Stage 16: Pinzolo – Aprica 177 kms:Where legends are made

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Apr 9, 2014
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Eshnar said:
red_flanders said:
Well once again there is relevance in discussing chaingate and other times when people waited (or not) when having a discussion of whether someone should have waited or not attacked. Especially when one of the protagonists in chaingate is involved in the subsequent discussion.

Not sure why the moderator reaction to something fairly obvious. If it gets out of hand, just ask people to move on. No need to attempt to eliminate any discussion of a relevant incident.
It's already out of hand. We got pictures of Andy Schleck in here already and now there's people debating what he'll be remembered for.
There are other threads for this out there.
It's a stage thread which will die of its own accord in short order. People come here to discuss and debate. Can't possibly see the issue as long as the discussion is respectful.
 
Aug 4, 2010
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Re: Stage 16: Pinzolo – Aprica 177 kms:Where legends are mad

yep, dont damage this thread with stupid schlecks and chaingates.This is Aprica stage :)

to add myself to those posters who mentioned it...chapeau to Bole! what a ride :) ,also all the sprinters and roulers, I hope I'll climb the Mortirolo by myself one day.
 
Bole is certainly a surprise but at least he's shown some good form on the easier stages.

Montaguti finished in the same group. He's been in a few breakaways in this race and been one of the first to be spat out on each occasion
 
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Psalmon said:
Did anyone ask Contador whether climbing the Mortirolo on Basso's back wheel presented a problem with gearing? I know these guys are pretty specific and plan quite a lot of detail into their machines. Looked at some points today that AC couldn't get into the right zone climbing out of the saddle.
he said post stage that Basso's wheel had "el mismo desarrollo"
Basso had the same rear cogs as Contador
 
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bambino said:
This is so wrong. Kruijswijk rode on the front for the most part on Mortirolo, but it doesn't really matter to be in first or second position when the incline is so steep.

On the descent and on Aprica Contador clearly did the most work. No to take anything away from Kruijswijk, but it's just plane wrong that he worked more than Contador in the group.
I'm not sure we looked the same race or you must've had continuous camera for the leading trio. I'm still 100% confident that I didn't see Bertie passing Steven more than maybe 5 times after they formed the trio, each time not more than maybe 30 seconds.[/quote]

Contador was leading for the entire descent. On Aprica he also did the most work.
 
Sep 20, 2011
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Seriously, get your eyes checked. They lost 35 seconds on that descent to both Trofimov and Amador and only once Kruijswijk starting pacing again they won time. You're the one talking bs.
 
Oct 6, 2009
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pastronef said:
Psalmon said:
Did anyone ask Contador whether climbing the Mortirolo on Basso's back wheel presented a problem with gearing? I know these guys are pretty specific and plan quite a lot of detail into their machines. Looked at some points today that AC couldn't get into the right zone climbing out of the saddle.
he said post stage that Basso's wheel had "el mismo desarrollo"
Basso had the same rear cogs as Contador
Maybe this explains why Basso is nowhere to be found in the climbs :D
 
Mar 13, 2015
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I'm wondering with all the incidental misfortune Conti has experienced in this Giro if it will really take away or diminish energy/efforts for the Tour. It's been rough on everyone, but not everyone is doing the double let alone try to win both...
 
Nov 16, 2011
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Mongolian Mayhem said:
I'm wondering with all the incidental misfortune Conti has experienced in this Giro if it will really take away or diminish energy/efforts for the Tour. It's been rough on everyone, but not everyone is doing the double let alone try to win both...
Probably the case if Landa keeps up his alien form. Aru is cooked, no worry there. Obviously lots of time for Bert so has no real worries but Astana ready to reap fortune from mishap so Bert can't let Landa go until the final 1k mark. It's going to be a lot of energy usage to ensure Landa, who came out of nowhere, isn't going to get his chance. Not exactly what Bert was thinking about going into this tour.
 
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SafeBet said:
What a super stage this was.
Chapeau to all the riders, but my personal favorite today was Stevo Kruijswijk: amazing! Can't believe he lost so many minutes in the first week.
Yes a great stage but Aru would be very disappointed. The signs were there in previous stages and he had a mechanical at a bad time but then so did Contador. Crazy stage. Landa probably should have attacked earlier but it's always a gamble to attack from distance. If Landa can improve his TT he will be a real threat in future GTs. Of course it would also help if Contador was not in those future GTs !
 
Jul 16, 2011
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movingtarget said:
Yes a great stage but Aru would be very disappointed. The signs were there in previous stages and he had a mechanical at a bad time but then so did Contador. Crazy stage. Landa probably should have attacked earlier but it's always a gamble to attack from distance. If Landa can improve his TT he will be a real threat in future GTs. Of course it would also help if Contador was not in those future GTs !
By attacking, Landa would have had to measure his efforts over 35km with no support. By waiting and attacking at the end, he probably gained as much, if not more, time and used less energy. He might be able to forge a temporary alliance with Kruiswijk (or parasite on him, depending on your view of the last 35km yesterday) to try and gap Bertie (everyone else is weaker), but Bertie's strategy will now switch to sticking to Landa rather than distancing Aru. Anyway, time is running out. Landa might be slightly stronger than Bertie in the mountains, but Astana's hand is getting weaker every day now.
 
