Study suggests Tramadol enhances TT performance by ~ 5%

[budegan]

Let me break it down for you buddy.

What you have in the first link is a GB rider saying that there's a problem with Tramadol. Regardless of whether the Tweet within the tweet is there or not it's relevant to this thread, and I would have thought interesting to people visiting here.

My comment in the second link: "MAYBE NOT".

BTW congratulations on writing something that isn't as typo strewn as your published material :lol:

 

[Craigee]

Re:

Let me break it down for you buddy.

What you have in the first link is a GB rider saying that there's a problem with Tramadol. Regardless of whether the Tweet within the tweet is there or not it's relevant to this thread, and I would have thought interesting to people visiting here.

My comment in the second link: "MAYBE NOT".

BTW congratulations on writing something that isn't as typo strewn as your published material :lol:

he gets worked up whenever we mention someone from GB in this section.

 

[Craigee]

No need for tests regarding Tramadol. Just hook all the GB and Sky riders to a lie detector and ask them if they improve on it. My guess is it is performance enhancing just on the fact they all take a lot of it in competition and are urged by their staff to take it. Just one of their marginal gains.

 

[veganrob]

Re:

In some of the articles implicating tramadol in cycling crashes, authors make statements such as "like other opioids, tramadol causes drowsiness", as if that is a matter of fact, and furthermore a factual cause of crashing. I don't really believe it - but I can see how there might be a correlation, more like:

- on tramadol, feeling over-confident could cause a rider to "zone out" mentally in a situation where they should actually have been more nervous about their bike handling (blunting of fear response)
- dopers not being on a consistent dose of tramadol, for example using a huge amount on a certain day, then "coming down" from the high when the dose is discontinued on another day (withdrawal symptoms)

You make good points. Opioids, like any medications, can affect people differently. In the 80's I was a farrier. Craigee can appreciate that. Being too tall and thin and shoeing many, many horses I developed serious back problems. I was given Tylenol and Codeine for pain. Unike others, it turned me into a working machine. No pain at all. It didn't blunt my senses at all, except maybe common sense.
So I could totally see it blocking the pain for cyclists and have them oush past that point to something that could be dangerous.
And as an added bonus, couple beers with the drugs and I was still good. Didn't work like that, but I did not get drowsy at all. Just felt like Superman.

 

[yaco]

Tramadol is not a loophole in the rules - For some reason WADA considers it to be a non-prohibited substance.

 

[DanielSong39]

Well, it's legal.

 

[Freddythefrog]

Re:

Well, it's legal.

Yep but not apparently in Egypt
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-44194346

In December 2017 British woman Laura Plummer was jailed for three years for bringing 300 Tramadol painkiller tablets into Egypt. While the sentence shocked many in the UK, the case shone a light on a painkiller addiction problem blighting millions of Egyptians.

Like many young Egyptians, he started by taking one quarter of a 100mg tablet to get high.
"I felt like I was a superhero," he says. "I could do anything."

Good job the GIRO start was in Israel not Egypt or that driver of the Sky van with the team meds in could have been in some trouble.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/michael-barry-and-team-skys-unethical-use-of-legal-medication/

Sky - the clean team - the one with marginal gains.

 

[Koronin]

Or maybe it should be on a list of banned while in competition, but allowed for something like you're in the hospital with a broken bone and need surgery? Although I'd think for something like they the hospital can get a waver for a specific rider for just about any medication while they're in the hospital.

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

Or maybe it should be on a list of banned while in competition, but allowed for something like you're in the hospital with a broken bone and need surgery? Although I'd think for something like they the hospital can get a waver for a specific rider for just about any medication while they're in the hospital.

That's what TUEs are for and yes, you can get a TUE for anything you need while in hospital/for treatment etc.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Well, it's legal.

Yep but not apparently in Egypt
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-44194346

In December 2017 British woman Laura Plummer was jailed for three years for bringing 300 Tramadol painkiller tablets into Egypt. While the sentence shocked many in the UK, the case shone a light on a painkiller addiction problem blighting millions of Egyptians.

Like many young Egyptians, he started by taking one quarter of a 100mg tablet to get high.
"I felt like I was a superhero," he says. "I could do anything."

Good job the GIRO start was in Israel not Egypt or that driver of the Sky van with the team meds in could have been in some trouble.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/michael-barry-and-team-skys-unethical-use-of-legal-medication/

Sky - the clean team - the one with marginal gains.

