Sick and tired of the Spanish cycling federation

[GoGarmin]

Or whatever they're called. Stop condoning doping by "hoping" your riders are clean. Enough already.

Contador got a free pass for OP, and now you're trying to do the same thing when the guy actually failed a test. He flat out failed and the preponderance of evidence suggests the guy was pumping blood bags into his body to help win the Tour. This sends a terrible message to the public, to cyclists and casts suspicion on all Spanish riders.

I'm glad the Norwegian cycling federation called a spade a spade. More people need to do this. It's outrageous that you have a body that's supposed to oversee the sport not only not turning a blind eye to infractions by its riders, but trying to help them cover up the mess.

Sorry for the rant but I'm just fed up with this. There are quite a few positive efforts ongoing to clean up the sport, and then there's this bunch of ostriches with their head consciously stuck deep into the sand.

 

[sniper]

The problem is, Spanish nationalist pride is currently sickly dependent on the nation's success in sports. And for Spanish politicians, focusing on sports is a way of distracting attention away from the rampant economy.

This illustrates:

http://de.eurosport.yahoo.com/radsport/blog/article/2620/

Unfortunately, it's in German. It's about the Zapatero and Juan Carlos backing up Contador in the media, immediately after the UCI's announcement yesterday

 

[Oldman]

Norweigan Fed criticizes Spanish Fed: beginning of Real Progress?

The Norweigan Federation is now vocal on the apparent slack response to Spanish cyclist positive tests. From Valverde to Contador the Norwegian opinion is calling the official Federation effort into question. Could this be the start of actual real sanctions against PED offenders? It looks like a more positive statement than the UCI has been willing to give.

 

[sniper]

The Norweigan Federation is now vocal on the apparent slack response to Spanish cyclist positive tests. From Valverde to Contador the Norwegian opinion is calling the official Federation effort into question. Could this be the start of actual real sanctions against PED offenders? It looks like a more positive statement than the UCI has been willing to give.

Yeah, that's more like it. Pressure on the RFEC really has to build up publicly, i.e. in media and by declarations such as this one. Behind the scenes, not much is gonna happen.

 

[khardung la]

The problem is, Spanish nationalist pride is currently sickly dependent on the nation's success in sports. And for Spanish politicians, focusing on sports is a way of distracting attention away from the rampant economy.

This illustrates:

http://de.eurosport.yahoo.com/radsport/blog/article/2620/

Unfortunately, it's in German. It's about the Zapatero and Juan Carlos backing up Contador in the media, immediately after the UCI's announcement yesterday

That is sooooo simplistic. Spanish national pride is not dependent on what Contador or any other sportman does. The vast majority of the spaniards are proud or not of their country regarding much more important things, cycling and sports are not that important.

Other issue is that politicians USE sport success to appear in the media, to divert attention from real problems and so forth. Because spaniards, like many other citizens in other countries, are very interested on sport.

It is not predominantly a nationalistic issue, it is just that the majority of the sport federations are deeply politicized in Spain. Ashaming.

 

[hrotha]

I don't know, khardung. There's certainly some degree of nationalistic pride in this mess, what with the whole "¿A qué quieres que te gane?" thing and the French conspiracy theories. You're right that it's also about politics and that it's a complicated issue.

Hopefully the external pressure will force the RFEC to do the right thing this once. And if we're extremely lucky, people here will be ashamed of the international image we're projecting and start taking anti-doping seriously.

It's simply unacceptable for the president of the Spanish federation to openly say he hopes everything's resolved favourably to Contador before the process even starts.

 

[Elegant Degenerate]

It's simply unacceptable for the president of the Spanish federation to openly say he hopes everything's resolved favourably to Contador before the process even starts.

Yes. That is the problem in a nutshell.

Though this sort of attitude is rife right throughout professional cycling.

 

[Berzin]

It's simply unacceptable for the president of the Spanish federation to openly say he hopes everything's resolved favourably to Contador before the process even starts.

Just like it is unacceptable when Pat McQuaid says that even if it's proven that Armstrong doped, he still considers him a great champion.

This is why I hope Contador get nothing but a slap on the wrist from the Spanish Federation. It serves cycling good after seven abysmal years of "The Cyclism".

I find it funny that people still think Contador was involved in Opercation Puerto. What's the evidence? His nickname stamped on a piece of paper in Dr. Fuentes' office? A "Pistolero" t-shirt found in his closet? What evidence is there that makes everyone feel he's so guilty aside from hearsay and gossip?

 

[hrotha]

Just like it is unacceptable when Pat McQuaid says that even if it's proven that Armstrong doped, he still considers him a great champion.

Yes, it's the same thing. But this isn't about McQuaid and LA, this is about the RFEC.

 

[therealtimshady]

as far as i have read there vis very little evidence of plastersisers and blood doping just rumours from a german newspaper

 

[Altitude]

Just like it is unacceptable when Pat McQuaid says that even if it's proven that Armstrong doped, he still considers him a great champion.

This is why I hope Contador get nothing but a slap on the wrist from the Spanish Federation. It serves cycling good after seven abysmal years of "The Cyclism".

