Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Benotti69]

Suggest you check which track discipline Bos comes from. He's a sprinter, Wiggins is a pursuiter. Very different disciplines.

So Jack Bobrigde to win the TdF when exactly?

 

[Coolair2970]

Ugh. Please, please examine the history of grand tour winners up to Greg Lemond. There were no mid-career revelations until blood doping. Zero. Somehow denying 50+ years of human performance isn't going to make the Sky fairy tale real.

Second, and just as important, how do you know these mid-career revelations from other sports were not due to PED's? Most sports do not have any kind of transparent anti-doping system.

Well one or two but most of them one the first TDF at 23 or so.

 

[Coolair2970]

Suggest you check which track discipline Bos comes from. He's a sprinter, Wiggins is a pursuiter. Very different disciplines.

OK the When does Luke Durbridge win the Tour ?

 

[Havetts]

So Jack Bobrigde to win the TdF when exactly?

Well he has already developed alcoholism so hes on the way.

 

[EnacheV]

No relevance when it comes to racing.

Why? because you say so ?

You have to prove a statement, for me is so easy to show only 1 example that can deny a statement.

the histoy of the sport has shown that GT ability contenders show it an at early age.

1 year after turned professional : and was named in their team[20] for the Tour de France, in which he finished eighty-fourth overall. Seems like enough ability at an early age, for me at least, not like he was an 100kg fattie transformed in terminator.

About Wiggins, imo its very easy to transform from a top olympic track rider in to a succesfull road cyclist. He has the genes and training with him. Much easier than to transform from a talented junior in to a senior winner.

Ofc not all are suited but in some cases it fits like a glove, especially the endurance riders.

 

[Benotti69]

Anyone remember the last time 2 riders from the same team finished 1 and 2 on a mountain top finish at the TdF.

 

[buckle]

Irish spooks

I am sufficiently paranoid after Saturday to think that Dan was allowed to win on Sunday. If nothing else to shut up the Irish. I reckon David B was really spooked by Sean's depressing interview. As in, "if this is what Kelly is saying, goodness knows what Walsh and Kimmage will make of it?"

 

[EnacheV]

Anyone remember the last time 2 riders from the same team finished 1 and 2 on a mountain top finish at the TdF.

why not 2nd and 4th ? or 7th and 11th ? im sure something interesting can come out if you pick 2 random numbers.

but you are right, this is undisputed proof that sky has a systematically wide team doping program.

 

[caryopsis]

why not 2nd and 4th ? or 7th and 11th ? im sure something interesting can come out if you pick 2 random numbers.

but you are right, this is undisputed proof that sky has a systematically wide team doping program.

erm, yes, because looking at 1st and 2nd place - i.e. the best - finishes from the same team on mountain stages is exactly like comparing 2 other random places from the list of results.

 

[zastomito]

Why? because you say so ?

No, but because team sports are way more complex than racing when it comes to technique, strategy and psychical demand. You can be very talented footballer playing in a wrong system on a crappy team. You have so much more variables to consider when judging an athlete in a team sport.
In racing in general physical component predetermines the success. Either you are born with the potential and it is shown from an early age or you aren't. Simple as that. On the other hand you can play top level football if you are, for example, talented alcoholic and addict (Merson, Gaskoin, Adams, Maradona, Canigga...)
Used to train swimming. Was fairly good (top 10 in Europe in my age group). Got to see some amazing things. Kids who didn't know how to swim 6 months ago destroying fields on a national level. One of those kids was Vladan Markovic, we used to train together. Same trainings. I was making progress but him, it seemed that he was improving every single day. He just had it.

 

[Mr. 64%]

why not 2nd and 4th ? or 7th and 11th ? im sure something interesting can come out if you pick 2 random numbers.

but you are right, this is undisputed proof that sky has a systematically wide team doping program.

well said!.

i hardly care if their off-days are planned, as so to look human or if it's just the recoil of a bunch of jucie - as long as they don't destroy the entertainment value of the race at first sight of a mountain finish..

please don't take us bake to the days of the tourminator!

 

[Mr. 64%]

... Got to see some amazing things. Kids who didn't know how to swim 6 months ago destroying fields on a national level. One of those kids was Vladan Markovic, we used to train together. Same trainings. I was making progress but him, it seemed that he was improving every single day. He just had it.

Had what...

The juice?

Sorry, not to be offensive - i hope you're able to take a little pun

How old was this guy when he made such progress?

 

[Benotti69]

why not 2nd and 4th ? or 7th and 11th ? im sure something interesting can come out if you pick 2 random numbers.

Their is a difference with the domination a 1st and 2nd place signifies then other placings.

but you are right, this is undisputed proof that sky has a systematically wide team doping program.

Funny that David Millar thinks Sky are clean when he was the guy to out Ricco and Piepoli.

 

[zastomito]

How old was this guy when he made such progress?

From the moment he started organized training, 11 years old I think.

 

[blackcat]

Their is a difference with the domination a 1st and 2nd place signifies then other placings.