Tramadol is legal in Egypt, it's a controlled substance and prescription only. It can only be brought into the country with permission from, I think, the ministry of health. That's why she was sentenced, for possession.

 

[May0maniac]

You'd think that they'd ban it as soon as possible, now that it getting a rep for being used by the Islamic State, you'd think than not a single sport, or WADA in general would be willing to be associated with something like that.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/03/italian-police-intercept-tramadol-haul-isis-libya

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

You'd think that they'd ban it as soon as possible, now that it getting a rep for being used by the Islamic State, you'd think than not a single sport, or WADA in general would be willing to be associated with something like that.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/03/italian-police-intercept-tramadol-haul-isis-libya

This is getting a little political, I'll just point out that many sports in the very recent past and future either have or will be associating themselves with some very questionable places, much more than a coincidence like this.

 

[May0maniac]

Re: Re:

You'd think that they'd ban it as soon as possible, now that it getting a rep for being used by the Islamic State, you'd think than not a single sport, or WADA in general would be willing to be associated with something like that.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/03/italian-police-intercept-tramadol-haul-isis-libya

This is getting a little political, I'll just point out that many sports in the very recent past and future either have or will be associating themselves with some very questionable places, much more than a coincidence like this.

Yes, I get what you're saying I was just thinking that getting associated with something like that could be a potential PR nightmare for a team and cause some heat from the sponsors.

 

[DanielSong39]

How much do motors enhance TT performance?

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

How much do motors enhance TT performance?

Go ask in the relevant thread.

 

[Robert5091]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cycling-rife-with-tramadol-use-wada-report-shows/

Cycling is far from having cleaned up its act when it comes to drugs, a new report from the World Anti-Doping Agency shows. The agency released the data from its Monitoring Programme - where it tracks the use of substances that are not on the banned list but are being tracked for potential abuse. Tramadol, a synthetic opioid painkiller, showed up in over four per cent of all doping controls tested - a rate an order of magnitude higher than in any other endurance sport.

2017 Monitoring Program Figures report at
https://www.wada-ama.org/en/media/news/2018-06/wada-publishes-2017-monitoring-program-figures

Cyclists taking Tramadol, who'd believe it? :surprised:

 

[Sciatic]

Re:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cycling-rife-with-tramadol-use-wada-report-shows/

Cycling is far from having cleaned up its act when it comes to drugs, a new report from the World Anti-Doping Agency shows. The agency released the data from its Monitoring Programme - where it tracks the use of substances that are not on the banned list but are being tracked for potential abuse. Tramadol, a synthetic opioid painkiller, showed up in over four per cent of all doping controls tested - a rate an order of magnitude higher than in any other endurance sport.

2017 Monitoring Program Figures report at
https://www.wada-ama.org/en/media/news/2018-06/wada-publishes-2017-monitoring-program-figures

Cyclists taking Tramadol, who'd believe it? :surprised:

Interesting to see, but that 4% figure would still be just tip of the iceberg. I would be interested to know what "showed up in 4 % of all doping controls" means? Is there a threshold above which they say, "yes, there's tramadol", but that is set high enough that tramadol use is not showing up?

 

[Ripper]

Re: Re:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cycling-rife-with-tramadol-use-wada-report-shows/

Cycling is far from having cleaned up its act when it comes to drugs, a new report from the World Anti-Doping Agency shows. The agency released the data from its Monitoring Programme - where it tracks the use of substances that are not on the banned list but are being tracked for potential abuse. Tramadol, a synthetic opioid painkiller, showed up in over four per cent of all doping controls tested - a rate an order of magnitude higher than in any other endurance sport.

2017 Monitoring Program Figures report at
https://www.wada-ama.org/en/media/news/2018-06/wada-publishes-2017-monitoring-program-figures

Cyclists taking Tramadol, who'd believe it? :surprised:

Interesting to see, but that 4% figure would still be just tip of the iceberg. I would be interested to know what "showed up in 4 % of all doping controls" means? Is there a threshold above which they say, "yes, there's tramadol", but that is set high enough that tramadol use is not showing up?

It means out of the doping tests performed (controls), 4% were positive for Tramadol. If you think of doping tests as a form of random sampling, then the 4% might represent the whole population. But I am not so sure you can consider doping like a random sample, as there is some selectivity to doping controls. My guess would be overall Tramadol use is greater than the 4.4% identified.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

Interesting to see, but that 4% figure would still be just tip of the iceberg. I would be interested to know what "showed up in 4 % of all doping controls" means? Is there a threshold above which they say, "yes, there's tramadol", but that is set high enough that tramadol use is not showing up?

