Hard to say. The UCI was complicit and looked the other way but it still comes down to the fact that it was the riders - and especially the Armstrong's of the peloton - and the teams who initiated the doping culture in the first place.MellowJohnny said:Is it the UCI (McQuid and Verbruggen) or is it the dopers Armstrong, Contador?
Personally I believe its the UCI
You forgot to mention Phil Liggett he has a significant impact on how new fans see riders.hrotha said:
Pretty much but all of them want you to believe that this was all in the past and none of them will ever take responsibility.hrotha said:
I don't think there was *one* critical variable. Numerous variables had to be in place. The Ruthless Armstrong, the facilitating Bruyneel, the Medical knowledge of Ferrari, and the compliance of the UCI all had to fall into place.MellowJohnny said:I'm just thinking what the critical variable is in all of this and I'm thinking UCI
if he wasn't LA it would have been someone else, Contador, Schelck, Ullrich, Basso, Landis, Virenque, etc - I wonder if future tour winners will be clean
You are correct.mountainrman said:It is the same problem with banking crash. Who was to blame? The bankers? Journalists for not raising enough questions? Regulators asleep on the job?
All of them , but mainly the last because regulators are our last line of defence.
In cycling we have one more problem - structural - that the sport promoters and regulators UCI are the same organisation, leading inexorablly to willingness to sweep bad news under the carpet,and that has given a hopeless conflict of interests. If nothing else, that must change.
Too hard to tell. Its like a school yard fight. Do you blame the two fighting. Maybe the circle of observers who chant "fight fight". What about the teachers who avoid that part of the playground because stuff happens there. The parents who tell their kids to hit anyone who puts **** on them. Easy answer. They are all to blame.H2OUUP2 said:That's basically the answer.
Would Armstrong be in the enforcer category, or dopers?
You left off ASO. Their money drives all of pro cycling. If they wanted clean cycling, they have the money to force the issue.hrotha said:
Could you help me out and tell me where the Government of Spain / Nation of Spain fits into your theorem? They could be enablers, but they seem like enablers on a much bigger scale than even rock star enablers.hrotha said: