Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[tobydawq]

I should not hijack the Pog thread but isn’t it so that none of today’s best riders have been able to avoid major injuries - some to such an extent that it have been career altering?

Alaphilippe, Van Aert, Pidcock, Van der Poel, Van Baarle, Groenewegen, Van Avermat, Sagan and many more. And now also Pogacar. The intensity and the competition in the peloton is immense and sooner or later even the most skilled is down and out. Someone wrote it would be great to see all of the big names coming up against each other and in peak form but that it’s almost impossibly unlikely given the fact that accidents happen regularly. Makes you wonder if the current churn of riders will ever allow any more Valverdes riding successfully into their late thirties?

Is a broken wrist really a "major injury" in the grand scheme of things?

 

[Extinction]

I should not hijack the Pog thread but isn’t it so that none of today’s best riders have been able to avoid major injuries - some to such an extent that it have been career altering?

Alaphilippe, Van Aert, Pidcock, Van der Poel, Van Baarle, Groenewegen, Van Avermat, Sagan and many more. And now also Pogacar. The intensity and the competition in the peloton is immense and sooner or later even the most skilled is down and out. Someone wrote it would be great to see all of the big names coming up against each other and in peak form but that it’s almost impossibly unlikely given the fact that accidents happen regularly. Makes you wonder if the current churn of riders will ever allow any more Valverdes riding successfully into their late thirties?

I can't see how Evenepoel's fractured hip in three places at il Lombadia and then having to learn to walk again, didn't make your list of riders with career altering crashes. He lost 1.5 years in the come-back, which has clearly gone well. Pog's broken wrist should, fortunately for him, be a walk in the park by comparison.

 

[Barkintheeye]

I can't see how Evenepoel's fractured hip in three places at il Lombadia and then having to learn to walk again, didn't make your list of riders with career altering crashed. He lost 1.5 years in the come-back, which has clearly gone well. Pog's broken wrist should, fortunately for him, be a walk in the park by comparison.

"...and many more." But yes he should also be on the list.

 

[Extinction]

"...and many more." But yes he should also be on the list.

Well the most standout mishap of the last several years was glaringly missing. In terms of precoscious talent being arrested, I can't think of anything worse except Lemond getting shot (although Greg, unlike Remco, was at his peak at the time).

 

[Aimar16]

MotoGP guys hardly ever miss a race (if they miss) because of wrist injuries. I don't understand why they're talking about Pog missing up to six weeks. Maybe UAE rushed this surgery and could have gone to a better specialist. Stroll was driving an F1 car a week after breaking his wrist.

 

[fox]

I should not hijack the Pog thread but isn’t it so that none of today’s best riders have been able to avoid major injuries - some to such an extent that it have been career altering?

Alaphilippe, Van Aert, Pidcock, Van der Poel, Van Baarle, Groenewegen, Van Avermat, Sagan and many more. And now also Pogacar. The intensity and the competition in the peloton is immense and sooner or later even the most skilled is down and out. Someone wrote it would be great to see all of the big names coming up against each other and in peak form but that it’s almost impossibly unlikely given the fact that accidents happen regularly. Makes you wonder if the current churn of riders will ever allow any more Valverdes riding successfully into their late thirties?

A broken wrist with a recovery time of about a month is not a major, career altering injury. It is just a minor setback in the season which will result in a change of training schedule for the upcoming months. It is not ideal for the Tour preparation, but lets not exaggerate.

 

[Extinction]

MotoGP guys hardly ever miss a race (if they miss) because of wrist injuries. I don't understand why they're talking about Pog missing up to six weeks. Maybe UAE rushed this surgery and could have gone to a better specialist. Stroll was driving an F1 car a week after breaking his wrist.

Possibly because, unlike MotoGP, a cyclist carriers more weight on the bars.

 

[Barkintheeye]

A broken wrist with a recovery time of about a month is not a major, career altering injury. It is just a minor setback in the season which will result in a change of training schedule for the upcoming months. It is not ideal for the Tour preparation, but lets not exaggerate.

The point really was if we will see the all/most of the big names coming up against each other & at peak form or will injuries / accidents prevent that from happening?

At MSR and RVV I believe we can say that many (most) were present and at good/peak form (Remco and Roglic missing). At Paris-Roubaix almost yes. Amstel and FW no. LBL no.

