Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[thehog]

Giro del Trentino (ITA), Stage 1B [14.1 km, TTT]: Team Sky 15 min 20 sec = 55.17 Kph.

Put one minute into Columbia!

BMC were down 30 seconds at the halfway mark!

 

[Escarabajo]

You expect strangers on the internet to think you care about them? , who cares about any random stranger on the internet?, strange.

The relevant thing here is that Jimmy offers so much more than you to the discussion in here, he brings much needed balance to this thread, it would be boring if everyone was in snidey, obnoxious pitchfork brigade wouldn't it?

You are certainly new here.

He brings some balance but I have learnt nothing new really.

 

[JimmyFingers]

You are certainly new here.

He brings some balance but I have learnt nothing new really.

What about my gif of sagan doing a skidz?

 

[keithmcmahon]

Put one minute into Columbia!

BMC were down 30 seconds at the halfway mark!

Sky had 8 riders, BMC only 6.

I would expect to smash BMC.

Sky put 13 secs into Astana which is a better comparision

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I'm confused.

I'm sorry. I wrote it as simply as I could. I'll try to clarify.

So are you saying that Kerrison is clean and you can't understand why he is not freelance (has he not got a contract)?

I think I see where some of the confusion lies. No, I am not saying Kerrison is clean. He is a coach, not a rider. Whether he dopes or not is irrelevant.
I do not believe Kerrison is doping, no. And I do not believe he is doping his riders either.

Wiggins had a contract with Garmin. Don't try and muddy the water with contract talk, it won't fly.

Or are you saying that he must be doping the riders because if he was clean he would be earning millions freelance? Or something else?

Perhaps you could help my confusion by posting the sentence I wrote that says, "Kerrison is doping his riders". I bet you can't. Which is why I find your confusion confusing. And troubling.

Here's an example of what I did write:

And on the other hand, you have a swimming coach getting the same rider [Rogers], clean [the rider, we don't care if the coach is clean or not], to level X or even higher.

I should have added Kerrison's name to that sentence to make it clear I was referring to him (thought swimming coach was enough differentiation), I shall endeavour to do so in the future.

 

[D-Queued]

So Wiggins is training solo - no team mates. Good for morale no doubt.

Kerrison is there as his dedicated trainer. Wonder how the other guys are training without Kerrison's breakthrough training protocols...

I mean. Kerrison either does daily modifications to their training programs, or it's more generic and Rogers can take it with him to another team like Saxo.

No. No witnesses.

No Tylers, Hincapies, Levis, Dave Z's, or Michael Barrys.

Dave.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

No. No witnesses.

No Tylers, Hincapies, Levis, Dave Z's, or Michael Barrys.

Dave.

Just Kerrison and PR guy Dario Cioni.

 

[The Hitch]

Put one minute into Columbia!

BMC were down 30 seconds at the halfway mark!

They put 1 minute into the team that was dominating time trials for years?

Oh you mean that joke of a continental team Colombia Coldeportes

 

[Ferminal]

Just Kerrison and PR guy Dario Cioni.

How did Dario survive the DB stare down?

Or did he get a sponsors exemption?

 

[thehog]

They put 1 minute into the team that was dominating time trials for years?

Oh you mean that joke of a continental team Colombia Coldeportes

Sky gave them a clinic in TTT.

Fairly awesome display.

Bodes well for winning all 3 GTs.

 

[Spencer the Half Wit]

I'm sorry. I wrote it as simply as I could. I'll try to clarify.



I think I see where some of the confusion lies. No, I am not saying Kerrison is clean. He is a coach, not a rider. Whether he dopes or not is irrelevant.
I do not believe Kerrison is doping, no. And I do not believe he is doping his riders either.

Wiggins had a contract with Garmin. Don't try and muddy the water with contract talk, it won't fly.



Perhaps you could help my confusion by posting the sentence I wrote that says, "Kerrison is doping his riders". I bet you can't. Which is why I find your confusion confusing. And troubling.

Here's an example of what I did write:



I should have added Kerrison's name to that sentence to make it clear I was referring to him (thought swimming coach was enough differentiation), I shall endeavour to do so in the future.

The reason for the confusion is that your post was a classic reductio ad absurdum argument i.e. the notion that Kerrison is not doping the riders and having great success and earning a fraction at sky as to what he could freelance is so absurd that the opposite must be true i.e. Kerrison dopes the riders. But then, as Rownhill said, freelance coaches don't exactly have a good reputation.

If your post wasn't such an argument then I don't understand what point you are trying to make.

Sky had to compensate Garmin for Wiggins. If Kerrison wanted to go freelance, he would have to buy the contract out himself.

 

[JimmyFingers]

The reason for the confusion is that your post was a classic reductio ad absurdum argument i.e. the notion that Kerrison is not doping the riders and having great success and earning a fraction at sky as to what he could freelance is so absurd that the opposite must be true i.e. Kerrison dopes the riders. But then, as Rownhill said, freelance coaches don't exactly have a good reputation.

If your post wasn't such an argument then I don't understand what point you are trying to make.

Sky had to compensate Garmin for Wiggins. If Kerrison wanted to go freelance, he would have to buy the contract out himself.

Presumably if he's doping the riders he could go freelance with that as well, and earn much more than he does at Sky.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Sky had to compensate Garmin for Wiggins. If Kerrison wanted to go freelance, he would have to buy the contract out himself.

