Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[jotafap]

I'm not drawing any conclusions. I thought the Dauphine TT showed he was in poor shape, then he crushed everyone in the mountains.

Yeah exactly, for me today doesn't mean anything regarding is form.

 

[HashRouge]

Meanwhile, Pogacar uploaded to Strava and the climbing numbers are diabolical.

I genuinely can't tell if this means they were good or bad.

 

[Extinction]

I'm not drawing any conclusions. I thought the Dauphine TT showed he was in poor shape, then he crushed everyone in the mountains.

Remind me how that went. At any rate, he/they programed for the WCRR, but, if he rode the TT it's because he gambled for the win on this course. Now, everbody talks about Remco making "excuses", but honestly, if we were to hold Pogi to the same standards, I heard that from him today. Not that I take stock in it, just sayin.

 

[tobydawq]

I genuinely can't tell if this means they were good or bad.

Of course bad, Rick would never praise a performance that is not way above par.

 

[Jan the Man]

And then, but I won't put anything beyond Pogacar, but still actually getting caught by Remco, could and I say could, be an indication that his form is problematical with a week to go.

I guess it could be but I don’t think his performance today is a big indicator. He was fine in Montreal and would have won but for the gift.

 

[Red Rick]

I genuinely can't tell if this means they were good or bad.

The VAM numbers on the hills, considering they're short climbs, are really poor. The first climb for example is 6 minutes at 1500 VAM, which is low even for 5% cause it's only 6 minutes. For reference, Sobrero did 8'30 at 1600 VAM on Torricelle in the 2022 Giro final stage.

Pogacar himself did 1650 VAM for 18 minutes on La Turbie in 2024.

So unless I way overestimate the watts on the downhill sections here, the numbers will look really, really poor. Which would go to say that the result is heavily down to adaptation to super tough conditions rather than it being a bunch of *** TTers after all.

 

[KoopaCycling]

if he could breezewalk Montreal, he's conditioning is just fine

lol, seems jan and I were thinking the same thing.

 

[Extinction]

I guess it could be but I don’t think his performance today is a big indicator. He was fine in Montreal and would have won but for the gift.

Exactly, but Montreal didn't have the same field as what's to come. But he's Pogi, yet getting caught by Evenepoel was shocking.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Remind me how that went. At any rate, he/they programed for the WCRR, but, if he rode the TT it's because he gambled for the win on this course. Now, everbody talks about Remco making "excuses", but honestly, if we were to hold Pogi to the same standards, I heard that from him today. Not that I take stock in it, just sayin.

Another one comparing Remco to Pogacar.
Pogacar has been saying he was sick before Canada when he raced Quebec.
Remco says his condition is great and preparation was good and then he collapses and find excuses.
C'mon, it's not hard to see differences.

 

[HashRouge]

Another one comparing Remco to Pogacar.
Pogacar has been saying he was sick before Canada when he raced Quebec.
Remco says his condition is great and preparation was good and then he collapses and find excuses.
C'mon, it's not hard to see differences.

I don't know why anyone has an issue with riders explaining why they think a particular competition didn't go well to be honest. Whether it's Pog, Remco or Ayuso.

 

[scribers]

Remco has solidified himself as an extraordinary ITT champion. Not even a match for the big and strong specialists. Now a mountain oriented TT champion

 

[Berniece]

Another one comparing Remco to Pogacar.
Pogacar has been saying he was sick before Canada when he raced Quebec.
Remco says his condition is great and preparation was good and then he collapses and find excuses.
C'mon, it's not hard to see differences.

Indeed, one rider is already looking for excuses before the race has been raced.

 

[Cycling111]

Pogacar had already mentioned the problems he had before Canada. It's very different from saying everything was going perfectly and then suddenly, after a loss, saying it was a lie that he was fine and that he was injured or sick.

But compared to others, you can't say Pogacar is a rider who makes excuses. We have to be honest and admit that's not the case for him.

 

[Extinction]

Another one comparing Remco to Pogacar.
Pogacar has been saying he was sick before Canada when he raced Quebec.
Remco says his condition is great and preparation was good and then he collapses and find excuses.
C'mon, it's not hard to see differences.