The report is available to read. It shows that in 2017, out of 12,554 samples, 548 (4.37%) showed traces of Tramadol in excess of 50ng/mL. Codeine (in excess of 50ng/mL) showed up in 45 of those samples (0.36%).

Similarly, out of 3,199 IC samples 121 (3.78%) showed traces of Glucocorticoids in excess of 1ng/mL while it was 21 out 479 (4.38%) for OOC samples.

To put the samples tested figure in context, it is worth noting that in 2016 in excess of 23,000 samples were tested across all cycling disciplines. The 2017 figure is not yet available.

So, one in twenty-three samples showed the presence of Tramadol. Which is notable, yes, but is hardly widespread or unchecked.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

If you think of doping tests as a form of random sampling, then the 4% might represent the whole population. But I am not so sure you can consider doping like a random sample, as there is some selectivity to doping controls. My guess would be overall Tramadol use is greater than the 4.4% identified.

But as the selectivity is tilted toward those assumed to be most likely to be doping, you could also guess that overall Tramadol use is less than the 4.37% identified.

 

[samhocking]

Agreed, the winning riders always give a sample, so the 4.37% is likely to be less in the winning riders as diluted by the non-winners also giving their random samples. Hard to say how much. It's top 3 finishers of the stage, overall GC leader and then random 3 from bunch over the line give urine I believe? Samples include out of competition too I think.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

Interesting to see, but that 4% figure would still be just tip of the iceberg. I would be interested to know what "showed up in 4 % of all doping controls" means? Is there a threshold above which they say, "yes, there's tramadol", but that is set high enough that tramadol use is not showing up?

The report is available to read. It shows that in 2017, out of 12,554 samples, 548 (4.37%) showed traces of Tramadol in excess of 50ng/mL. Codeine (in excess of 50ng/mL) showed up in 45 of those samples (0.36%).

Similarly, out of 3,199 IC samples 121 (3.78%) showed traces of Glucocorticoids in excess of 1ng/mL while it was 21 out 479 (4.38%) for OOC samples.

To put the samples tested figure in context, it is worth noting that in 2016 in excess of 23,000 samples were tested across all cycling disciplines. The 2017 figure is not yet available.

So, one in twenty-three samples showed the presence of Tramadol. Which is notable, yes, but is hardly widespread or unchecked.

It's also worth noting that the numbers are not as high as they have been in previous reports. A 2015 Monitoring Program report showed 12,358 samples tested and 730 (5.91%, or one on seventeen) of them showing traces of Tramadol above 200ng/mL (compared with above 50ng/mL for the 2017 report). The 2013 report shows 832 returns (6.5%, or fifteen) from 12,797 samples, also at the >200ng/mL level. As with the 2017 figures, these relate solely to IC tests (OOC samples not checked for Tramadol).

 

[proffate]

Re: Re:

If you think of doping tests as a form of random sampling, then the 4% might represent the whole population. But I am not so sure you can consider doping like a random sample, as there is some selectivity to doping controls. My guess would be overall Tramadol use is greater than the 4.4% identified.

But as the selectivity is tilted toward those assumed to be most likely to be doping, you could also guess that overall Tramadol use is less than the 4.37% identified.

you can't make any conclusions about what this means without knowing the glow time and use patterns for Tramadol. It could very well be that 100% of cyclists use it, but each is only glowing 4% of the time.

 

[Ripper]

Re: Re:

If you think of doping tests as a form of random sampling, then the 4% might represent the whole population. But I am not so sure you can consider doping like a random sample, as there is some selectivity to doping controls. My guess would be overall Tramadol use is greater than the 4.4% identified.

But as the selectivity is tilted toward those assumed to be most likely to be doping, you could also guess that overall Tramadol use is less than the 4.37% identified.

You could guess that. The main point being, I don't know if the number is representative of the population, so to speak. It all depends on what kind of targeting is being done, etc. Given Tramadol is not banned, it could easily be used by lots of riders who are not 'suspect', per se.

Overall, it's an interesting finding. It's not a drug I am comfortable having in the peloton, as I would not want someone crashing into me or getting overly agro. But the click bait of "rife" was a bit funny.

 

[hmronnow]

Not sure if this was already pointed out, but it seems to me it is 4% of all controls, including out of competition controls.
This means either 4% of riders use tramadol so often that it shows up outside competition, or if riders do not use it outside competition, the percentage using it in competition is higher.