I find it funny that people still think Contador was involved in Opercation Puerto. What's the evidence? His nickname stamped on a piece of paper in Dr. Fuentes' office? A "Pistolero" t-shirt found in his closet? What evidence is there that makes everyone feel he's so guilty aside from hearsay and gossip?

That'll show them!

What a useless post.

 

[The Hitch]

That is sooooo simplistic. Spanish national pride is not dependent on what Contador or any other sportman does. The vast majority of the spaniards are proud or not of their country regarding much more important things, cycling and sports are not that important.

.

Totally disagree. Other countries maybe, but not Spain.
From everything ive seen "Spanish national pride" is just another way of saying "Spanish national football team"

Perhaps you didnt see what Spain was like on July 11th and 12th of this year. up to 3 million people lined the streets of Madrid to give the football team a parade that lasted 6 hours.

Have you ever seen a parade anywhere in the world that big? What was the celebration?
When Pope John Paul 2 , in Poland seen as god returned to his old city of Krakow, he wasnt able to get crowds that big. Neither was Obama when he became Pres. Hell it was almost as big as Stalins funeral.

Moreover Spain (and others ) actually thought that this event was going to unite the nation. Never mind the history, the civil war, Franco, the different dialacts etc, pick up a Spanish or English newspaper on July 12th 2010 and you would find that all this was going to be forgoten because iniesta scored. Basque and Catalan nationalists were apparently dropping their claims and picking up Spanish flags. Spaniards i know were telling me that they never felt patriotic until then. That it was the first time that people felt confident enough to bring flags out.
Sport is the only think that produces such a reaction in Spain.

Months later i tried to listen to Spanish radio and each time i tried within 5 minutes they would be back to talking about the success of "la roja". Zapateros government in trouble? Whos Zapatero?

Then about 4 months after the fact when the 33 miners were rescued from death, the Chilean papers were comparing the patriotism of the event to Spain winning the world cup. You imagine that. A country saves 33 people from DEATH and it is said that such an event is like what Spain felt when 11 chavs kicked a ball.

Name me one thing other than football that can even come close to producing such a reaction in Spain?

 

[Polish]

Just like it is unacceptable when Pat McQuaid says that even if it's proven that Armstrong doped, he still considers him a great champion.

Yes, both the Spanish Fed and Pat McQuaid speak truthfully in this matter.

Difference, however, is that if Alberto is proven to be a doper, few will consider HIM a Great Champion. He will be remembered as a "donkey doper", kind of like Berzin is remembered today....

This is why I hope Contador get nothing but a slap on the wrist from the Spanish Federation. It serves cycling good after seven abysmal years of "The Cyclism".
?

Gosh, I hope they do not slap the wrist of his Bang Bang hand

 

[sniper]

I find it funny that people still think Contador was involved in Opercation Puerto. What's the evidence? His nickname stamped on a piece of paper in Dr. Fuentes' office? A "Pistolero" t-shirt found in his closet? What evidence is there that makes everyone feel he's so guilty aside from hearsay and gossip?

Your comment shows just how successful the Spaniards have been in covering up the Puerto case.
Whatabout this for a piece of evidence: his initials were on the list, and then disappeared from the list... If the initials weren't Contador's, why would they be taken off the list?

 

[Oldman]

Yes, both the Spanish Fed and Pat McQuaid speak truthfully in this matter.

Difference, however, is that if Alberto is proven to be a doper, few will consider HIM a Great Champion. He will be remembered as a "donkey doper", kind of like Berzin is remembered today....


Gosh, I hope they do not slap the wrist of his Bang Bang hand

I hope they do slap his Bang Bang hand. Do you think Lance will find a way to claim another Tour title if Alberto's legend becomes tainted? He could claim that he would have been on the top step of the podium if he hadn't put so much fine, hard work in as a loyal dometique for Berty.

 

[khardung la]

Totally disagree. Other countries maybe, but not Spain.
From everything ive seen "Spanish national pride" is just another way of saying "Spanish national football team"

Perhaps you didnt see what Spain was like on July 11th and 12th of this year. up to 3 million people lined the streets of Madrid to give the football team a parade that lasted 6 hours.

Have you ever seen a parade anywhere in the world that big? What was the celebration?
When Pope John Paul 2 , in Poland seen as god returned to his old city of Krakow, he wasnt able to get crowds that big. Neither was Obama when he became Pres. Hell it was almost as big as Stalins funeral.

Moreover Spain (and others ) actually thought that this event was going to unite the nation. Never mind the history, the civil war, Franco, the different dialacts etc, pick up a Spanish or English newspaper on July 12th 2010 and you would find that all this was going to be forgoten because iniesta scored. Basque and Catalan nationalists were apparently dropping their claims and picking up Spanish flags. Spaniards i know were telling me that they never felt patriotic until then. That it was the first time that people felt confident enough to bring flags out.
Sport is the only think that produces such a reaction in Spain.

Months later i tried to listen to Spanish radio and each time i tried within 5 minutes they would be back to talking about the success of "la roja". Zapateros government in trouble? Whos Zapatero?

