Salzwedel

Page 3 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
Oct 16, 2010
13,578
1
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
sniper said:
Would be good to hear from him in this regard, if only to protect clean athletes in the present-day peloton.
He's on email
cheers.
Though I doubt an email along the lines of
"Dear Bill,
Could you spill the beans on Heiko?
Greetings, Sniper"
is going to bear much fruit.
:cool:
 
Re: Re:

sniper said:
I doubt an email along the lines of
"Dear Bill,
Could you spill the beans on Heiko?
Greetings, Sniper"
is going to bear much fruit.
That's lazy cycling journalists for you, can't even be bothered to work out how to ask the difficult questions.
 
Oct 16, 2010
13,578
1
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
sniper said:
I doubt an email along the lines of
"Dear Bill,
Could you spill the beans on Heiko?
Greetings, Sniper"
is going to bear much fruit.
That's lazy cycling journalists for you, can't even be bothered to work out how to ask the difficult questions.
fair point.
Has Bill ever been active on the forum to your knowledge?
 
Mar 13, 2009
12,232
0
0
oldcrank said:
blackcat said:
oldcrank said:
sniper said:
this is one dodgy guy.
Does anyone find it suspicious that in 2008 Denmark rode Cervelo
when Heiko was at the helm, and in 2012 Russia rode Cervelo and
now GB is on Cervelo! Are motors easier to hide in a Cervelo?? :eek:
nah, just like Daamstard. Daamsgaard gets bikes free from Vroomen, Heiko gets the free bike from CSc, no, Cervelo I mean.

but I ferkin luv the conspiracy, I wish I had come up with it and could take credit. Cos they kicked me out of college because I was plagiarising

#Poe'sLaw
I thought it was for perving on Tamsyn Lewis in the weight room? :)
yeah nah yeah, think that was Baron Coe

but did see her there around 18mnths from Sydney, like I have said before about miss manou. The gym manager was phd and athletics brah, and had the Hawks AFL rules footballers turnstile thru [sic], Graham was a pretty good athlete before he played footy and had to wrestle lockett and ablett et al

mrs manou I mean. think she has to live in Adelaide now, very small 800m runner, like LRP, or TMLRP
 
Jul 3, 2009
17,039
1
0
Re: Re:

sniper said:
the plot thickens...

fmk_RoI said:
A question that came up ...

Arnold alludes to a story behind Salzwedel's departure from the AIS, at the end of 1997, but chooses not to tell it.
this piece relates directly to your question viz. to the sacking of Heiko in 1997/8:
Dear http://www.cyclingnews.com readers:

Today we announce that the Australian Institute of Sport has sacked AIS Road Cycling Coach Heiko Salzwedel. For overseas readers, and perhaps some Australian readers, the significance of this move may be lost. But let me tell you that in my opinion it means that Jonathan Hall, who recently signed a professional contract with Festina-Lotus, will be the last professional rider Australia produces for a long-time. The pipeline that Heiko created which has seen Patrick Jonker, Henk Vogels, Jonathan Hall, Jay Sweet, Alan Iacuone, Robbie McEwen, and more in recent years has been cut off.

A lot of cyclists in Australia have their own versions of the affair. They point to an alleged over-funded, under-achieving National Track program as being instrumental in the downgrading of the road program. They allege that there are petty jealousies tearing the sport apart. They allege that officialdom is out of control and they allege that it does not serve or properly promote our sport. And without naming names they allege drug cover-ups, misuse of funds and more. I may or may not present further evidence on these issues.

But whatever the riders think about all of this, the loser is Australian road cycling which has already begun its decline back into mediocrity. And isn't the Olympics here in 18 months. What a joke!

Laurie Cousins, has sent me another transcript from the ABC radio program, Grandstand with ABC sport's reporter, Tim Gabriel talking with Heiko. Here it is. Sad day here.

bill

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/results/1998/jul98/jul5.html
who's bill and who covered what up?
Bill gave CN away long before the forum arrived...not sure he even gives a cursory glance to cycling these days (at least not on his twitter/blog) but would surely have some war stories.

