Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Ferminal]

Is there anything doing the rounds on him? I'm sure he has but I hadn't heard of any links.

Nah nothing, I don't know enough about his time as a Basque journeyman to make a definitive judgement one way or the other. At 25/26 he joins a great doping team and goes: 3rd on Mende, 2nd on Urkiola, and 1st on Sölden. Not the hardest one for the dot-joiners.

 

[MatParker117]

Who won more GTs than Rabo 2004-2007?

ONCE and Discovery Channel.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Significantly better riders and tactics? Although Blanco beat Sky to the TDU overall this year.

Did better at Paris-Roubaix too Wonder if JV is still happy letting that big fish go...

 

[Bavarianrider]

I don't know if this has been discussed before. But today i stumbled about an German article dealing with the doping product GW1516.
And when i read it, i was thinking of team Sky immediately. The effects of GW1516 just seem to fit perfectly the observations you can see with Sky riders.
Increase of endurance muscle efficiency while extremely burning body fat at the same time.

Apparently WADA warned athletes now of this product because of the high health risks.
Apparently WAda has already developed a test for it but cannot effectively use it so far.

Here's the German article.

http://www.dradio.de/dlf/sendungen/sport/2065857/

 

[Ferminal]

ONCE and Discovery Channel.

Vino Heras Heras?

You can't give Heras 2005 and Rasmussen not 2007 That would be make it 3-2 to Saiz.

 

[leon7766]

People who think Sky and in particular Wiggins are clean:

armchairclimber
leon7766

Anyone else?

From my understanding, most other posters either don't know, without some hard evidence, or think he's definitely on something.

My point being: even with the UK faithful, there are very few who are entirely convinced.

I have said it before and I will probably say it many times in the future .The legacy of British Olympic cycling wouldnt be risked by Sky doping end of story .The usual retort is there is a conspiracy of silence within the British authority and media .Well anyone who lives in Britain knows that simply wouldnt be the case as the media will take down anyone no matter how big. The British media are totally aware of the history of Doping in cycling and If Sky were doing the same it would have been blown apart way before now

Naive, Stupid,Bradley Wiggins ,fan boy etc etc etc whatever the usual names people such as I get called theres no disputing the truth.

 

[ebandit]

sky's the limit

People who think Sky and in particular Wiggins are clean:

armchairclimber
leon7766

i'm proud of members having faith................such members may be yet be proven correct

i continue to hope against a background of doubt

just reading richard moore's book sky's the limit.................brailsford really
pushing the desire to create a clean team where riders can be monitored
24/7 and not left to their own devices

Mark L

 

[Dear Wiggo]

The British media are totally aware of the history of Doping in cycling and If Sky were doing the same it would have been blown apart way before now

Were the British media aware of Gert Leinders? And if so, why did noone tell David Brailsford.

Oops.

Methinks you are wrong.

But you keep good company.

 

[Benotti69]

I have said it before and I will probably say it many times in the future .The legacy of British Olympic cycling wouldnt be risked by Sky doping end of story .The usual retort is there is a conspiracy of silence within the British authority and media .Well anyone who lives in Britain knows that simply wouldnt be the case as the media will take down anyone no matter how big ,it happens every four years at the world cup ,it happens in Rugby ,Cricket etc etc etc .No bigger example was the bidding for the 2018 World cup .The media only had to keep their mouths shut about corruption and we would have won but no there were stings galore and the commitee took their revenge by shunning us .
The British media are totally aware of the history of Doping in cycling and If Sky were doing the same it would have been blown apart way before now

Naive, Stupid,Bradley Wiggins ,fan boy etc etc etc whatever the usual names people such as I get called theres no disputing the truth.

It has never stopped any other nation. Look at the Americans letting Carl Lewis away with a positive test in the trials for Seoul 88, never mind turning a total blind eye to Armstrong. Read what Bill Stapleton said about them doping. It reads exaclty the same as what you are saying.

People are human and will always believe they can get away with it.

