Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Froome19]

I bet Rogers' blood passport looks really suspicious (relative to last year's) right now.

I wouldn't bet against him being just behind Paulinho in the Saxo train come July.

 

[willbick]

Froome must be on some pretty bad drugs if the best he can do is beat a 41 year old by 15 secs on a MTF

 

[roundabout]

Sounds like you are making the mistake of differences of opinion for trollin.

Nah, I'll take a stab at it and go with trolling as well.

I certainly didn't see the Wiggins group being hundreds of riders big when they started the climb to La Toussuire.

 

[willbick]

Track and Road racing are very different two things actually, the only same feature is that you ride on two wheels

maybe that helps explain why it took Wiggins a few years to adapt fully

 

[Bala Verde]

He went from %3 hct to %49.9 hct

but he's obviously clean

Others would call it being a good responder...

... to new and improved race tactics, better team work and a more professional environment, including the skylight bus, new diets and obviously physicial exercise all year round. Because racing is used for training purposes, hence everyone is always on peak form

 

[Benotti69]

i really dont see what is so remarkable about a rider improving so that they are capable of performing to a level eminently achievable by a clean athlete. there are a million reasons why a rider can improve to that level. what is not believable is when a rider improves to a level BEYOND what is achievable by a clean athlete (i.e. 6.x watts/kg).

list 10 reasons...

 

[del1962]

You can't really make a judgement on Rodgers from a single day, riders do feel underthe weather some days etc, he may be being saved for another stage.

 

[roundabout]

I was going to write a reply, but I have better stuff to do than let if fall on deaf ears.

I don't see what that graph proves whatsoever, I am delighted that some random journalist decided to come up with it and give the clinic some recyclable material but I really don't care what he says unfortunately.

I would prefer some pre-2011 Vuelta quotes about Froome's talent.

I remember Kennaugh and Thomas being talked about as big talents, but never Froome. I do however think that his placement in the graph is a bit harsh.

 

[will10]

I love that Leon7766 and willbick both have join dates in July 2012. That speaks volumes.

You can't really make a judgement on Rodgers from a single day, riders do feel underthe weather some days etc, he may be being saved for another stage.

True, but he didn't have many off-days last year. Remarkably consistant, actually.

 

[Bala Verde]

I wouldn't bet against him being just behind Paulinho in the Saxo train come July.

Since he is at the end of his career, it wouldn't surprise me if he, compared to other riders who lost their form after a transfer (Gilbert?), would be ready much sooner than other transferred riders who seem to require a year to "ease" into the new program/adjust their bloodvalues more gradually. What does Dr. Freiburg have to lose, he'll probably retire next year anyway.

 

[the sceptic]

Froome said: "I'm really happy with that victory, it was a really good day for us. I only ended up doing a kilometre in the wind myself. It really was an armchair ride. To have the guys there who were with me on the climb – Rigo, Sergio and Dario – to have them pulling for me when guys like Nibali and Contador are attacking is a really good feeling.

lol. Froome dawg was just on a nice training ride today

 

[Benotti69]

Froome must be on some pretty bad drugs if the best he can do is beat a 41 year old by 15 secs on a MTF

the 41 year old destroyed some big names not long ago and took 1'36" on a mtf out of GT winner Hesjedal

 

[spalco]

Sir Bjarne doesnt know anything about how to train obviously. And Rogers forgot everything he learned while at sky

What makes you think Riis is an authority on training science other than that he was a top EPO rider?

 

[peterst6906]

Leon 7766, People on both sides of an argument twist things to match their existing point of view.

At least, in the clinics favour is a history of calling things correctly before it gained wider acceptance or a rider was caught.

Is this forum the equivalent of north Korea for calling Armstrong out? what about Contador? Ullrich? The whole USPS train?

Look at Fuentes and Ferrari and the number of cyclists tied to them. Look at the team DSs still operating and their links to doping.

Just look at everything in cycling and you'll see a long, long history of doping, especially among winning teams.

No need for low class digs when there is suspicion about the current dominant performances. There's a good history to support concern.

 

[The Hitch]

I was going to write a reply, but I have better stuff to do than let if fall on deaf ears.

I don't see what that graph proves whatsoever, I am delighted that some random journalist decided to come up with it and give the clinic some recyclable material but I really don't care what he says unfortunately.

Apparently the graph was not made by a random journalist but by Bailsford himself.