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staubsauger said:
Landa would at least have been within an 1 (1/2) minute(s) window, to secure there's still a challenge ahead on Finestre, if he had just attacked earlier!
How would he have made up 3.5 minutes? It would have been him vs Contador (&Kruijswijk) on the descent and flat/false flat. No way he wouldn't have blown up at some point.
 
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LaFlorecita said:
staubsauger said:
Landa would at least have been within an 1 (1/2) minute(s) window, to secure there's still a challenge ahead on Finestre, if he had just attacked earlier!
How would he have made up 3.5 minutes? It would have been him vs Contador (&Kruijswijk) on the descent and flat/false flat. No way he wouldn't have blown up at some point.
It may've been him, it may've been Contador to crack.

We will never know. Sadly enough!

Aru cracked. That's for sure. But the check he paid could've been much bigger as well.
 
What we have seen so far is that Landa and Contador are very equal, maybe, just maybe, with a slight edge to Landa in the mountains. If Landa had rode his own pace on Mortirolo he would likely have kept the gap as it was at the bottom (45-50 seconds) or maybe gained a few seconds. On the descent, however, I would give the edge to Contador.

Landa could probably have gained between 30 and 60 seconds, surely not more.
 
Brilliant from Contador. A ride to add to the rides in Plateau de Beille, Fuente De, Verbier and Annecy in making the man a legend. He is far from my favourite rider, but I admire his panache, guts and attitude to racing. Rarely does he complain, and I liked his post-race comments.

Brilliant from Landa. It is rubbish to say he is the strongest in the race, but he is possibly (marginally) the strongest climber in the race. Pity he can't time trial for ***. I think if he were leader of Astana from Day 1, he would have been maybe a minute closer. And as others have said, let's not forget the (bad) luck "enjoyed" by Contador. That said, I think Landa will win a GT if he manages to maintain his elevated performance level.

Kruijswijk was immense. I only realised last night how much time he lost on Stage 4. He would be right in the mix if he hadn't had a nightmare on that day. It annoys me so much that people blame his team for his sub-par performances in the last few years. Maybe he is to blame? Or maybe he struggled for fitness? The Rabofail jokes are a bit old now I think.

I think Betancur has rediscovered his mojo. I would like to see him in Le Tour as I think the route suits him enough for a chance of a surprise result. However, I think it asks too much for him to recover in time, so I guess he goes for La Vuelta.

Aru was absolutely immense, too. People seem to forget that he rode a lot of the race by himself in the final 40km or so, The final climb to Apirca is the type of climb that is very tough to do solo. I thought he would lose 10 minutes, or hang on for life on a group like the Konig group, so big chapeau to him. Also those saying he will never be a GT contender are being silly, I think. Maybe he won't win one, but he was contending until yesterday. And he is young, and a feisty fighter. Even though he lost a place on GC, his team leadership and any chance of pink in Milan, yesterday was the day that he really impressed me more than any other.

A great day in probably the best GT since the Arroyo Giro (as I always think of it). Giro 2015 still has a few twists yet, I feel. Hard to see AC lose it now, but at least we know that Landa is strong enough and brave enough to successfully put Alberto under pressure. Albeit it is almost impossible to see him claw back over two minutes.
 
Re: Stage 16: Pinzolo – Aprica 177 kms:Where legends are mad

Watched the stage again and didn't think it [i.e. Contador's performance] was as "epic" as yesterday's viewing.

Contador was surrounded by teammates on the flats, on the Mortirolo he had numerous riders pacing him up, and he quickly caught up to a Mikel Landa who had an Aru anchor around his neck.

I didn't see anything special in what Contador did. We all know he is highly capable of catching riders on a climb but he was at most only 50 seconds behind.

If he came back to proper GC riders such as Nibali, Froome and Quintana who were working together at a high pace, then yes you could say his ride was special.

Edit: The stage itself was tremendous viewing. Lots of different things going on.
 
Re: Stage 16: Pinzolo – Aprica 177 kms:Where legends are mad

Savant12 said:
Watched the stage again and didn't think it was as "epic" as yesterday's viewing.

Contador was surrounded by teammates on the flats, on the Mortirolo he had numerous riders pacing him up, and he quickly caught up to a Mikel Landa who had an Aru anchor around his neck.

I didn't see anything special in what Contador did. We all know he is highly capable of catching riders on a climb but he was at most only 50 seconds behind.

If he came back to proper GC riders such as Nibali, Froome and Quintana who were working together at a high pace, then yes you could say his ride was special.
Ok. :eek:
 
Martinelli has today (to anyone's surprise?) said that Katusha had already begun pulling at the front, and that they didn't know why Contador wasn't present - thus directly contradicting Landa's post-stage comments yesterday.

Surprise, surprise!
 
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infeXio said:
Martinelli has today (to anyone's surprise?) said that Katusha had already begun pulling at the front, and that they didn't know why Contador wasn't present - thus directly contradicting Landa's post-stage comments yesterday.

Surprise, surprise!
What's the difference with Landa's comments?
 

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