Interesting story though, there has never(?) been a scandal involving AIS road teams or really, any doping rings orchestrated by Australian riders here or abroad, although blackcat or Hardie will suggest otherwise. Whereas Track of course had Del Monte and all sorts of rumours from the decades before. Strangely now there is no longer the road/track divide - nowadays the track is the main way to produce road cyclists - get identified and in the track team as a teenager and use that to get some junior road experience and 1-2 solid U23 years, all while winning golds. The two are complimentary except its noticeable that the best Australians in Europe tend not to come from that model, I have numerous theories but that's all they are.

I've seen Victor Popov's name come up before and think he may be back in AFL? Google tells me he was Watto's personal physio which doesn't do wonders for your reputation.

And that reminds me, Australia can always claim Gennadi Touretski.
 
Jul 3, 2009
17,039
1
0
blackcat said:
oldcrank said:
blackcat said:
oldcrank said:
sniper said:
this is one dodgy guy.
Does anyone find it suspicious that in 2008 Denmark rode Cervelo
when Heiko was at the helm, and in 2012 Russia rode Cervelo and
now GB is on Cervelo! Are motors easier to hide in a Cervelo?? :eek:
nah, just like Daamstard. Daamsgaard gets bikes free from Vroomen, Heiko gets the free bike from CSc, no, Cervelo I mean.

but I ferkin luv the conspiracy, I wish I had come up with it and could take credit. Cos they kicked me out of college because I was plagiarising

#Poe'sLaw
I thought it was for perving on Tamsyn Lewis in the weight room? :)
yeah nah yeah, think that was Baron Coe

but did see her there around 18mnths from Sydney, like I have said before about miss manou. The gym manager was phd and athletics brah, and had the Hawks AFL rules footballers turnstile thru [sic], Graham was a pretty good athlete before he played footy and had to wrestle lockett and ablett et al

mrs manou I mean. think she has to live in Adelaide now, very small 800m runner, like LRP, or TMLRP
Since when did Mr Manou play AFL?
 
Oct 16, 2010
13,578
1
0
Re: Re:

Ferminal said:
sniper said:
the plot thickens...

fmk_RoI said:
A question that came up ...

Arnold alludes to a story behind Salzwedel's departure from the AIS, at the end of 1997, but chooses not to tell it.
this piece relates directly to your question viz. to the sacking of Heiko in 1997/8:
Dear http://www.cyclingnews.com readers:

Today we announce that the Australian Institute of Sport has sacked AIS Road Cycling Coach Heiko Salzwedel. For overseas readers, and perhaps some Australian readers, the significance of this move may be lost. But let me tell you that in my opinion it means that Jonathan Hall, who recently signed a professional contract with Festina-Lotus, will be the last professional rider Australia produces for a long-time. The pipeline that Heiko created which has seen Patrick Jonker, Henk Vogels, Jonathan Hall, Jay Sweet, Alan Iacuone, Robbie McEwen, and more in recent years has been cut off.

A lot of cyclists in Australia have their own versions of the affair. They point to an alleged over-funded, under-achieving National Track program as being instrumental in the downgrading of the road program. They allege that there are petty jealousies tearing the sport apart. They allege that officialdom is out of control and they allege that it does not serve or properly promote our sport. And without naming names they allege drug cover-ups, misuse of funds and more. I may or may not present further evidence on these issues.

But whatever the riders think about all of this, the loser is Australian road cycling which has already begun its decline back into mediocrity. And isn't the Olympics here in 18 months. What a joke!

Laurie Cousins, has sent me another transcript from the ABC radio program, Grandstand with ABC sport's reporter, Tim Gabriel talking with Heiko. Here it is. Sad day here.

bill

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/results/1998/jul98/jul5.html
who's bill and who covered what up?
Bill gave CN away long before the forum arrived...not sure he even gives a cursory glance to cycling these days (at least not on his twitter/blog) but would surely have some war stories.