Any thoughts on that revelation, or another Bailsford inspired "no comment"

 

[willbick]

you seriously want me to list 10 reasons why an athlete can not perform to the very best of his abilty for a period but then improve as circumstances change?? jeeez. i suppose u think its dead easy for an athlete to perform at the very best of his potential. its not. it requires a hell of a lot of expensive organisation and dedication

 

[Benotti69]

You can't really make a judgement on Rodgers from a single day, riders do feel underthe weather some days etc, he may be being saved for another stage.

So he should be up there at the finish in Chieti, which is tough, but not for a 'naturally' talented guy like Mick.

 

[Benotti69]

you seriously want me to list 10 reasons why an athlete can not perform to the very best of his abilty for a period but then improve as circumstances change?? jeeez. i suppose u think its dead easy for an athlete to perform at the very best of his potential. its not. it requires a hell of a lot of expensive organisation and dedication

You said you knew millions, but cant name 10 and deflect to prove you are doing nothing but trolling.

 

[Froome19]

Apparently the graph was not made by a random journalist but by Bailsford himself.

Any thoughts on that revelation, or another Bailsford inspired "no comment"

Apparently not

 

[The Hitch]

You can't really make a judgement on Rodgers from a single day, riders do feel underthe weather some days etc, he may be being saved for another stage.

I agree, I think Rogers will be better, I wouldnt even rule out Contador or Riis (if they have some intelligence) playing possum with their domestiques until the Tour and then doing full train like Sky.

But of course Rogers improving would only prove that he is doping on Saxo (which I fully expect him to) not that he was clean at sky.

 

[roundabout]

You can't really make a judgement on Rodgers from a single day, riders do feel underthe weather some days etc, he may be being saved for another stage.

Yeah, it's a bit early to tell, but after 2012 I expected him to be a leader for non-Contador stage races. Paris-Nice this year would have been a good course for him and yet it seems the most he can do is be a TTT motor right now.

 

[Franklin]

Froome must be on some pretty bad drugs if the best he can do is beat a 41 year old by 15 secs on a MTF

You mean that 41 year old who rode for that clean team called Radio Shack?

Pro-tip. Don't embarrass yourself by your astounding lack of cycling knowledge. I understand it's like a HUZZAH we be Brittish moment, but it kinda shows that you lack some insight in history.

He beat dopers here and that's quite odd... considering he seems to be one of the very few clean riders who managed to do that. Somehow Sky assembled every clean talented guy in the world and they are putting the hammer to the dopers. It's rather unbelievable wouldn't you say?

And the oddest thing here is that even though they manage to scout the biggest clean talents, they completely and utterly go back on their word on hiring clean staff. They even manage to hire a rather known doctor/team manager and not notice he once trained some "dubious" riders. they even manage to miss he was named in a court case for being accomplish to whereabouts fraud.

We could name other odd facts... the DS is very, very good friends with a personal drug courier of a guy called Lance Armstrong. Their main domestique screams about his best effort ever, which is amazing considering his Freiburg past (which somehow managed to slip through screening). Their second in command is having chronic Bilharzia and now rides the stones out of the pavement.

The problem is that this isn't "belief" or "thinking". These are facts. This is happening, these are words spoken by those involved.

Everyone who loves cycling would want DB to step down for lieing about Leinders and hiring him. Everyone who loves cycling would want to see Sky turned inside out so we know that the miracle is for the first time ever a true one.

Yet somehow the Sky fans don't want that. Why so afraid of the hard questions? Why are you guys okay with cold flatout lies? Are you perhaps afraid what will come out if it's come to light what is going on?

 

[del1962]

I love that you and willbick both have join dates in July 2012. That speaks volumes.



True, but he didn't have many off-days last year. Remarkably consistant, actually.

What is the arguement with Rodgers though, he doped with sky but not saxo, makes no sense to me

The quality of his dope not as good at saxo, no sense either

Different training regimes is more plausable, but as I say he may be underweather or held back for another stage

There again he may not be as settled in a non-English speaking team though, these things happen

 

[willbick]

So he should be up there at the finish in Chieti, which is tough, but not for a 'naturally' talented guy like Mick.

he wasnt 'up there at the finish' when with SKY so why should he be now??

 

[The Hitch]

Apparently not

Im confused. Does the graph shows what Bailsford thought of his riders in 2011, or is it a fabrication?