It's your opinion that it is absurd. Unless you're in the camp of people who think Team Sky employees are doing it for love and not money?

As for buying out his contract. Did you not see how much money Ferrari was making?

 

[Spencer the Half Wit]

It's your opinion that it is absurd. Unless you're in the camp of people who think Team Sky employees are doing it for love and not money?

As for buying out his contract. Did you not see how much money Ferrari was making?

Not my opinion that it is absurd. I was trying to understand your point. Were you trying to show that Kerrison must be doping the riders or not?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Not my opinion that it is absurd. I was trying to understand your point. Were you trying to show that Kerrison must be doping the riders or not?

I'll .... write ... this .... reallly ... .slowly .... for you ... so ... you ... can ... read ... it...

If .... I .... thought ... Kerrison .... was .... doping .... the ... riders ... I .... would ... say ... that ... .

It is your opinion that it is absurd.

Like someone is going to stumble on the greatest breakthrough in cycling training for the past 20 years and spend it on one team.

Unless they're paying him a bucketload, it makes no sense.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Sky had 8 riders, BMC only 6.

I would expect to smash BMC.

Sky put 13 secs into Astana which is a better comparision

"We expected to go well in this time trial as we’ve come here with around half of the Giro d’Italia squad,"

http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/giro-del-trentino-2013/stage-1b/results

What happens when THE OTHER HALF of the Giro team shows up? 26 seconds? 30? Need I remind everyone they took huge amounts of time on a 14K course.

I see podium sweeps.

 

[Catwhoorg]

~1 sec per km.

Large but not superhuman, or about what Garmin put into them in Qatar (2012), or about half of what BMC put into Sky in Qatar this year.

 

[del1962]

~1 sec per km.

Large but not superhuman, or about what Garmin put into them in Qatar (2012), or about half of what BMC put into Sky in Qatar this year.

Must be witchcraft, burn them.

 

[MatParker117]

~1 sec per km.

Large but not superhuman, or about what Garmin put into them in Qatar (2012), or about half of what BMC put into Sky in Qatar this year.

First time since the 2011 tour that Sky have had Wiggins in a TTT as well.

 

[keithmcmahon]

"We expected to go well in this time trial as we’ve come here with around half of the Giro d’Italia squad,"

http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/giro-del-trentino-2013/stage-1b/results

What happens when THE OTHER HALF of the Giro team shows up? 26 seconds? 30? Need I remind everyone they took huge amounts of time on a 14K course.

I see podium sweeps.

Probably not that much, the others although good (especially the Henao improvements) will be primarily there for the SkyTrain in the mountains not in the ITT.

I would love to see the Giro Podium as:
1. Wiggins 2. Henao 3. Uran
but I seriously doubt it, more like
1. Wiggins 2. Nibali 3. Hesjedahl
Hopefully Henao and Uran make the Top 10.

If Cataldo was given a free role, he could also finish Top 10 at a stretch, but he'll be burnt in the foothills...

 

[thehog]

Probably not that much, the others although good (especially the Henao improvements) will be primarily there for the SkyTrain in the mountains not in the ITT.

I would love to see the Giro Podium as:
1. Wiggins 2. Henao 3. Uran
but I seriously doubt it, more like
1. Wiggins 2. Nibali 3. Hesjedahl
Hopefully Henao and Uran make the Top 10.

If Cataldo was given a free role, he could also finish Top 10 at a stretch, but he'll be burnt in the foothills...

Bawwwaaaabaaaaa haaaaa!

Cataldo will be peeling off with 500m to go with only Wiggins on his wheel.

 

[thehog]

Probably not that much, the others although good (especially the Henao improvements) will be primarily there for the SkyTrain in the mountains not in the ITT.

I would love to see the Giro Podium as:
1. Wiggins 2. Henao 3. Uran
but I seriously doubt it, more like
1. Wiggins 2. Nibali 3. Hesjedahl
Hopefully Henao and Uran make the Top 10.

If Cataldo was given a free role, he could also finish Top 10 at a stretch, but he'll be burnt in the foothills...

Bawwwaaaabaaaaa haaaaa!

Cataldo will be peeling off with 500m to go with only Wiggins on his wheel.

 

[the sceptic]

If sky have their best team in a hypothetical grand tour and everyone is riding for themselves, how many riders would they get in the top 10?

Wiggins, Dawg, Porte and Henao are locks.

Uran, Cataldo and Kiryenka are probable.

I feel like im missing someone too. When was the last time a team had so many of the best riders in the world? Its just ridiculous.

 

[keithmcmahon]

If sky have their best team in a hypothetical grand tour and everyone is riding for themselves, how many riders would they get in the top 10?

Wiggins, Dawg, Porte and Henao are locks.

Uran, Cataldo and Kiryenka are probable.

I feel like im missing someone too. When was the last time a team had so many of the best riders in the world? Its just ridiculous.

Kennaugh and Thomas will be top 10 next year.
podium year after

 

[the sceptic]

Kennaugh and Thomas will be top 10 next year.
podium year after

Depends on how much they focus on the road. If they forget about track cycling completely then they will be future grand tour contenders.

I guess JTL is a dark horse. If he stays illness-free then he will probably be get a grand tour podium as well.