Salvodelli vs Beloki - who will be better remembered?

[Bag_O_Wallet]

Now, I'm not sure if Salvodelli is the best option for this question, but I felt I needed a figure head for the question.

What I'm getting at is who will be better remembered the guy who actually won races (albeit, of smaller stature than the Tour) or the guy that basically won nothing, but podiumed 3 times in the the Tour when the largest amount of eyes were watching?

Salvodelli:
1997 – Rosslotto
Hofbrau Cup
1998 – Saeco
Giro del Trentino – 1st overall; 1 stage win
1999 – Saeco
Giro d'Italia – 2nd overall; 1 stage win
Giro del Trentino – 1st overall; 1 stage win
Trofeo Laigueglia – 1st overall
2000 – Saeco
Tour de Romandie – 1st overall; 1 stage win
Giro del Trentino – 1 stage win
2001 – Saeco
Tour de Romandie – 2 stage wins
2002 – Index-Alexia Aluminio
Giro d'Italia – 1st Overall
2005 – Discovery Channel
Giro d'Italia – 1st overall; Stage 11 win
Tour de France – Stage 17 win
2006 – Discovery Channel
Tour de Romandie – Prologue ITT win
Giro d'Italia – Prologue ITT win; 5th overall
2007 – Astana
Tour de Romandie – 2nd overall; Prologue ITT win
Giro d'Italia – Stage 20 ITT win

Beloki:
1998 – Euskaltel-Euskadi
-
1999 – Euskaltel-Euskadi
-
2000 – Festina-Lotus
1st, Stage 3b (ITT), Tour de Romandie
3rd, Overall, Tour de France
2001 – ONCE-Eroski
1st, Overall, Volta a Catalunya
1st, Points Classification
1st, Stage 1 (Team Time Trial)
1st, Stage 4
1st, Stage 8 (Individual Time Trial)
3rd, Overall, Tour de France
2002 – ONCE-Eroski
2nd, Overall, Tour de France
3rd, Overall, Vuelta a España
1st, Stage 1 (Team Time Trial)
Golden jersey, General classification leader, Stages 1 through 4
2003 – ONCE-Eroski
DNF, Stage 9, Tour de France (2nd overall prior to injury)
2004 – Saunier Duval-Prodir and Brioches La Boulangère
-
2005 – Liberty Seguros-Würth
75th, Overall, Tour de France
2006 – Liberty Seguros-Würth/Team Astana

 

[issoisso]

Savoldelli, for two reasons

One, he won two Giros.

Two, he will always come up whenever the "best downhillers" discussion surfaces.

Also, don't mean to be rude, but you misspelled the man's name several times. Have some respect for him

 

[Moondance]

I actually think it's Beloki...

Every hardcore fan will know of Savoldelli, two Giro victories is obviously fantastic, and '05 was particularly nailbiting.

That said Beloki performed his best at the Tour, and as we all know Tour >>> every other race by a long shot in the eyes of the general public. And three Tour podiums at the height of Arm-mania (as well as that epically horrible crash in '03) will always stick out for fans in general.

 

[BikeCentric]

Savoldelli, for two reasons

One, he won two Giros.

Two, he will always come up whenever the "best downhillers" discussion surfaces.

Also, don't mean to be rude, but you misspelled the man's name several times. Have some respect for him

Exactly, and I'll throw out a third reason: his nick-name "Il Falco" (for the way he swooped off those mountain passes!) has to be one of the coolest nick-names ever. Also, if you ever saw Salvodelli descending during the '05 Giro you will never forget him - I remember literally being scared for HIS life watching the way he descended with reckless abandon. Guy has cojones.

 

[hfer07]

Salvoldelli won 2 GT's so he's on top.
Beloki will be remembered for his unsuccessful campaigns to win a GT but sadly his accident in the 03 TDF seems to be what everyone recognizes him for....

 

[ingsve]

The boring answer is that they will probably both be remembered differently in different countries. Italians will remember Savoldelli more and spaniards will probably remember Beloki

Americans will remember Beloki and say "Savoldelli who"?

The question is, who will be remembered best in for example Belgium where they know their cycling and where they would be equally objective towards the two. My guess would be Savoldelli.

 

[badboygolf16v]

For me, Beloki.

He was a key animator in the best Tour of recent years until his untimely accident.

My memory says he cried on the bike when he lost his lead in the Vuelta on one stage due to sickness. That's passion!

 

[luckyboy]

Hard one this. 2 Giros and the beest downhill thing vs crashing in front of Mighty Lance!

Seriously though, if Beloki didn't crash on the Rochette (was it that?), who knows..

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

who in the hell is salvodelli??

 

[Goldberger]

For the Tour de France *****s as we call them in Norway it will be Beloki, for the allround cycling fan i think Savoldelli. I will remember both equally as great riders from the time i got in to cycling.

 

[Goldberger]

For me it will be Beloki because of the incidents in the 03 tour which is my favourite one by far, by the general cycling public probably Savoldelli.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Once-a-year fans will remember Beloki better. Cycling fans will remember Savoldelli better. For the simple fact that 20 years from now, when people who are new to cycling look at the list of winners of Grand Tours they'll see Savoldelli and internalise that name. Beloki will only be there once they dig into that era.

For the same reason, I don't think Menchov is a better cyclist than Evans, but if they both retired tomorrow, Menchov would be better remembered years from now because of his 3 Grand Tour wins, despite Evans doing better in the Tour.

Basically, the Tour isn't SO much more important than the Giro or Vuelta that coming 3rd in the Tour is better than winning the Giro.

 

[jaylew]

who in the hell is salvodelli??

No kidding. People have never really known how to spell or say his last name correctly.

For the record, Savoldelli, not Salvodelli, guys.