Then about 4 months after the fact when the 33 miners were rescued from death, the Chilean papers were comparing the patriotism of the event to Spain winning the world cup. You imagine that. A country saves 33 people from DEATH and it is said that such an event is like what Spain felt when 11 chavs kicked a ball.

Name me one thing other than football that can even come close to producing such a reaction in Spain?

With all due respect, I am Spanish, and I believe i know a bit about the idiosincracy of my fellow countrymen. I am not going to enter into the catalan, basque, Franco etc... issues, i think it is out of place. People enjoyed the football cup, just like the french did (just remember the huge parade in the Champs Elysees). In a country where showing a flag was unfashionable due to the complex originated after the dictatorship, many people found an excuse to do something that is or should be normal. No big deal, just an oportunity taken to achieve normality. In almost any country showing a flag is normal. Where I live there is almost a flag in every house.

For whatever reason there is a lot of topics and "colour" in the chronicles about Spain coming from our European counterparts. Spain is poorly understood abroad, and I honestly do not understand why. Probably many centuries of topics and isolation have contributed to that. But also misled simplifications that reduce everything to nationalism, Franco etc...

If you check the Spanish newspapers and talk with normal people in Spain you will see that people do forget momentarily about other problems through sport because it is a passionate country (specially with football), but from that to nationalistic pride there is a huge distance.

 

[roundabout]

I find it funny that people still think Contador was involved in Opercation Puerto. What's the evidence? His nickname stamped on a piece of paper in Dr. Fuentes' office? A "Pistolero" t-shirt found in his closet? What evidence is there that makes everyone feel he's so guilty aside from hearsay and gossip?

Congratulations, you're now qualified to serve as the head of the UCI.

 

[sniper]

If you check the Spanish newspapers and talk with normal people in Spain you will see that people do forget momentarily about other problems through sport because it is a passionate country (specially with football), but from that to nationalistic pride there is a huge distance.

So you're basically agreeing with what's been said so far.

 

[Berzin]

Yes, it's the same thing. But this isn't about McQuaid and LA, this is about the RFEC.

No, but the precedent for institutionalized corruption between governing bodies and individual riders/teams began with Armstrong/Verbruggen and continued on with McQuaid.

Contador and the Spanish Federation are a function of the same rot, only on a smaller level. If the Spanish Federation go easy on Contadro, it's just an example of the Armstrong chickens coming home to roost.

Your comment shows just how successful the Spaniards have been in covering up the Puerto case.
Whatabout this for a piece of evidence: his initials were on the list, and then disappeared from the list... If the initials weren't Contador's, why would they be taken off the list?

That's proof? What about DNA evidence tying him to one of the blood bags?

That to me would be proof. Initials? C'mon, man. That's how urban legends get started, just like Bjarne Riis being "Mr. 60%", when the reality is his hematocrit was never that high.

 

[Berzin]

Your comment shows just how successful the Spaniards have been in covering up the Puerto case.
Whatabout this for a piece of evidence: his initials were on the list, and then disappeared from the list... If the initials weren't Contador's, why would they be taken off the list?

That's proof? What about DNA evidence tying him to one of the blood bags?

That to me would be proof. Initials? C'mon, man. That's how urban legends get started, just like Bjarne Riis being "Mr. 60%",= when the reality is his hematocrit was never that high.

 

[hrotha]

No, but the precedent for institutionalized corruption between governing bodies and individual riders/teams began with Armstrong/Verbruggen and continued on with McQuaid.

That's highly debatable, and doing it here would ruin this thread (not all threads need to be about LA, thankyouverymuch).

 

[Oldman]

That to me would be proof. Initials? C'mon, man. That's how urban legends get started, just like Bjarne Riis being "Mr. 60%", when the reality is his hematocrit was never that high.

I called him Senor 60 because it sounded better. If it stuck as "Mr. 60%", I can't explain why.

 

[ergmonkey]

Anybody want to place odds on the Spanish Federation taking all of the following steps?

a) give Contador a reduced ban while publicly declaring that the clenbuterol was conclusively shown to have been accidentally ingested;

b) make sure the ban is long enough to see Contador thrown off of Saxo Bank; and

c) virtually guarantee that Contador comes back to the Tour with Movistar.

 

[brianf7]

Unless we understand properly the whole legal system in spain we must leave it to them.
That is why the UCI will stay out of it for now.
slightest error and it costs them millions in compo and court costs.
We hope that they get it right.;

 

[sniper]

That's proof? What about DNA evidence tying him to one of the blood bags?

That to me would be proof. Initials? C'mon, man. That's how urban legends get started, just like Bjarne Riis being "Mr. 60%", when the reality is his hematocrit was never that high.

If you get the chance, (re-)watch Blood and Games, and see how Jaksche smiles when the reporter asks him what the initials AC on Puerto's dopingsheet could stand for other than for Alberto Contador. (They're drawing on a copy of the original sheet, so no urban legends there.)

Admittedly, it aint evidence in the true sense, but the funny thing is: it all fits. If you aint willing to see the writing on the wall...well...join the AC fanclub.