State of the Peloton 2025

[houtdffan]

Fascinating article. But not sure I agree that nutrition is anything more than a minor contributor to speed increases. Nutrition has always been a big focus in endurance sports it didn’t suddenly become more advanced since 2020. I come from an Ironman triathlon background and we focused hugely on nutrition back in the 90s.

I’d say speed increases are more about how the peloton races these days. I might even suggest that since Pogacar’s arrival the rest of the peloton has been forced to up their game. I am more interested in climbing times. I am still gobsmacked by stage 15 in the TdF.

Plateau de Beille was when Remco tried to use the Tsar Bomba in an antimatter fight.

Does not look like he's making the same mistake this year. Wonder what methods they are using this year now that CO huffing was banned (of course they are still doing it, and of course they have found something better)

 

[Unchained]

If races in the pro peloton has increased in speed, why would local races not do the same ?

It's a question I have asked myself since the subjects around nutrition, gear and training has become the defacto narrative around why speed has gone up.

Wouldn't it be plausible for the amateurs to also race faster since they adopt the same techniques as the pros ? The literature is available to everyone and information is shared, so it should be doable to question this aspect.

Local races in my area( S. California and N. Baja) are noticeable faster than years back, Speeds at Chicago Grit are also faster than previous..

 

[AttaqueDeRolland]

No stopping UAE this season. Now Vine is also getting into it. 36 wins on the year. If you add Lidl-Trek and Visma's wins, they'd still be 8 wins short. Unparalleled domination from the Saunier-Duval boys. 🤡

 

[AmRacer]

No stopping UAE this season. Now Vine is also getting into it. 36 wins on the year. If you add Lidl-Trek and Visma's wins, they'd still be 8 wins short. Unparalleled domination from the Saunier-Duval boys. 🤡

A normal average Remco would've won today.

 

[AttaqueDeRolland]

A normal average Remco would've won today.

Yeah, and if Steff Cras didn't crash out he'd have won Asturias instead of Soler, and if MvdP hadn't been sick he'd have won De Ronde instead of Pogi, and, and, and ...

You can keep inventing hypotheticals, downplaying, and relativizing. The bottom line is that UAE, aka Saunier-Duval 2.0, is winning and dominating at unparalleled levels.

 

[Red Rick]

No stopping UAE this season. Now Vine is also getting into it. 36 wins on the year. If you add Lidl-Trek and Visma's wins, they'd still be 8 wins short. Unparalleled domination from the Saunier-Duval boys. 🤡

And they're doing it without a top sprinter.

 

[Red Rick]

Nah, only actual doping in the junior ranks...

My junior tennis coach told my parents my brother should get on HGH. Then you suddenly see all the new young ATP players being 190 cm+. I'm no math genius but I can put 2 and 2 together.

 

[AmRacer]

If Remco and Jonas had raced normal schedules, they would have together won 10-15 of UAE's victories

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Fascinating article. But not sure I agree that nutrition is anything more than a minor contributor to speed increases. Nutrition has always been a big focus in endurance sports it didn’t suddenly become more advanced since 2020. I come from an Ironman triathlon background and we focused hugely on nutrition back in the 90s.

I’d say speed increases are more about how the peloton races these days. I might even suggest that since Pogacar’s arrival the rest of the peloton has been forced to up their game. I am more interested in climbing times. I am still gobsmacked by stage 15 in the TdF.

I suppose a drastic increase in sugars consumption make them more likely to have their peak power available after 5 hours of racing (like on PdB) but it obviously doesn't up the peak power itself. Other factors must be in play. But what can be more efficient than unlimited EPO? (without hitting absurd blood values on top of that)

Plateau de Beille was when Remco tried to use the Tsar Bomba in an antimatter fight.

Good one!

 

[E_F_]

Then you suddenly see all the new young ATP players being 190 cm+.

This sounds funny to me when every teenaged boy in Denmark is at least two metres tall.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

My junior tennis coach told my parents my brother should get on HGH. Then you suddenly see all the new young ATP players being 190 cm+. I'm no math genius but I can put 2 and 2 together.

Wow. At what age?
A friend of mine got administered steroids even before full puberty in a post-soviet setting in weight-lifting. Completely *** up her hormones for life.
It didn't take me to get to know her to have almost no illusions about what's going on in professional sports, but it took away any last ones I had.

 

[Red Rick]

Wow. At what age?
A friend of mine got administered steroids even before full puberty in a post-soviet setting in weight-lifting. Completely *** up her hormones for life.
It didn't take me to get to know her to have almost no illusions about what's going on in professional sports, but it took away any last ones I had.

14 or 15 IIRC. And it's not like there were any prospects or ambitions of going pro

 

[Tim Cahill]

Objectively speaking UAE need to sign Kooij, what the *** are they doing with Molano in that team.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Objectively speaking UAE need to sign Kooij, what the *** are they doing with Molano in that team.

2025 Classic Brugge-De Panne

The 2025 Classic Brugge-De Panne was won by Sebastian Molano of UAE Team Emirates-XRG.

firstcycling.com

But objectively speaking, they should just buy back Philipsen.