Funny that David Millar thinks Sky are clean when he was the guy to out Ricco and Piepoli.

millar nothing but a liar and into anglophone exceptionalism. one rule for him and brits, anti-doping rules for spaniards, russians and italians

 

[Mr. 64%]

From the moment he started organized training, 11 years old I think.

See - there's quite the difference to making such huge jumps at age eleven and then to doing it in your mid 20's.

Age 11 = all natural.

Age 25 = juice.

 

[BroDeal]

No, but because team sports are way more complex than racing when it comes to technique, strategy and psychical demand. You can be very talented footballer playing in a wrong system on a crappy team. You have so much more variables to consider when judging an athlete in a team sport.
In racing in general physical component predetermines the success. Either you are born with the potential and it is shown from an early age or you aren't. Simple as that. On the other hand you can play top level football if you are, for example, talented alcoholic and addict (Merson, Gaskoin, Adams, Maradona, Canigga...)
Used to train swimming. Was fairly good (top 10 in Europe in my age group). Got to see some amazing things. Kids who didn't know how to swim 6 months ago destroying fields on a national level. One of those kids was Vladan Markovic, we used to train together. Same trainings. I was making progress but him, it seemed that he was improving every single day. He just had it.

That is what is so ridiculous about the "power thread." They blindly argue that someone might be able to do what Froome did on stage 8 without dope but ignore the fact that Froome is not one of them. If he was then he would have shown his potential at a very young age. Anyone who has raced has seen riders who are simply superior to the other amateurs despite limited training. They just have huge engines. If Froome had the type of engine that allows him to climb faster than a doped Armstrong then he would have been killing it in his early years, just like a sixteen year old LeMond, while restricted to junior gearing, would beat American pros or an old, fat, and out of shape LeMond can still place in the top 10% of l'Etape du Tour.

 

[BYOP88]

I think Brailsford has missed a trick or Knees should ride as a Brit. In the 2008 TdF, Chris '21st Century Merckx' Froome lost time to Knees on 13 stages. Froome only took time from Knees on 3 stages, the 2 ITT's(Froome 4 seconds ahead on the 1st ITT and 3:36 on the 2nd) and Alpe D'Huez stage(12:37). Although the 2 days before the Alpe, Froome lost 18:19 on stage 15 and 29:20 on stage 16 to his future Sky teammate, I guess the best climber in the world was just saving his legs. Also Froome took Lanterne Rouge on the final stage

 

[Benotti69]

millar nothing but a liar and into anglophone exceptionalism. one rule for him and brits, anti-doping rules for spaniards, russians and italians

No not St.David.............

 

[BroDeal]

millar nothing but a liar and into anglophone exceptionalism. one rule for him and brits, anti-doping rules for spaniards, russians and italians

Remember after stage 17 of the 2006 Tour when Saint Millar was gushing over Landis. He was quoted as saying, "There is no dope that can make a rider do that." Later, with a little revisionist history, he changed his tune, as though he and the rest of the peloton were not perfectly aware of what Landis and the rest of the podium that year were doing.

Everything Millar says is designed to benefit himself.

 

[Benotti69]

That is what is so ridiculous about the "power thread." They blindly argue that someone might be able to do what Froome did on stage 8 without dope but ignore the fact that Froome is not one of them. If he was then he would have shown his potential at a very young age. Anyone who has raced has seen riders who are simply superior to the other amateurs despite limited training. They just have huge engines. If Froome had the type of engine that allows him to climb faster than a doped Armstrong then he would have been killing it in his early years, just like a sixteen year old LeMond, while restricted to junior gearing, would beat American pros or an old, fat, and out of shape LeMond can still place in the top 10% of l'Etape du Tour.

Yes, it shows at an early age, Kelly at 14 won an eight-mile (13 km) handicap, which meant the weaker riders started first and the best last. Kelly set off three minutes before the backmarkers. He was still three minutes ahead when the course turned for home after four miles (6 km) and more than three minutes in the lead when he crossed the line. He had it from an early age. In cycling it cannot be learnt.

 

[thehog]

No not St.David.............

"At the January 2004 Cofidis Team presentation, David Millar wearing the world champions winners band on his jersey (ITT) said 'I don't want to comment on this (Gaumont affair) - except to say that I have never used drugs, and I am convinced that this controversy doesn't include anyone else in the team. I wish to re-iterate I have never used illegal products'.

 

[Benotti69]

"At the January 2004 Cofidis Team presentation, David Millar wearing the world champions winners band on his jersey (ITT) said 'I don't want to comment on this (Gaumont affair) - except to say that I have never used drugs, and I am convinced that this controversy doesn't include anyone else in the team. I wish to re-iterate I have never used illegal products'.

say it aint so Hoggie, say it aint so............

 

[EnacheV]

They should restrict than

"You can be a tour winner only you were awesome in your youths, showing something"

Words can not describe this stupidity, it's beyond any argumentation. It's like those paid poster for political parties, defying any logic and common sense. You can't argue with that.

 

[Benotti69]

They should restrict than

"You can be a tour winner only you were awesome in your youths, showing something"

Words can not describe this stupidity, it's beyond any argumentation. It's like those paid poster for political parties, defying any logic and common sense. You can't argue with that.

Keep arguing against history, it's working.