Interesting story though, there has never(?) been a scandal involving AIS road teams or really, any doping rings orchestrated by Australian riders here or abroad, although blackcat or Hardie will suggest otherwise. Whereas Track of course had Del Monte and all sorts of rumours from the decades before. Strangely now there is no longer the road/track divide - nowadays the track is the main way to produce road cyclists - get identified and in the track team as a teenager and use that to get some junior road experience and 1-2 solid U23 years, all while winning golds. The two are complimentary except its noticeable that the best Australians in Europe tend not to come from that model, I have numerous theories but that's all they are.

I've seen Victor Popov's name come up before and think he may be back in AFL? Google tells me he was Watto's personal physio which doesn't do wonders for your reputation.

And that reminds me, Australia can always claim Gennadi Touretski.
shane watson? legit...

wrt the boldface, GotDropped when he posted here in 2013 he seemed to be under the impression that some scandal was about to break and was going to implicate members of the AIS in the 90s. But like so often not much seems to have come out of that.
 
Mar 13, 2009
12,232
0
0
Ferminal said:
Since when did Mr Manou play AFL?
he did not. he played for South Australia in the shield cricket, and he played one test in England for Australia I think. But his wife was an Olympic 800 metre runner, I think she made one final, so that would equate to a gold medal in swimming, as if the Australians give a hoot
 
Mar 13, 2009
12,232
0
0
Re: Re:

Ferminal said:
Bill gave CN away long before the forum arrived...not sure he even gives a cursory glance to cycling these days (at least not on his twitter/blog) but would surely have some war stories.

Interesting story though, there has never(?) been a scandal involving AIS road teams or really, any doping rings orchestrated by Australian riders here or abroad, although blackcat or Hardie will suggest otherwise. Whereas Track of course had Del Monte and all sorts of rumours from the decades before. Strangely now there is no longer the road/track divide - nowadays the track is the main way to produce road cyclists - get identified and in the track team as a teenager and use that to get some junior road experience and 1-2 solid U23 years, all while winning golds. The two are complimentary except its noticeable that the best Australians in Europe tend not to come from that model, I have numerous theories but that's all they are.

I've seen Victor Popov's name come up before and think he may be back in AFL? Google tells me he was Watto's personal physio which doesn't do wonders for your reputation.

And that reminds me, Australia can always claim Gennadi Touretski.
I think I only alluded to Gropep peptides in Adelaide, and mebbe the aforementioned insinuated it may have been a race director in Adelaide who provided Saiz with the hook-up for the Gropep in Adelaide for the IGF-II. Which mebbe why the race director who may or may not have been UCI vice Prez under Verbruggen, or McQuaid or both of them as the Veep, why he never went into bat for Allan Davis, and that was a tragedy his career was stalled and ruined in the Puerto investigation, I thought he would have the career that Michael Matthews promises to have. Cos Davis with Rogers was one of the favoured sons at the AIS, and the AIS boys club clique, I thought they would have handled his non-suspension suspension better politically, and he would never have to ride for Gawdawful teams like Mitsubishi Jartazi.

I still think Fuentes IGF-II was from Adelaide. I may well be incorrect on this, we will never have confirmation.
 
May 26, 2010
19,530
0
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
Benotti69 said:
And et the Brits dominated this sport for a long time :rolleyes:
1) Maybe meldonium isn't all that effective;
2) Maybe the Russkies were really crap to begin with and only became a little less crap with the help of meldonium.
3) Maybe it is one part of a cocktail that the athletes take. CIRC mentioned some athletes taking 30+ pills a day.

I doubt that Meldonium is the only thing an athletes is going to take. Heck if you are taking one to cheat might as well have the whole cabinet (if you wont test positive)
 
Re: Re:

Benotti69 said:
I doubt that Meldonium is the only thing an athletes is going to take. Heck if you are taking one to cheat might as well have the whole cabinet (if you wont test positive)
*If* they were using it while winning - *if* they were using it during Salzwedel's time with the team - it wasn't cheating then. Now if your logic is that taking a legal drug means you will obviously take an illegal drug you're going to have to excuse me while I run out of the room and laugh like a loon...
 