 

[Tim Cahill]

2025 Classic Brugge-De Panne

The 2025 Classic Brugge-De Panne was won by Sebastian Molano of UAE Team Emirates-XRG.

firstcycling.com

But objectively speaking, they should just buy back Philipsen.

A low blow reminding us all of that fluke, his Cro Race win far more honourable.

 

[Cookster15]

I suppose a drastic increase in sugars consumption make them more likely to have their peak power available after 5 hours of racing (like on PdB) but it obviously doesn't up the peak power itself. Other factors must be in play. But what can be more efficient than unlimited EPO? (without hitting absurd blood values on top of that)

Ya, but peak power for a few minutes thanks to sugars certainly doesn't explain beating Pantani's record by 3 1/2 minutes in a 40 minute climb. I don't see how it could be unlimited EPO as that means serious corruption. I mean Vinokourov was busted in the 2007 TdF for homologous blood transfusion. The EPO test was available in 2000.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Ya, but peak power for a few minutes thanks to sugars certainly doesn't explain beating Pantani's record by 3 1/2 minutes in a 40 minute climb. I don't see how it could be unlimited EPO as that means serious corruption. I mean Vinokourov was busted in the 2007 TdF for homologous blood transfusion. The EPO test was available in 2000.

By peak power I actually meant the highest one can generate on a given climb (i.e. threshold power in case of long climbs), not some short 5-minute VO2max power. So maybe "best power" is a more fitting term.

 

[Cookster15]

By peak power I actually meant the highest one can generate on a given climb (i.e. threshold power in case of long climbs), not some short 5-minute VO2max power.

It can't be nutrition (sugars) that explains PdB. PdB is a 40 minute climb even for Pogacar. Sugars don't last anything close to 40 minutes when cycling at FTP power.

This is a good article:

The Three Energy Systems and How They Relate to Cycling

Energy production in organisms comes from the controlled breaking of complex molecules into simpler ones. For us humans, we break ATP (adenosine triphosphate) down into ADP (adenosine diphosphate) by popping off one of the phosphate molecules. The energy produced in this process is used by our...

www.sparksinto.life

1. Immediate ATP-CP (sprinting)
2. Short term anaerobic (up to 3 minutes)
3. Long term aerobic (over 3 minutes)

The main advantage of the Anaerobic system is that it can provide energy for some two minutes

The Aerobic system is relied on heavily by most cyclists. Any effort greater than two minutes is mostly aerobic, so for every one of us except track sprinters and BMX racers, the value of the Aerobic system cannot be understated. Improving the efficiency of this system is paramount to success in the sport of cycling and is the system most professional cyclists spend their time improving.

So this rules out nutrition. It must be some form of sophisticated blood doping. And it can't be only Pogi and UAE either.

 

[Nomad]

I mean Vinokourov was busted in the 2007 TdF for homologous blood transfusion. The EPO test was available in 2000.

Didn't they get his blood bags mixed up or something? Lol

 

[veganrob]

Ya, but peak power for a few minutes thanks to sugars certainly doesn't explain beating Pantani's record by 3 1/2 minutes in a 40 minute climb. I don't see how it could be unlimited EPO as that means serious corruption. I mean Vinokourov was busted in the 2007 TdF for homologous blood transfusion. The EPO test was available in 2000.

But it was Vino.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

It can't be nutrition (sugars) that explains PdB. PdB is a 40 minute climb even for Pogacar. Sugars don't last anything close to 40 minutes when cycling at FTP power.

Well, absolutely. That's what I was trying to say. And it's not just VO2max power but FTP, which means they must have trained a lot of time with boosted VO2 parameters (as @Red Rick mentioned in the past) to finetune their threshold and be able to operate for a long time at a large percentage of (already enormous) VO2max.

 

[Brullnux]

I heard a hilarious rumour that Piccolo was supplying Alberto Bettiol growth hormone that is used on horses. Wild I know, the guy who told me has a history of being both very wrong and very right so it could just be bollocks.

Recall Bettiol coming out very strongly against him so who knows. Who really cares at this point anyway, I think I'd probably do the same, hopefully he sorts Hugh Carthy out, guy looks like he needs it.

Apparently he's just found a new supplier

 

[Ripper]

Didn't they get his blood bags mixed up or something? Lol

Vino and Kash messed it up! I believe that's also what occurred with Tyler and Santi at the Vuelta.

I don't think there have been too many cases (possibly no recent cases?) where 'pure' blood doping has been nailed without the users making mistakes.

I believe the rumor/theory at the time about Contador was that the clenbuterol gave WADA the ticket to bust him, but there was some evidence it was blood bags

 

[Rackham]

So, Caleb Ewan pulls the plug and stops his career with immediate effect. That's after winning a stage last month in Itzulia and his transfer to Ineos.

Clinic related? Yes or no?

It's open to speculation IMO.

 

[pastronef]

So, Caleb Ewan pulls the plug and stops his career with immediate effect. That's after winning a stage last month in Itzulia and his transfer to Ineos.

Clinic related? Yes or no?

It's open to speculation IMO.

NO clinic related stuff. know a few would like it to be (I took a look on the French side of twitter) but no, he stops on his own terms