Anyway, I say Il Falco but I'd say Beloki has the better remembered moment of his career. No one will ever forget that crash, if only because we are treated to it and Lance's subsequent grass expedition on a regular basis.

 

[RDV4ROUBAIX]

Whoa! Good to see you jaylew, it's been a while.

Il Falco for sure, such a fitting nickname. I'd have to agree with luckyboy, if Beloki didn't crash in front of LA he'd be quickly forgotten. Savoldelli man, for sure, not only the best flying down a mountain, but from a different standpoint one of the most non-Italian looking Italians I've ever seen.

 

[Boeing]

Il Falco: his descending skill gives him the edge

 

[Michele]

Savoledelli has just started working with italian RAI (by following some races on a motorbike) so for sure in Italy it will be better remembered than Beloki.

But those 2 guys were usually targetting different races; Savoldelli's main goal was usually the Giro while Beloki was more for the Tour and/or Vuelta.

 

[auscyclefan94]

If you want to say better remembered. I would say beloki because of his very famous crash which ultimately ended his stinit at the top of the sport.

Better rider, then go with il Falco.

The reason english speaking countries prononuce or spell names wrong is purely down to liggett and sherwen. because we hear them say it wrong, we say it wrong.

 

[Bag_O_Wallet]

No kidding. People have never really known how to spell or say his last name correctly.

For the record, Savoldelli, not Salvodelli, guys.

Anyway, I say Il Falco but I'd say Beloki has the better remembered moment of his career. No one will ever forget that crash, if only because we are treated to it and Lance's subsequent grass expedition on a regular basis.

My apologies for the incorrect spelling, and sadly, it took me 5 reads to see what the difference was between the two.

I was torn with this one, as I've had limited exposure to Savoldelli's career - magazine articles, race reports, and live updates. Mind you, those writing the history, would (hopefully) have better exposure than I.

I think, over time, Lance's 7 wins will compress into a single entity, and most of the details - to which Beloki was often a big one - will get packed away. Well, apart from his crash that is.

I tested myself with trying to remember the podiums of Indurain's Tour victories vs remembering the Giro winners for those years. No problem for the Giro winners, but, without looking, I've drawn a blank for the 3rd place finisher in '94, and the rest of the podium in the '95 Tour.

So, I'll give the nod to Savoldelli. Even if I can't spell his name.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

savoldelli is the most overrated cyclist to ever win anything in this sport. his giro 2002 win was because the top 4 guys were all either disqualified or kicked out for different reasons or injured, simoni, garzelli, frigo and casagrande, in which case savoldelli took over the jersey last few days when nothing could happen anymore and he rode in the most worthless team. 100% luck

his 2005 giro win was literally bought when bruyneel paid lotto to help him out between finestre and sestriere or else savoldelli would've have even finished on the podium that year but simoni, rujano and di luca would've been top 3.

 

[sida-mot]

Beloki for me.

 

[hector5950]

Exactly, and I'll throw out a third reason: his nick-name "Il Falco" (for the way he swooped off those mountain passes!) has to be one of the coolest nick-names ever.

It is certainly cooler than "The Little Prince". Cuenego should beat the crap out of who ever came up with that. It's even more lame in Italian.

 

[Bag_O_Wallet]

It is certainly cooler than "The Little Prince". Cuenego should beat the crap out of who ever came up with that. It's even more lame in Italian.

But he's pretty much in Lampre colours...

 

[afpm90]

savoldelli is the most overrated cyclist to ever win anything in this sport. his giro 2002 win was because the top 4 guys were all either disqualified or kicked out for different reasons or injured, simoni, garzelli, frigo and casagrande, in which case savoldelli took over the jersey last few days when nothing could happen anymore and he rode in the most worthless team. 100% luck

his 2005 giro win was literally bought when bruyneel paid lotto to help him out between finestre and sestriere or else savoldelli would've have even finished on the podium that year but simoni, rujano and di luca would've been top 3.

I didn't know about this. Could you provide information that supports your claim?

 

[BikeCentric]

I also remember Savoldelli putting in quite a heroic effort in a mountain stage late in the 2005 Giro - it was the one with the dirt roads. He was dropped by Di Luca, Rujano, and Garzelli on the second to last climb but limited his losses, then flew down the descent in typical "Il Falco" style actually gaining quite a bit of time back on the descent. He then completely buried himself on the last climb, taking back more time on the leaders and holding his overall lead. He was isolated with no team-mates and getting the screws turned on him by his 3 top GC competitors who were trying to take his leaders jersey and he held up well. I was impressed.

 

[issoisso]

I also remember Savoldelli putting in quite a heroic effort in a mountain stage late in the 2005 Giro - it was the one with the dirt roads. He was dropped by Di Luca, Rujano, and Garzelli on the second to last climb but limited his losses, then flew down the descent in typical "Il Falco" style actually gaining quite a bit of time back on the descent. He then completely buried himself on the last climb, taking back more time on the leaders and holding his overall lead. He was isolated with no team-mates and getting the screws turned on him by his 3 top GC competitors who were trying to take his leaders jersey and he held up well. I was impressed.

It's the same stage Ryo Hazuki mentions above in his wild claims of teams buying other teams. The dirt roads were on the Colle delle Finestre.

Ardila worked with Savoldelli, yes. That's what riders do. They work together for mutual benefit. Ardila jumped a bunch of places on GC thanks to his efforts on that stage.

Ryo Hazuki also "conveniently" forgets to mention that Di Luca buried himself for former teammate and friend Simoni on that stage, eventually getting dropped after making some quite monster efforts to pull Simoni up the mountain while Simoni was having some bad cramps, while Di Luca should really be attacking to drop Simoni and get on the podium. But of course that doesn't fit with his story, so why should he mention it?