 

[CyclistAbi]

I should not hijack the Pog thread but isn’t it so that none of today’s best riders have been able to avoid major injuries - some to such an extent that it have been career altering?

Alaphilippe, Van Aert, Pidcock, Van der Poel, Van Baarle, Groenewegen, Van Avermat, Sagan and many more. And now also Pogacar. The intensity and the competition in the peloton is immense and sooner or later even the most skilled is down and out. Someone wrote it would be great to see all of the big names coming up against each other and in peak form but that it’s almost impossibly unlikely given the fact that accidents happen regularly. Makes you wonder if the current churn of riders will ever allow any more Valverdes riding successfully into their late thirties?

Yes. Unfortunately cycling, pro peloton, is one of the sports on where it's guaranteed you will get injured. And on top of that unfortunately riders safety isn't taken seriously, by the governing bodies. Changing that will be a slow and painful process. But i am optimistic things will improve over time. There is more media coverage in regards to this subject and lately riders themself started speaking out. Lastly Tao shared his opinion on the subject. In the past such attempts were bluntly dismissed. But now more and more it's becoming the norm. That is the idea things can and must improve in the future. Running away from such responsibility, by the governing bodies, that hence is becoming harder and harder task.

 

[Bolder]

I do hope this is a relatively minor setback and doesn't hurt his Tour prep. But, otoh, i think having enforced time off from racing may have helped Remco and Primoz. Sometime a reset away from race intensity can be beneficial.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Getting your wrist broken is not in any way a good thing. After LBL the plan to "reset" was scheduled anyway. Hence it would be much much better to "reset" healthy then with a broken wrist.

 

[theyoungest]

The point really was if we will see the all/most of the big names coming up against each other & at peak form or will injuries / accidents prevent that from happening?

At MSR and RVV I believe we can say that many (most) were present and at good/peak form (Remco and Roglic missing). At Paris-Roubaix almost yes. Amstel and FW no. LBL no.

Crashes and injuries (be it slight or serious) are just part of cycling. Pogacar has been able to avoid most of it, now he's less lucky but that doesn't mean that he won't be in good shape come July. Unless he's really completely off the bike for a few weeks, but I doubt that's the case.

 

[Aimar16]

Possibly because, unlike MotoGP, a cyclist carriers more weight on the bars.

MotoGP riders regularly feel around 1.3 - 1.5G under braking

 

[Gratemans]

Is a broken wrist really a "major injury" in the grand scheme of things?

Aside from that, Valverde completely trashed his knee in that horrible crash in the opening Tour TT in Dortmund. He made quite the comeback after that I'd say.

 

[Extinction]

MotoGP riders regularly feel around 1.3 - 1.5G under braking

Well, then, maybe also the length of cycling races and their frequency makes the situation more delicate?

 

[CyclistAbi]

When a "no name" rider breaks his wrist. Nobody bothers. When a rider like Pogi breaks his wrist. That will always spark debates. Currently i see there is a rather apologetic culture involved. Like most of the discussions geared towards it's just bad luck, nothing can be done, he will be back on the bike tomorrow, rider X had it much worse ... Personally this doesn't sound much like caring or encouraging or helpful. To me it feels like lets just hide it under the rug. So nobody should be called to do anything about it. Basically it's saying lets be lazy. Only one person in this whole debate bothered to even look into it. On why it happened. And if that is acceptable or not. This culture needs to change in the future. Safety must be taken more seriously.

 

[Salvarani]

When a "no name" rider breaks his wrist. Nobody bothers. When a rider like Pogi breaks his wrist. That will always spark debates. Currently i see there is a rather apologetic culture involved. Like most of the discussions geared towards it's just bad luck, nothing can be done, he will be back on the bike tomorrow, rider X had it much worse ... Personally this doesn't sound much like caring or encouraging or helpful. To me it feels like lets just hide it under the rug. So nobody should be called to do anything about it. Basically it's saying lets be lazy. Only one person in this whole debate bothered to even look into it. On why it happened. And if that is acceptable or not. This culture needs to change in the future. Safety must be taken more seriously.

People also just focus a lot on the physical aspects and dont even mention the mental ones.

Getting injured in the last race, when he has was supposed to have some time off after it, and then getting his preparation for the Tour disturbed by this will be frustrating.

"He will be on a trainer in a week".... it doesnt sound very fun.

Physical wounds will heal but other things may take longer and have more impact during the preparation.

