- Aug 29, 2011
- 3,700
- 2,087
- 16,680
- Dec 12, 2010
- 1,179
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There's the main competition which is just the total points scored by your riders and then there's the green jersey competition where you get points every time your team is among the best performing of the week. Like the Tour de France with the GC and the green jersey (hence the name) if you think of each week as a CQ stage.
The green jersey competition tend to reward teams that go against the grain. If you have popular riders it's harder to stand out and consistenly score green jersey points because you'll always have some other team with the same mix of picks plus some obscure guy that had a random good ride that week that will marginally outscore you. There was a year where skidmark tried to implement a polka dot jersey but that competition didn't last. It was based on who were the best "climbers" in the rankings every week which meant only people bouncing around in the middle of the pack had a shot. But essentially teams were being rewarded for being average. That felt like a bit of a backhanded compliment so it didn't really generate much interest. I can't think of another set up that would make sense for a polka dot jersey but I'm wondering if we could establish a white jersey for best rookie or something.
Going for a Pogacar, Van Aert or Evenepoel is the guarantee that 1/ you'll see some huge weeks (for instance the Tour GC for Pogacar) because they are so good and 2/ nobody else can match your team when that happens because nobody else has them. Most green jersey winner finished with 250-300 points so you need like a 8-12 good weeks (you can get up to 45 points if you outscore everybody during a given week) to seal the deal and the three guys I mentioned can probably get most of that on their own. So they can do a lot of heavy lifting in this competition despite probably not being optimal picks in the regular ranking (spending so many points on a rider that probably won't turn a huge profit is difficult to work around). That's why they are green jersey instead of GC oriented pick.
Excluding last year (there were like three or four good Evenepoel teams so every time he had a good week they would scoop up all the green jersey points and he had a lot of good weeks), there's actually little correlation between how well teams are doing in both rankings. So that competition can salvage a season for a struggling team in the overall classification. It's also a lot less predictable because past success during the year doesn't mean anything for the next week. That makes it a chaotic mess most years and I really enjoy that aspect. Also it's harder to create a sizable gap in the green jersey classification so it's usually in play right until the last week of the season (at least from a mathematical standpoint) and that's fun as well.
- May 14, 2009
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Ha ha, let's see. But of course, Amissa Bongo is a possibility for Tesson to shine, but Manzin is also on the team and has ridden the race with stage victories in both '19 and '20. Looking at the startlist, I am more frustrated by the fact that I left out Mulubrhan in the end. He is my pick for the overall.
In other news: Jay Vine wins the AUS TT NC. Didn't see that coming. Must be a huge confidence booster for the 7 Jay Vine teams.
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- Jan 4, 2023
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- Jul 16, 2011
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Disappointed that Plapp had a mechanical. But he still picked up points, so can't grumble too much. And I have good squads for TDU and San Juan.
- Dec 28, 2010
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Shame about Plapp's chain drop, but he's had a good start to the season anyway.
In a similar vein to the other one-to-one rider comparisons here, Plapp vs Vine could be an interesting CQ duel to follow through the year. Both really talented Aussies with some possible team hierarchy issues.
In a similar vein to the other one-to-one rider comparisons here, Plapp vs Vine could be an interesting CQ duel to follow through the year. Both really talented Aussies with some possible team hierarchy issues.
That was not really surprising though. Bingoal sending both their sprinters to one race while they have other suitable races going would be a bit weird.
Manzin said in an interview that he'll be a leadout for Tesson this year, so the team seems to really believe in their new signing. This race has mostly been won by sprinters or a random breakaway, so I wouldn't be so sure that Mulubrhan is better for the overall than Tesson, unless there are some added difficulties to the route this year. But Mulubrhan could be a random breakaway option of course.
Yeah, Vine will be interesting to follow. I first had him in my team, but decided after his transfer to UAE to drop him out of my team. Mainly because I thought that he will end up as a dom in a lot of races. He will do a lot of races together with Almeida in the first half of the season, so if he is stronger than Almeida he can score, but if he´s weaker he will mainly be used as a teammate.. Because only 7 users picked him, I think a lot of other players had the same thoughts about him..
- Dec 12, 2010
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I have no confidence at all in Total Energies ability to control every stage so I'm not sure Tesson is a real threat for the GC. Vercher is my rarest rider and he'll also be there so I'll be very invested in that race. None of my top riders are riding anywhere in January apparently so it would be nice to not to drop too far back in the rankings in the meantime.