The Brit media in the majority refused to question Armstrong and his doping during his 7 tour wins. The exceptions being Walsh and Kimmage, both Irish but writing for a large part of Armstrongs career for a UK publication. Which UK journo in the UK media is going to question Sky or Brit cycling. Look at Brendan Gallagher of the telegraph how he started with some doubts and now is totally sycophantic on Sky.

As for the 2018 world cup bid. It was never going to the UK. The Russians bought the 2018 WC. Nothing to do with the BBC reporting about FIFA corruption. Dubai bought 2022 WC, a nation with nothing to do with the history and culture of Football and temperatures way too hot to play competitive football, but FIFA took the money so Dubai get the 2022 WC.

I bet you would be shocked at what strings the Brits pulled to get the Olympics, the IOC dont go anywhere without bribes and corruption making them richer.

 

[leon7766]

Even TeamSkyfans over at Velorooms has given up.

His position is they're on something but not prepared to say what it is.

I think the Dawg turned him. Not sure.

But there are very few these days apart from newbies who think they're clean.

Why should people continue to argue with other people who wont accept anything but the line they are pushing .People who twist any piece of news to suit their agenda and so with almost religious fanatacism .SKy win its because they dope they lose is because they do it on purpose .

 

[leon7766]

Were the British media aware of Gert Leinders? And if so, why did noone tell David Brailsford.

Oops.

Methinks you are wrong.

But you keep good company.

If you know the British media you would know the truth of what I say .Im often wrong but not about this

 

[leon7766]

It has never stopped any other nation. Look at the Americans letting Carl Lewis away with a positive test in the trials fro Seoul 88, never mind turning a total blind eye to Armstrong. Read what Bill Stapleton said about them doping. It reads exaclty the same as what you are saying.

People are human and will always believe they can get away with it.

The Brit media in the majority refused to question Armstrong and his doping during his 7 tour wins. The exceptions being Walsh and Kimmage, both Irish but writing for a large part of Armstrongs career for a UK publication. Which UK journo in the UK media is going to question Sky or Brit cycling. Look at Brendan Gallagher of the telegraph how he started with some doubts and now is totally sycophantic on Sky.

The British media couldnt have cared less about road Cycling until Cavendish turned up .Now they are all over it.No other nations edia gets stuck into its own like the British

 

[lemoogle]

I have said it before and I will probably say it many times in the future .The legacy of British Olympic cycling wouldnt be risked by Sky doping end of story .The usual retort is there is a conspiracy of silence within the British authority and media .Well anyone who lives in Britain knows that simply wouldnt be the case as the media will take down anyone no matter how big. The British media are totally aware of the history of Doping in cycling and If Sky were doing the same it would have been blown apart way before now

Naive, Stupid,Bradley Wiggins ,fan boy etc etc etc whatever the usual names people such as I get called theres no disputing the truth.

We clearly live in a different country then, the British media and People is one of the least doubting and forgiving out of all the countries I've lived in ( quite a few actually). British media and commentators are some of the most biased and ignore any little detail that may hurt their athlete's claim/rep.
Quick example: in France , europcar wins 3 stages and half the comments on the news articles are about how it's suspicious. You think british websites would even let any comment about doping show up? no.... and that's another question to you, if the british media is so quick to crucify their athletes why has no comment about doping ever gone through on the guardian, sky news or whatever news source writing about cycling.

I also should mention how easy it is for the british media to love ******bag athletes ( cough cough murray cough cough wiggins ) as LONG as they perform. ( now if they don't perform then that's a different matter i.e. your examples )

And I'm not saying all this out of a personal dislike for the UK or its media, It's just something I've noticed here.

 

[lemoogle]

As for the 2018 world cup bid. It was never going to the UK. The Russians bought the 2018 WC. Nothing to do with the BBC reporting about FIFA corruption. Dubai bought 2022 WC, a nation with nothing to do with the history and culture of Football and temperatures way too hot to play competitive football, but FIFA took the money so Dubai get the 2022 WC.

I bet you would be shocked at what strings the Brits pulled to get the Olympics, the IOC dont go anywhere without bribes and corruption making them richer.

