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mb2612 said:
Who excatly ? Can you go back to the PN topic and show me few members ( as you state ) that are doing so ?
And here's the video of crash I think : http://www.rtve.es/alacarta/videos/...-se-ve-envuelto-caida-peloton-vuelta/1511048/
Aguirre said:
From the coverage that I've seen I think that it's clear that the reaction to sky's acceleration causes the crash. This seems to be Contadors viewpoint too.
mb2612 said:
totally agree, this seems a debate of haters, people dont difference facts, situations, etc
cineteq said:
I didn't see the stage, just followed along on live updates. How did SKY cause the crash?
If they simply upped the pace in order to split the peleton in the wind, and other riders scrambled to catch on and crashed in the scramble, then I can't blame SKY for the crash or for continuing their attack. Now, if they rode like a bunch of p***ks, cutting off riders or forcing them off the road, then eff SKY.
Anyway, Valverde didn't lose that much time. It was about the same amount Contador lost in the '09 Tour when members of his own team seemed to work to make sure he missed a split in the wind
sartoris said:WTF ????
What do you mean by "we all know Valverde???" Give us examples when he acted like Sky or worse.
He didn't wait for Evans when spanish so called "fans" had thrown tacks on the road wich lead to piti winnig the Vuelta so I think he should keep his mouth shut.
Slow motion video of the crash and a few stills from overhead.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9gcr4VhwsE
Having viewed it a number of times it's difficult to say who caused the crash although Flecha was a good 20 bike lengths ahead of the initial impact. Sky had obviously anticipated the cross winds while Movistar were having a day off, seemingly quite happy to surrender the red jersey. Should they have waited?, well seeing as they hadn't gapped anyone of note other than Valverde then it might have been a good idea if only to stop the controversy and ill feelings at the end of the stage, but on the other hand I didn't see Cobo, Contador , Purito or anyone else in that group come to the front and remonstrate with Sky in front of the cameras.
Pete
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9gcr4VhwsE
Having viewed it a number of times it's difficult to say who caused the crash although Flecha was a good 20 bike lengths ahead of the initial impact. Sky had obviously anticipated the cross winds while Movistar were having a day off, seemingly quite happy to surrender the red jersey. Should they have waited?, well seeing as they hadn't gapped anyone of note other than Valverde then it might have been a good idea if only to stop the controversy and ill feelings at the end of the stage, but on the other hand I didn't see Cobo, Contador , Purito or anyone else in that group come to the front and remonstrate with Sky in front of the cameras.
Pete
Sky is the cancer of cycling. F*cked up Tour de France and this is beyond all respect. Especially for someone like Valverde who really is a cycling hero. And even if he's not, you don't treat your collegues like this. If they just would have moved on like they did before Valverde crashed, I would say okay. But this can't be true, such disrespect.
Walkman said:
ha, ha, ha, ha, tacks? I thought tacks were thrown in last Tour de france not before. What kind of cycling are you seeing?
argyllflyer said:
Go watch the youtube of that. Lights were going on the moment they were on the crossing. They would've had to reserve or go forward to be safe. As they had speed, forward was the logical way.
JetSet said:
beñat intxausti did. obviously he is a young, doesnt have the moral authority of... lets say wiggans
I still remember EBH pipi in tour of oman few years ago. Unsportif they claimed then, unsportif twittered wiggans after "english speaker" levi fell in P-N. What do they claim today?
at least they should appologise publicly tomorrow, at least they should have not hammered down as they did
at least they should appologise publicly tomorrow, at least they should have not hammered down as they did
Intxausti was talking to JAF not long after. Whether they were arguing or not, there can be no way Beñat didn't know his teammate had gone down, and therefore unless he's a complete and utter idiot and didn't mention it to Flecha, Sky's argument that they didn't know is completely and utterly voided.
Saying you didn't feel you should wait given the situation would bother me much, much less than this pretending that they didn't know to justify it.
Saying you didn't feel you should wait given the situation would bother me much, much less than this pretending that they didn't know to justify it.