- Sep 2, 2011
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The ceiling is certainly very high, but there are 2 reasons why I decided aginst picking him:
- UAE is very crowded (Pog, Almeida, Yates, Ayuso, McNulty can all claim leadership in one week stage races...)
- Tendency to crash, which is normal for someone who has very little experience in riding with a prop peloton
- May 4, 2011
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Yeah, and we could all be wrong. Would be quite comical, though, if Almeida ended up having to dom for Vine. We know Almeida loved to work for Evenepoel.... Though who knows, maybe the whole team has stepped up. Almeida and Vine, the new Aru and Landa ;-)
I knew Oscar Onley would be picked by some after his ride in the Cro Race, but maybe not 42 times!
He was a piece I couldnt fit into the puzzle. I hesitated a bit about him, given his young age and I didnt how to value his performance in that race.
What are your expectations on him?
He was a piece I couldnt fit into the puzzle. I hesitated a bit about him, given his young age and I didnt how to value his performance in that race.
What are your expectations on him?
- Jul 16, 2011
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Noticed at the Tour of Britain. Good climbing results (ie Mont Blanc). But I am guessing that most people would have taken the view "if he can hang with Vingo on the climbs, then he's bliimin cheap at that price".
- Dec 27, 2016
- 549
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Good day gentle people. Reveal day is one of my favorite days of the year. I'm so thankful for this site and Skidmark for making this happen. This year, I couldnt wait to list my team and why/why not for my picks. However, after reading through everyone's comments, I went back and reviewed my team. This included news searches and review of last few years results. After that, I got depressed. I couldnt find any good rationale for many of my more expensive riders. So lost all interest in describing my team.
Those with ADD may recognize the issue here. You can spend days going over all the data and possibilities. Mull over different options. Come up with 2-3 good rosters. Then at the last minute, put together a totally different roster that is completely different. Kind of like a restaurant. I'll have 2 or 3 options chosen from the menu. But when the waiter comes to the table, I choose a completely random menu item I wasnt even looking at that. Perhaps by next weekend I will describe my team, while I watch TDU. In the meantime, I guess I'll just enjoy that I have Plapp and Vine and could potentially do well in the first week
Those with ADD may recognize the issue here. You can spend days going over all the data and possibilities. Mull over different options. Come up with 2-3 good rosters. Then at the last minute, put together a totally different roster that is completely different. Kind of like a restaurant. I'll have 2 or 3 options chosen from the menu. But when the waiter comes to the table, I choose a completely random menu item I wasnt even looking at that. Perhaps by next weekend I will describe my team, while I watch TDU. In the meantime, I guess I'll just enjoy that I have Plapp and Vine and could potentially do well in the first week
Good day gentle people. Reveal day is one of my favorite days of the year. I'm so thankful for this site and Skidmark for making this happen. This year, I couldnt wait to list my team and why/why not for my picks. However, after reading through everyone's comments, I went back and reviewed my team. This included news searches and review of last few years results. After that, I got depressed. I couldnt find any good rationale for many of my more expensive riders. So lost all interest in describing my team.
Those with ADD may recognize the issue here. You can spend days going over all the data and possibilities. Mull over different options. Come up with 2-3 good rosters. Then at the last minute, put together a totally different roster that is completely different. Kind of like a restaurant. I'll have 2 or 3 options chosen from the menu. But when the waiter comes to the table, I choose a completely random menu item I wasnt even looking at that. Perhaps by next weekend I will describe my team, while I watch TDU. In the meantime, I guess I'll just enjoy that I have Plapp and Vine and could potentially do well in the first week
Dont beat yourself up!
I took a glance at your team just now and overall I think you got a good team! With both Vine and Plapp you have a great start. Cant be many with that combo.
Well, after reading this thread I have a stronger and stronger impression that my inexperience has left me with insufficient knowledge to come up with a really good strategy for this game and perhaps I won't be able to fight for top10 overall this year.
I have a feeling that I have made at least one big mistake that will seem obvious in 12 months.
I have a feeling that I have made at least one big mistake that will seem obvious in 12 months.
- Dec 28, 2010
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That's very harsh on yourself! In this year of many different options, your team is as viable as a lot of others, I think. And an analysis from a former winner is always interesting to read.Good day gentle people. Reveal day is one of my favorite days of the year. I'm so thankful for this site and Skidmark for making this happen. This year, I couldnt wait to list my team and why/why not for my picks. However, after reading through everyone's comments, I went back and reviewed my team. This included news searches and review of last few years results. After that, I got depressed. I couldnt find any good rationale for many of my more expensive riders. So lost all interest in describing my team.