No, you don't understand, when Remco gets beat and says his prep was sub-optimal, it's one thing; when Pog does it's another. Remco could even say, for example, my summer was crap, because I crashed bad in December, and this is why my Tour sucked. And everbody would shout, oh what excuses! It's a double standard.

 

[Cycling111]

He was surpassed by Remco. It was a humiliation.

It's something that already happened to him with Ganna, and this is the only specialty in which Remco is better than Pogacar. It would be humiliating if Remco left Pogacar on a mountain or if Pogacar were the one to beat Remco in a time trial like this.

Losing today while Ganna, who should be there, is at home out of cowardice, I don't consider it humiliation.

Obviously, Pogacar is the most exposed to suffering humiliations because he's the one who dares the most. Where was Ganna today? Where will Vingegaard be on Sunday and at the rest of the world championships? If you don't move from your comfort zone, you won't be humiliated.

Today, Pogacar played the role that Ganna was supposed to play: being the main rival of a time trial specialist. They had to sell the race like this because Ganna and Tarling didn't want to expose themselves.


Nibali comment:

Nibali was lucky and knew how to choose his schedule well to rack up victories. But I prefer him to others who are supposedly better and are always complaining and not really dismantling what they demand.
Besides, Nibali was brave; he also generated some victories by not just standing there, like San Remo, for example.

 

[Berniece]

It's something that already happened to him with Ganna, and this is the only specialty in which Remco is better than Pogacar. It would be humiliating if Remco left Pogacar on a mountain or if Pogacar were the one to beat Remco in a time trial like this.

Losing today while Ganna, who should be there, is at home out of cowardice, I don't consider it humiliation.

It was humiliating. He was expected to challenge Evenepoel, and got overtaken by him. He started a whole 2min30s ahead, and was dropped on the climb that supposedly suits Pogacar better. It was bad.

 

[Extinction]

It's something that already happened to him with Ganna, and this is the only specialty in which Remco is better than Pogacar. It would be humiliating if Remco left Pogacar on a mountain or if Pogacar were the one to beat Remco in a time trial like this.

Losing today while Ganna, who should be there, is at home out of cowardice, I don't consider it humiliation.

Obviously, Pogacar is the most exposed to suffering humiliations because he's the one who dares the most. Where was Ganna today? Where will Vingegaard be on Sunday and at the rest of the world championships? If you don't move from your comfort zone, you won't be humiliated.

Today, Pogacar played the role that Ganna was supposed to play: being the main rival of a time trial specialist. They had to sell the race like this because Ganna and Tarling didn't want to expose themselves.


Nibali comment:

Nibali was lucky and knew how to choose his schedule well to rack up victories. But I prefer him to others who are supposedly better and are always complaining and not really dismantling what they demand.
Besides, Nibali was brave; he also generated some victories by not just standing there, like San Remo, for example.

That's a bit harsh on Ganna, who faught like a lion in San Remo against MVDP and Pog twice. So I don't think he chickened out, but only knew he could not show up in top form. But I agree with you, he should have been there today.

 

[AlpRaid]

...I don't consider it humiliation.

oh...it was humiliation.

Pog to return the favor in a week, most likely.

 

[Cycling111]

I do remember Cycling111 being worried a few weeks ago that he hadn't been seen out on his TT bike very much.

Nothing, just one day they posted an Instagram post here.

The rest of that week he uploaded 200-kilometer mountain trainning to Strava .

And we also mentioned that the trip to Canada was a bad idea for a time trial. They can't call that an excuse; we warned about it beforehand.
He wouldn't have won today's time trial, but the difference between not finishing second today and finishing fourth, I think, may lie in these reasons.
Jay Vine had never beaten Pogacar in a time trial. I don't know about Van Wilder, but Pogacar had never been beaten by a teammate, even if the teammate was in good shape.

I thought Pogacar wouldn't win, and I explained those reasons. But I did think he'd finish second. On a bad day, I thought he would finish third. Today's performance is more mediocre than I expected.