I think you mean Qatar and not Dubai but fair point !

Also haha I thought the Brits won the Olympics because Chirac made a really bad joke about Finnish food to Merkel and the Finns had plenty of judges on the board. ( well at least it's a good story ).
Never really understood the decision really, London didn't have the budget or the plans nor much of anything at the time, unlike Paris. Oh well thanks to that Boris had an excuse to increase Tube prices for us every 6 months in London ( they're still doing it so not sure what the excuse is anymore ).

 

[RownhamHill]

I bet you would be shocked at what strings the Brits pulled to get the Olympics, the IOC dont go anywhere without bribes and corruption making them richer.

And then our path's diverge again. A close relative of mine was involved in the Olympics at a senior level throughout the entire process (was in Singapore when the results were announced through to being involved in selling the stadium now) and I was actually shocked at how little corruption was involved in the bid - apparently after Salt Lake city the IOC did actually make some effort to tidy up.

 

[mikehammer67]

didn't stop china ussr gdr

british media not exactly chomping at the bit on whats known on sky

jimmy saville?

look how long that took

margaret thatcher?

 

[RownhamHill]

In response to Dear Wiggo's list earlier, I think that Sky (the coaching and team management) are probably clean, and of individual Sky riders I also think that Wiggins is clean as well. I certainly hope so.

Of course, I don't know for sure, and I'm always happy to recognise that what I think might be wrong - especially in a case when I really have no way of verifying the issue either way.

That said, (and in response to a question Netserk was asking elsewhere the other day) I also think Contador is clean, and has been since at least 2011 (if not longer. . .). So there you go. . .

 

[Dear Wiggo]

If you know the British media you would know the truth of what I say .Im often wrong but not about this

You wrote that the British media know about the history of doping in cycling.

Perhaps your definition of "history" means something different in this context? Perhaps you mean more simplistically, "The British media know there's been some doping in cycling"?

That's not what I call history.

Not by a long shot.

 

[Lanark]

You wrote that the British media know about the history of doping in cycling.

Perhaps your definition of "history" means something different in this context? Perhaps you mean more simplistically, "The British media know there's been some doping in cycling"?

That's not what I call history.

Not by a long shot.

Don't underestimate the Legendary British Media, the only unbiased media in the world. They have a vast knowledge of the history of doping in cycling, they even read a Wikipedia-page on doping. They live by the old Bush-Maxim 'fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice....can't get fooled again'.

 

[MatParker117]

Were the British media aware of Gert Leinders? And if so, why did noone tell David Brailsford.

Oops.

Methinks you are wrong.

But you keep good company.

Was anybody really aware of Geert Leinders?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Was anybody really aware of Geert Leinders?

Apparently, British media were.

The British media are totally aware of the history of Doping in cycling and If Sky were doing the same it would have been blown apart way before now

 

[The Hitch]

Significantly better riders and tactics? Although Blanco beat Sky to the TDU overall this year.

Tactics? Sky. The team with the worst tactics in sport history. Who announce before every single race exactly what they are going to do and it's always the same tactic and never deviate from it. Who lost the vuelta with the best rider and blew themselves up at their own onlympics to not even make the top25.
Are you mad?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Please show me a single story where a successful British athlete - ie one currently winning / dominating - has ever been scrutinised / questioned / had eyebrows raised in British media.

Just one.

 

[thehog]

Please show me a single story where a successful British athlete - ie one currently winning / dominating - has ever been scrutinised / questioned / had eyebrows raised in British media.

Just one.

Eddie the Eagle?

 

[Benotti69]

The British media couldnt have cared less about road Cycling until Cavendish turned up .Now they are all over it.No other nations edia gets stuck into its own like the British

They are all over it waving flags as they usually do. They aren't questioning the Brit success?

As mikehammer says. Where were they when the Saville accussations were raised?

They did little to question Blair and his '45mins till the bombs rain down from Iraq' claim that was a lie?

Brit media no better than any other flag waving media.