Those with ADD may recognize the issue here. You can spend days going over all the data and possibilities. Mull over different options. Come up with 2-3 good rosters. Then at the last minute, put together a totally different roster that is completely different. Kind of like a restaurant. I'll have 2 or 3 options chosen from the menu. But when the waiter comes to the table, I choose a completely random menu item I wasnt even looking at that. Perhaps by next weekend I will describe my team, while I watch TDU. In the meantime, I guess I'll just enjoy that I have Plapp and Vine and could potentially do well in the first week
Looking at your team, you have many of the expensive/mid range picks that I either have or heavily considered. Yates was one of the picks I alluded to when I commented on 'several viable' ones in the 600-1000 range. I didn't really consider him for my team, but I can see why someone could be lured by his high ceiling. He did DNF both GTs and had almost zero one-day results last year, after all. So there's definitely reason to hope he can improve. Wright and Turner are the classics types that I'm not really sold on for a game like this due to being somewhat dependant on one specific period of the season (and races where luck plays a part), but a lot of others seem to believe they can make a big profit, so it's not like it's a glaring mistake.
Other than the three above-mentioned Brits, I either picked or considered all of your 200+ riders.
Our cost distribution is very similar, so it's gonna be interesting to follow Gaudu vs Yates and Ewan/Ackermann vs Vine/Wright, which are the only differences between our teams in the 400+ segment.
- Dec 27, 2016
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- Jan 9, 2022
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Good day gentle people. Reveal day is one of my favorite days of the year. I'm so thankful for this site and Skidmark for making this happen. This year, I couldnt wait to list my team and why/why not for my picks. However, after reading through everyone's comments, I went back and reviewed my team. This included news searches and review of last few years results. After that, I got depressed. I couldnt find any good rationale for many of my more expensive riders. So lost all interest in describing my team.
Those with ADD may recognize the issue here. You can spend days going over all the data and possibilities. Mull over different options. Come up with 2-3 good rosters. Then at the last minute, put together a totally different roster that is completely different. Kind of like a restaurant. I'll have 2 or 3 options chosen from the menu. But when the waiter comes to the table, I choose a completely random menu item I wasnt even looking at that. Perhaps by next weekend I will describe my team, while I watch TDU. In the meantime, I guess I'll just enjoy that I have Plapp and Vine and could potentially do well in the first week
You picked Alaphillipe and Bernal, so you are clearly more shrewd than me!
The fun is that cycling is so unpredictable, that even if we can't all win, we can still be the hero for a week or two, sometime in the season.
- Dec 27, 2016
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I guess i was looking at Yates and thinking that, unless its 2018 again, he's always around the same points. But maybe this is his year again. I'm a huge fan of Gaudu. In the spring and TdF. Once i abandoned my attempts to include Toglic, I bounced between Almeida, Yates and Gaudu. Went with yates as he is the clear team leader in every race he will be in. I had Ewan./Ackermann in my sites, but I have never had good luck picking sprinters. It seems you need to pick the correct winners of grand tour stages, or pick a DeLie who races a bunch of smaller races. So I gave up completely on sprinters except for cheapos like Bol and dekker.
- Dec 12, 2010
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I don't get it, I think your team is very good. Yates scored 2261 points on a 858 price in 2018. I'm not saying he's going to repeat that as that season looks like a bit of an outlier but also we've seen him be one of the best picks of all time at that exact price point so it's hard to fault that selection. Plapp/Johannessen/Vine is a really strong core of 400ish riders. I'm intrigued to see what Turner can do this year. Van Baarle leaving bumps him up in the cobbles hierarchy at Ineos. I know Hugo Koblet is fairly high on his potential as well.Good day gentle people. Reveal day is one of my favorite days of the year. I'm so thankful for this site and Skidmark for making this happen. This year, I couldnt wait to list my team and why/why not for my picks. However, after reading through everyone's comments, I went back and reviewed my team. This included news searches and review of last few years results. After that, I got depressed. I couldnt find any good rationale for many of my more expensive riders. So lost all interest in describing my team.