For me, his ITT in Australia was better. He finished sixth, but was a flat ITT, the startlist was better, he didn't lose as much time, and he didn't seem as fatigued at the finish.
In the Dauphine, he had a bad time trial, but he didn't seem as exhausted either.

He definitely did things wrong. Without those bad things, he should have finished second, about a minute behind.

 

[Peyroteo94]

No, you don't understand, when Remco gets beat and says his prep was sub-optimal, it's one thing; when Pog does it's another. Remco could even say, for example, my summer was crap, because I crashed bad in December, and this is why my Tour sucked. And everbody would shout, oh what excuses! It's a double standard.

Remco beated Pogacar fair and square. If Pogacar was at his best? I don't think so, but this was a total humiliation. There are no excuses for such a poor performance. I would love people to be honest like me (call me whatever you want but I don't hide even when I say such horrible takes. Yes, I said Pogacar would destroy Remco). Pogacar sucked and deserved to lose. A reality check is good here and there. I'm pretty sure he thought the RR would be a walk in the park but probably doesn't think that anymore.

 

[AlpRaid]

Remco beated Pogacar fair and square. If Pogacar was at his best? I don't think so, but this was a total humiliation. There are no excuses for such a poor performance. I would love people to be honest like me (call me whatever you want but I don't hide even when I say such horrible takes. Yes, I said Pogacar would destroy Remco). Pogacar sucked and deserved to lose. A reality check is good here and there. I'm pretty sure he thought the RR would be a walk in the park but probably doesn't think that anymore.

fair.

but he did not suck. he finished 4th -- his best ever placing.

perhaps your self-congratulating "honesty" needs to lean into giving credit where it is due: remco.

 

[Monsi]

Remco beated Pogacar fair and square. If Pogacar was at his best? I don't think so, but this was a total humiliation. There are no excuses for such a poor performance. I would love people to be honest like me (call me whatever you want but I don't hide even when I say such horrible takes. Yes, I said Pogacar would destroy Remco). Pogacar sucked and deserved to lose. A reality check is good here and there. I'm pretty sure he thought the RR would be a walk in the park but probably doesn't think that anymore.

Only the fans and some media think of this, not Pogacar himself.

 

[Cycling111]

well I do remember some interviews where he said he was targeting the ITT and wanted to measure himself directly against remco.

that didn't turn out so well, though he got his best placing ever, and possibly the illness he had had a big effect (tho he certainly seemed fine in Montreal). I still think Pog fans are over-reacting. I still expect a domination by him in the RR.

No, in fact, he even said it was difficult to compete with Remco.
Some websites used a lot of clickbait, posting challenging words that he didn't say.
Without Ganna and Tarling, some media have sold a story that not even Pogacar has said.

I've told you before that he isn´t trained a lot. For him, taking the time trial bike is training, because he never takes it after the Tour. But two or three days for someone who's not a specialist is nothing. Remco is a specialist and has trained for weeks for this day; Pogacar, who had to beat the specialist, has only trained for a couple of days. That's training, but ridiculously insufficient.

 

[Extinction]

Remco beated Pogacar fair and square. If Pogacar was at his best? I don't think so, but this was a total humiliation. There are no excuses for such a poor performance. I would love people to be honest like me (call me whatever you want but I don't hide even when I say such horrible takes. Yes, I said Pogacar would destroy Remco). Pogacar sucked and deserved to lose. A reality check is good here and there. I'm pretty sure he thought the RR would be a walk in the park but probably doesn't think that anymore.

I'm not acusing you of dishonesty, but in general applying the same standards. Pog made "excuses" today, as he has the right to do. But this isn't the case for Remco critics. At any rate, Evenepoel today lived up to every acolade given him, even when the December crash devastated his season and all the stress with having to leave Soudal.

 

[snipeheem]

I'm not acusing you of dishonesty, but in general applying the same standards. Pog made "excuses" today, as he has the right to do. But this isn't the case for Remco critics. At any rate, Evenepoel today lived up to every acolade given him, even when the December crash devastated his season and all the stress with having to leave Soudal.

What excuses he made today?