JetSet said:
Watched this a coupel of times now, and i have to say it looks like the sky rider behind Stannard causes Sørensen to crash.
Aguirre said:
What's so funny about being wrong?
Read the interviews Evans did during the Tour and you'll see.
I still can't see anything damning in the video, so I go by what the independent witnesses have said.Herman said:
Sorry in advance for being dumb but can someone explain to me when it became a rule not to attack in a crosswind? Is this some kind of new UCI ruling (I wouldn't put it past them) or is it some sour grapes from riders because they were enjoying a leisurely ride on the stage and didn't want it disrupting?
I honestly can't see how you can say that Team Sky caused the crash. From what I can see (and the footage isn't great to be honest) they attacked aggressively (which is what you should do) in a crosswind section. Movistar got caught in a poor position and were forced into the gutter. They and some others then seemed to have panicked, tried to react but crashed.
I have seen this numerous times in the classics, every year in Qatar and occasionally at the TDF.
People get caught out. People get dropped. People crash. It happens all the time.
Sky riders didn't appear to just ride straight into them so it's not their fault they couldn't stay on their bikes.
I honestly can't see how you can say that Team Sky caused the crash. From what I can see (and the footage isn't great to be honest) they attacked aggressively (which is what you should do) in a crosswind section. Movistar got caught in a poor position and were forced into the gutter. They and some others then seemed to have panicked, tried to react but crashed.
I have seen this numerous times in the classics, every year in Qatar and occasionally at the TDF.
People get caught out. People get dropped. People crash. It happens all the time.
Sky riders didn't appear to just ride straight into them so it's not their fault they couldn't stay on their bikes.
Libertine Seguros said:
"It was not clear what was happening. We knew there was a crash, but we didn’t know who was there. The TV in the team car was not working. I told the guys to ride but not ride full gas" Portal told VeloNews.
"Then other teams pulled through. The race was on. It was not possible to stop at that point."
http://velonews.competitor.com/2012...charges-valverde-falls-and-tongues-wag_235266
Sportsmanship
Hah! I didn't expect to hear the words "moral high ground" and "Valverde" in the same sentence this decade. To hear him talk about sportsmanship - the irony.
However, I think its fair to say Sky don't have the moral or tactical high ground here either. It was funny to hear Froome saying that he hadn't heard much on his radio about the situation and so hadn't heard about Valverde falling. He must have been using the same radio he was using when he dropped Wiggins with his attack in the Tour de France. Certainly if you hear his DS's account of what he did say over the radio.
On the tactical front Sky gained only 54 seconds over a rider who isn't the favourite for the victory. In return they have possibly lined themselves up for a whole lot of trouble during the race - particularly if Froome is leading at any stage. I don't think it was a clever decision to continue with the move.
LugHugger said:
Hah! I didn't expect to hear the words "moral high ground" and "Valverde" in the same sentence this decade. To hear him talk about sportsmanship - the irony.
However, I think its fair to say Sky don't have the moral or tactical high ground here either. It was funny to hear Froome saying that he hadn't heard much on his radio about the situation and so hadn't heard about Valverde falling. He must have been using the same radio he was using when he dropped Wiggins with his attack in the Tour de France. Certainly if you hear his DS's account of what he did say over the radio.
On the tactical front Sky gained only 54 seconds over a rider who isn't the favourite for the victory. In return they have possibly lined themselves up for a whole lot of trouble during the race - particularly if Froome is leading at any stage. I don't think it was a clever decision to continue with the move.
hrotha said:
yeah the overhead video starts with someone already on the ground so doesn't really help.
Terptra and Hansen that is.hrotha said:
So which Sky rider could have been, Porte, Pate?Herman said:
Around about the same time as Sky declared it was illegal to attack on a descent. March.Reverend_T_Preedy said:
So they didn't know who was there. Did Beñat Intxausti not tell Flecha that the race leader was there? Because it's not like he won't have known Valverde was there. Flecha has a radio, doesn't he? Or was that conveniently not working either?cineteq said:
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