Those with ADD may recognize the issue here. You can spend days going over all the data and possibilities. Mull over different options. Come up with 2-3 good rosters. Then at the last minute, put together a totally different roster that is completely different. Kind of like a restaurant. I'll have 2 or 3 options chosen from the menu. But when the waiter comes to the table, I choose a completely random menu item I wasnt even looking at that. Perhaps by next weekend I will describe my team, while I watch TDU. In the meantime, I guess I'll just enjoy that I have Plapp and Vine and could potentially do well in the first week
Besides even if your top picks struggle that's not necessarily game over. Skidmark's 2012 team is by far the best ever and their most expensive guy didn't even break even. In 2020, my team finished 8th despite a combined return of 2329 points for a cost of 3630 points for my 5 most expensive picks. Yeah that was an odd year but every team in front at least broke even with their 5 most expensive riders. That's just to show that when things go right, cheaper guys can make up for underwhelming pricey options.
Fun stat time. squire finished 6th last year with 16867 points. Their 3 most expensive picks (Pidcock, Jakobsen and Moscon) costed 1912 points and scored just 1539. Your three most expensive riders cost 1947 points. You wanna bet that Yates, Pidcock and Alaphilippe are going to score more than 1539 ? Hell nobody here should be shocked if Alaphilippe does it on his own.
- Dec 28, 2010
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I've also been disappointed by a few of my semi-expensive sprinters in the past, like Ewan, Kristoff and Matthews, but they also very rarely bomb completely unless they're Kittel.
And yes, the calendar has a lot to do with it when it comes to sprinters. I realize I haven't talked about Ewan and Ackermann at all so far, so I might as well do a little breakdown of why they're in my team. I know @Panda Claws questioned people's faith in the German earlier.
I had Ewan last year, and he was very unlucky with a constantly disrupted season. I think he's a much better pick this time, with Lotto's new and very cynical points-driven approach, and also the arrival of Guarnieri, who got Demare a lot of his wins. Ewan being able to do the Aussie summer also helps.
For Ackermann, the story is not that different. Broken coccyx followed by serious finger injury, then a hurried return at the Vuelta. No Gaviria means nobody to block any of the races he should be in, and they've retained Molano who, although he'll probably get his own chances, will probably also work for Ackermann in some big races. He can also freelance pretty well, as seen in his Bredene Koksijde win. And lastly, UAE's calendar is absolutely massive with a lot of opportunities, and the fact they have such strong stage racers might mean that Ackermann is left to focus almost exclusively on 'his' kind of races. If he was in a worse team, I could risk him being put into some more unsuitable one-week WT stage races in order for the team to have some kind of shot at some result. That won't happen at UAE. As a bonus, he's also a very likeable guy!
Hey folks, so I've corrected the names and figured out the teams that I might have missed in the initial popularity table, and I am going to release the 'official' popularity table today. The two teams I didn't enter earlier had a couple of riders that had been unique picks before (plus corrections of misspellings had this effect as well), so unfortunately for those who like their unique picks, a couple may have changed.
I'm happy to say that we officially have 103 teams this year! After the heady peak of 2015 or so with 150+ teams, the game has seen fewer participants in recent years, but we've reversed this trend somewhat and are back in triple digits.
In other news, CQ released an update!? I guess since the Aussie RR was on a Sunday they released their weekly Monday update. So I'll have Update #1 in the next 24 hours, which really puts the pressure on me to clean up the spreadsheet a bit.
Excited to see all the team discussion! I hope to have a writeup for some of my riders soon, but as usual there's a bit of work to do on the admin front so it's hard to find time.
I'm happy to say that we officially have 103 teams this year! After the heady peak of 2015 or so with 150+ teams, the game has seen fewer participants in recent years, but we've reversed this trend somewhat and are back in triple digits.
In other news, CQ released an update!? I guess since the Aussie RR was on a Sunday they released their weekly Monday update. So I'll have Update #1 in the next 24 hours, which really puts the pressure on me to clean up the spreadsheet a bit.
Excited to see all the team discussion! I hope to have a writeup for some of my riders soon, but as usual there's a bit of work to do on the admin front so it's hard to find time.
- May 5, 2010
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Everyone has these deeply thought-out reasonings for picking riders, and I'm like "I like him, he has a cool name, he... seems interesting" (those do not necessarily apply to all my picks.)
Then there's Samu, with his "Basque connection, and Nans Peters" team.
Then there's Samu, with his "Basque connection, and Nans Peters" team.
- Sep 26, 2020
- 25,238
- 27,655
- 23,180
Looking at your team, I'm pretty sure you picked it solely based on Danishness, coolnameness and goatownerness.
And you got an X, Y, Z score of 6.
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