 

[Extinction]

When a "no name" rider breaks his wrist. Nobody bothers. When a rider like Pogi breaks his wrist. That will always spark debates. Currently i see there is a rather apologetic culture involved. Like most of the discussions geared towards it's just bad luck, nothing can be done, he will be back on the bike tomorrow, rider X had it much worse ... Personally this doesn't sound much like caring or encouraging or helpful. To me it feels like lets just hide it under the rug. So nobody should be called to do anything about it. Basically it's saying lets be lazy. Only one person in this whole debate bothered to even look into it. On why it happened. And if that is acceptable or not. This culture needs to change in the future. Safety must be taken more seriously.

It happened because of a race situation, which practically nothing can be done about. That's not indifference, but fatalistic acceptance of a sport with inherent dangers.

 

[tobydawq]

Aside from that, Valverde completely trashed his knee in that horrible crash in the opening Tour TT in Dortmund. He made quite the comeback after that I'd say.

Exactly.

 

[Aimar16]

Well, then, maybe also the length of cycling races and their frequency makes the situation more delicate?

Well, he had no plans to race for the next month and a half

 

[CyclistAbi]

It happened because of a race situation, which practically nothing can be done about. That's not indifference, but fatalistic acceptance of a sport with inherent dangers.

Maybe a shovel of asphalt would be able to prevent it? Based on the pre race inspection. Who knows. AFAIK there is no analysis of the incident available i could read. Some social media posts and that is it.

Anyway. When we will get from this apologetic, luck,karma, esoteric ... culture to somebody at UCI actually resigning for objective reasons. When UCI No.1 brakes a bone. Then likely injuries will still be a part of this sport. But much left often.

For now it hence makes sense to at least response to this lazy nonsense. All beginnings are hard. But i see riders speaking out. Things are changing slowly. We'll get there.

 

[mrgmyers]

I know this is the Pog thread and will attract his fans, some of whom do seem a little bit FanBoy obsessive but regardless of that, the guy is a pro cyclist and he had a crash like many others have done, I hope he is not in too much pain and gets well soon but surely that is it?

 

[Extinction]

Maybe a shovel of asphalt would be able to prevent it?

I think they try and patch up the roads before race day, but obviously on a 260 km course things can slip by.

 

[Nick2413]

Maybe a shovel of asphalt would be able to prevent it? Based on the pre race inspection. Who knows. AFAIK there is no analysis of the incident available i could read. Some social media posts and that is it.

Anyway. When we will get from this apologetic, luck,karma, esoteric ... culture to somebody at UCI actually resigning for objective reasons. When UCI No.1 brakes a bone. Then likely injuries will still be a part of this sport. But much left often.

For now it hence makes sense to at least response to this lazy nonsense. All beginnings are hard. But i see riders speaking out. Things are changing slowly. We'll get there.

There are minor things that can be done like better route design and attention to road quality, but any more than that is basically asking for the sport to be shut down. The real question is if we will be allowed to have sports that are inherently dangerous in the coming years and decades, with the way the media and moral posturing works.

 

[CyclistAbi]

I think they try and patch up the roads before race day, but obviously on a 260 km course things can slip by.

Who? UAE?

I know this is the Pog thread and will attract his fans, some of whom do seem a little bit FanBoy obsessive but regardless of that, the guy is a pro cyclist and he had a crash like many others have done, I hope he is not in too much pain and gets well soon but surely that is it?

One thing i know for sure is and that is currently nobody is obsessive about safety in pro peloton. Is the last thing on the list and nobody wants to be bothered about it. From personal point of view i can't even believe on how bare minimum discussions we are having about this aspects. And even that is like Mont Everest to some. It's like the safety culture is obsessive with not doing anything else but to ignore safety.

There are minor things that can be done like better route design and attention to road quality, but any more than that is basically asking for the sport to be shut down. The real question is if we will be allowed to have sports that are inherently dangerous in the coming years and decades, with the way the media and moral posturing works.

Cycling will like always survive just fine. In my opinion what will change is such lack of responsibility and disregard to taking safety seriously. This in my opinion will change. The sooner the better.

In general if i remember correctly Sagan said he won't say anything due to making things worse. But at least he said that. Now a cyclist like Tao says it out loud and in general there is no real backslash involved anymore. So things are improving. But obviously at snail pace. All in all we will get there. UCI No.1 brakes a bone way to often. To keep it under the rug.