and I find it unlikely that we will see Ryder in the top 10 again.

 

[theyoungest]

Not sure where all this is going ...but RH could very well move up into 6th (based upon past TT performances only).

Based on past TT performances, there's no way he'll beat Gesink in a long TT. He never has. Let alone take nearly 3 minutes on him.