Oct 16, 2010
13,578
1
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
Benotti69 said:
I doubt that Meldonium is the only thing an athletes is going to take. Heck if you are taking one to cheat might as well have the whole cabinet (if you wont test positive)
*If* they were using it while winning - *if* they were using it during Salzwedel's time with the team - it wasn't cheating then. Now if your logic is that taking a legal drug means you will obviously take an illegal drug you're going to have to excuse me while I run out of the room and laugh like a loon...
fact is that GB has been beating doped Russian trackies for over a decade now.
logic is that that's unlikely to happen clean.
 
May 26, 2010
19,530
0
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
Benotti69 said:
I doubt that Meldonium is the only thing an athletes is going to take. Heck if you are taking one to cheat might as well have the whole cabinet (if you wont test positive)
*If* they were using it while winning - *if* they were using it during Salzwedel's time with the team - it wasn't cheating then. Now if your logic is that taking a legal drug means you will obviously take an illegal drug you're going to have to excuse me while I run out of the room and laugh like a loon...
You'll have to excuse while i snigger at you missing the WADA code that states taking substances to enhance performance is illegal. But then a pedantic loon like you knows all this :rolleyes:

Or maybe racing track in bad for Russian hearts.....
 
Re: Re:

Benotti69 said:
You'll have to excuse while i snigger at you missing the WADA code that states taking substances to enhance performance is illegal. But then a pedantic loon like you knows all this :rolleyes:
The World Anti-Doping Code bans some substances that are "found to meet two of three criteria (enhances performance, poses a threat to athlete health, violates the spirit of sport)". It doesn't just ban something because it enhances performance. If it did that it would be banning food.
 
May 26, 2010
19,530
0
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
Benotti69 said:
You'll have to excuse while i snigger at you missing the WADA code that states taking substances to enhance performance is illegal. But then a pedantic loon like you knows all this :rolleyes:
The World Anti-Doping Code bans some substances that are "found to meet two of three criteria (enhances performance, poses a threat to athlete health, violates the spirit of sport)". It doesn't just ban something because it enhances performance. If it did that it would be banning food.
I knew the pedantic loon would surface :D ...Meldonium is not a food and obviously "violates the spirit of sport", hence adding it to the list of banned substances.
 
Re: Re:

Benotti69 said:
Meldonium is not a food and obviously "violates the spirit of sport", hence adding it to the list of banned substances.
You appear to know more than most people if you know that it was banned for violating the spirit of sport (as opposed to having been a threat to health). Chapeau.
 
May 26, 2010
19,530
0
0
Re: Re:

fmk_RoI said:
Benotti69 said:
Meldonium is not a food and obviously "violates the spirit of sport", hence adding it to the list of banned substances.
You appear to know more than most people if you know that it was banned for violating the spirit of sport (as opposed to having been a threat to health). Chapeau.
Weak.

Yeah i suppose those 100+ positives since January are all heart conditions......not violations of sport.

That it is now a banned substance, kind of validates it was a PED. That Sharapova allegedly took it for 10 years and is still alive and kicking points to PED rather than health threat, but no doubt you will provide a link to deaths from Meldonium. Russian soldiers were taking it in Afghanistan, so not sure it would be around still if a health risk, unless the enhancement of performance out weighs the health risk.

Would not surprise me if it was added to the banned list at the behest of a 'western' pharma company who wants sales of its heart medication amongst athletes to rise....
 
Now that we've all had time to digest the contents on the McLaren report and the claim within in it about Russian cyclists being protected as part of the State-sponsored doping programme that's been going on over there, could someone remind me again when it was that Salzwedel ceased his involvement with the Global Russian Cycling Project and specifically (if I recall correctly the riders he was most active with) the team pursuit squad?
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY