Team Ineos Discussion thread

[Rob5091]

Bigham & Wale to Bora -
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/racin...bora-hansgrohe-after-leaving-ineos-grenadiers
Bigham will be joined by Ineos' Performance Scientist Jonny Wale

Cummings & Pidders not best buds?
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/racin...os-grenadiers-tour-of-britain-management-team
Steve Cummings appeared set to make a return to working as a directeur sportif (DS) on the ground for Ineos Grenadiers at the Tour of Britain Men this week, but was replaced just before the race began, by Tom Pidcock’s coach, Kurt Bogaerts.

 

[Coffeeplanter]

We need to have a serious conversation about this team. Honestly, I am yet to find a team in sports that is in disarray like INEOS is currently. Sure, you'll find plenty of things that are worse, but relative to their budget I cannot. They have been on the decline, probably since 2019, but in the sake of fairness we'll leave it at July '22. Yesterday felt like rock bottom for a team that once dominanted the biggest race on earth, where a bunch of millionaires got clowned by what partly consisted of literal amateurs. This happens often in a sport like football, but that luck factor is far less present in cycling. On top of all the sportive 'misfortune' it would appear there are also plenty of things going wrong on the management side, if Bigham is to be believed - which I do.

But, fear not, better days are coming, for Victor Langelotti is on the way.

 

[Rob5091]

Ineos keep signing these wunderkids but have a poor and ageing WT team. Apart from Rodriguez they have a problem top 10-ing in a GT.
Management seems to have completely messed up and are floundering around for success.

 

[Izzyeviel]

They're not signing wunderkids.

 

[xo 1]

Ineos keep signing these wunderkids but have a poor and ageing WT team. Apart from Rodriguez they have a problem top 10-ing in a GT.
Management seems to have completely messed up and are floundering around for success.

Thomas has proven to be a reliable podium for one GT a year. But your word choice of "floundering" is spot on. INEOS resembles a poorly run American football organization, where because of revenue-sharing lack of resources can be ruled out as the reason for failure. There appears to be a toxic stew of arrogance, ignorance, and bad luck (at least with respect to Bernal) that has derailed the squad. Without Navraez, they will have had as anonymous a Tour and Vuelta as any squad, World Tour or otherwise.

 

[xo 1]

They're not signing wunderkids.

Also a problem - they have inked some impressive young talent who might develop into impressive riders (perhaps more likely had they signed elsewhere) but not no-doubt, top-of-the-heap future stars.

 

[Rob5091]

They're not signing wunderkids.

OK, semi-wunderkids!

 

[yaco]

My biggest issue is they have done nothing to support the wider cycling community outside of their pro team. Where is their women's team? Where is their under 23 team? Trinity is struggling for budget, but, there is no way Ineos will help.

 

[will-10]

My biggest issue is they have done nothing to support the wider cycling community outside of their pro team. Where is their women's team? Where is their under 23 team? Trinity is struggling for budget, but, there is no way Ineos will help.

The alternative view to that is with the budget they have they are already losing competitiveness vs UAE and Visma - why would they spread themselves even thinner with a women's team?

The lack of a u23 team is glaring considering how much things have changed in that area in the last 5 years.

 

[yaco]

The alternative view to that is with the budget they have they are already losing competitiveness vs UAE and Visma - why would they spread themselves even thinner with a women's team?

The lack of a u23 team is glaring considering how much things have changed in that area in the last 5 years.

Wow! Teams who have a quarter of the budget can have a development team and a women's team. Yet, Visma and UAE have a development team and a women's team.

 

[RedheadDane]

Yet, Visma and UAE have a development team and a women's team.

UAE even has a women's devo team.

 

[Izzyeviel]

Pauline was their womens team...

Mr Sky had a plan & a vision, & had a philosophy - it went well. Mr Ineos doesn't want these things, he just wants a vanity project & now hes found a bigger shinier toy to play with. I don't see Ineos lasting for much longer. (without a massive shake up)

 

[RedheadDane]

They're not signing wunderkids.

BTW, what are you talking about? Not signing wunderkids?
They signed Peter Øxenberg! The guy who beat the Coll de Rates record. You know what happens to Danes who beat the Coll de Rates record? They win Tour de France!




Or they get a weird injury, and have to retire.

 

[Sciatic]

What an awful Vuelta they’ve had, though Rodriquez salvaging a top ten despite being pretty invisible.

 

[Izzyeviel]

BTW, what are you talking about? Not signing wunderkids?
They signed Peter Øxenberg! The guy who beat the Coll de Rates record. You know what happens to Danes who beat the Coll de Rates record? They win Tour de France!




Or they get a weird injury, and have to retire.

& by the time he develops & gets good enough to ride the Tour he'll be riding for EF or Lidl etc

 

[mrbadog]

What an awful Vuelta they’ve had, though Rodriquez salvaging a top ten despite being pretty invisible.

Today 4 of their graduates all beat Rodriguez. How sad is that. They were in such a panic to keep him

 

[AmRacer]

They gained nothing from their hard work today.

 

[elguapo]

According to Luke Rowe, CRod has contacted Covid after the Tour and was not fully prepared for the Vuelta. His presence is just a supporting role for Arensman, but turned out as their main man and missing the consistency of finishing with the GC group.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Rodriguez rode the tour with Covid, yeah Arensman was the main GC guy but got heat stroke early, De Plus and Tarling crashed out.

Team has a litany of problems at the moment, but with context honestly I'd be more worried watching the ToB, wtf was that about.

 

[YavorD]

,

Today 4 of their graduates all beat Rodriguez. How sad is that. They were in such a panic to keep him

I don't blame them for trying to keep him but I honestly think he'd be better in a different team.
Riders seem to improve much more in different teams.

 

[Ricco']

Trinity is struggling for budget, but, there is no way Ineos will help.

Trinity is the team set up to promote Trinity Sports Management assets, directed by former UCI president son, Andrew McQuaid, with reported troubles between him and team Ineos during Pidcock's last contract renewal that made the team let go and miss almost all of the british talent represented by the agency.

I seriously doubt the team would be in any rush to aid, even more with recent talks of possible early exit of the team for Mr. Pidcock.

 

[yaco]

Trinity is the team set up to promote Trinity Sports Management assets, directed by former UCI president son, Andrew McQuaid, with reported troubles between him and team Ineos during Pidcock's last contract renewal that made the team let go and miss almost all of the british talent represented by the agency.

I seriously doubt the team would be in any rush to aid, even more with recent talks of possible early exit of the team for Mr. Pidcock.

Yes, but my post was about the general Ineos attitude towards development teams. It's a joke they never had a development team, and a bigger joke they never had a women's team.

I'll also add there is too much attention to teams not signing the best local talents. Movistar has trouble signing with Spanish riders, Jayco the same with Aussie riders and EF with American riders. You'll see less allegiances by riders to local teams, as they see the bigger picture of their future development is more important than to ride for the local team.

 

[Rob5091]

Pidders on the move story maybe not over yet -

https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling...nest-they-do-not-help-me-to-perform-optimally

INEOS Grenadiers has kept the same budget but over the past years has been overtaken by UAE Team Emirates and Team Visma | Lease a Bike in terms of results by a long shot. Recent situations like Dan Bigham's departure and DS Stephen Cummings' absence from a few recent races itself are further signs of a bad situation within the team. "Yes, it is true that there are a number of things within the team that I have to deal with at the moment. And to be honest, they do not help me to perform optimally".

A move had been rumoured to Red Bull - BORA - hansgrohe, but that remains unlikely due to his contract. However the topic is not closed, and Pidcock explains: "I have to think about much more than just performance-related matters at the moment. And that means that the focus on the things that are really important, namely racing, is not ideal. I have a contract until the end of 2027. I can't say more".

(original article at https://www.hln.be/wielrennen/er-ge...-niet-volledig-focussen-op-de-koers~a73f8352/ )

 

[Rob5091]

... and more riders maybe not be on the move to Ineos -

https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling...om-ineos-grenadiers-to-join-uae-team-emirates

The team is said to be in the fight to sign Pablo Castrillo of Equipo Kern Pharma for several months but after his breakthrough Vuelta a España where he just won two mountain stages, plenty teams entered the run to sign the talent. However the team is also eyeing another Spanish talent in Pablo Torres; this evolution came upon the Tour de l'Avenir. ... Torres, 18, is part of UAE Team Emirates' development team and it would be very obvious that he will take the leap towards the pro ranks in 2025. However as it was not certain, INEOS Grenadiers still made a late effort to sign the youngster but according to Relevo this effort was not successful and Torres looks certain to join the likes of Tadej Pogacar, Adam Yates and João Almeida next season.

 

[RedheadDane]

Meanwhile, yeah... I'm still wondering what the hell is going on with Storm. He's still listed with the wrong team on the UCI website.
I suppose someone in management possibly forgetting to send in the papers to the UCI that they've signed him would be a pretty good indicator that something's not right...