The 2025 CQ Ranking Manager Thread

[Panda Claws]

TDU line-up
- TORRES Pablo
- HERRADA Jesús
- HAMILTON Lucas
- VAN BAARLE Dylan
- BELOKI Markel
- WITHEN PHILIPSEN Albert
- BAGIOLI Andrea

Not a great line-up but hopefully enough to get some points.

 

[RedheadDane]

Not a great line-up but hopefully enough to get some points.

Well, it's a WT race, so unless they all crash out, you're gonna get some points.

 

[bminchow]

I know y'all are probably sick of reading owners comments about their teams, but i have a few minutes so let this game journeyman spout some of his nonsense. Side note: I retired last week with the intent to do a lot more riding and to watch more cycling. But the day after i gave notice, I herniated a disc in my back. So it's no riding (or even walking) and ready to watch all the cycling.

It appears that way back in October I cut out out all riders from my list that were more than 1614 points (Van Der Poel). So I didnt even see that Jonas was a potential option. Which is probably for the best because I already spent too much time on this and ended up mostly picking cyclists I'd like to watch anyway.

VAN AERT Wout - Was in half my draft line ups. Really wanted to leave him out and get other guys I liked. But I think he is ready to go big (even in grand tours) and couldnt leave him off.

The next 8 riders are all picked by 20 or less owners. Is that a good thing?
NYS Thibau - I just love to watch him finish off a race.
PITHIE Laurence - I just love to watch him finish off a race (both these guys were probably too expensive, but i just want to have some fun this year. Should have probably gone Van Eetvelt instead).
BAUDIN Alex - WTH? This just goes to show you what having ADHD can do to your line ups. This was Lipowitz, and Healy, and Simon Yates, and Jai Hindley, and Derek Gee. I have no idea how I landed on Baudin. You are welcome.
POOLE Max - Missed half the year and looks to keep getting better at climbing. I really liked this one.
VINE Jay - All the talent. One of these days he doubles his points. Need UAE to help him out with a schedule.
HAGENES Per Strand - Cost way too much but I love Norwegians for some reason. And he is pretty good too.
DUNBAR Edward - After watching the Vuelta, I'm hoping he is on an upturn in his career. I had almost given up on him.
TEUTENBERG Tim Torn - I just feel Lidl is going to send him to smaller races. Although I already see Pedersen in a couple smaller French races to start the year.

Okay, then i just started picking more obvious picks y'all already commented on:
LAFAY Victor - Because he missed multiple months last year due to injury
UIJTDEBROEKS Cian - Obvious
BUCHMANN Emanuel - A big fish in a small pond may get some Martin-like points. or a stage win.
NORDHAGEN Jørgen - way to good to miss out on.
SÖDERQVIST Jakob - Not sure, but has a good ITT.
WIDAR Jarno - Way too early but way to good as well.
GEOGHEGAN HART Tao - Cheap
DE SCHUYTENEER Steffen - last minute addition. Lotto is point hunting and DeLie can't race them all.
TORRES ARIAS Pablo - Probably too early but y'all will have him so, so will I.
BEHRENS Niklas - Great talent but not sure where points will come from this year.
KÄMNA Lennard - Man I picked a lot of Germans

Throw in a few more long shot rookies and some obvious picks:
DONALDSON Robert - Classics?
ARTZ Huub - Classics and sprints?
KRON Andreas Lorentz - I have no idea what happened last year, but this is fair odds
BISIAUX Léo - Nobody else excited me at 60 points. No expectations here.
VERMEERSCH Florian - Obvious
GLOAG Thomas - Cheap
ORINS Robin - Another Lotto points hunter?
VAN BAARLE Dylan - No expectations but could get lucky somewhere, somehow
TULETT Ben - What happened last year?
GESBERT Elie - Boring Cheap
HELLEMOSE Asbjørn - Will get some points somewhere. Right?
WITHEN PHILIPSEN Albert - Too young but needed zero pointer
SEIXAS Paul - Too young but needed zero pointer

 

[EvansIsTheBest]

Last year I went with a more unorthodox strategy and only picked under 500 points riders for my team finishing 4th in the process. I decided to stay with a more rare strategy and pick 3 riders over 1200 points this time. (Vingegaard , Van Aert and Ayuso) Not sure if anyone else have 3 riders over 1000 or 1200 this year but pretty sure not a lot of people went this route.

Something that I would like to discuss is the Ayuso pick. In my mind he was at least as obvious as Van Aert as a pick but way less people chose him. Last season he only scored 35 points in Grand Tours ( DNFed Tor de France and did not participated in the other2) Two years ago he started his season in Romandie(late april) and still got over 1000 points. This year he should at least podium Giro if Pogacar decide not to go and with his TT abilities he is a favorite to win any 1 week races. In my opinion he is the best climber/grand tour cyclist in the world behind Pogacar, Vingegaard, Evanepoel and Roglic. In an interview he gave this December he said that his long term objective is to be better than his teammate Pogacar so he clearly does not lack confidence. Did you guys also considered him or it was clear for you that Van Aert and Vingegaard are better options?

Ayuso has three straight seasons of scoring basically the same number of points and he was pretty popular each time so I guess a bunch of people just moved on. It's tempting to say well he scores 1000 points in half a season so he should get to 2000 in a full season but I don't think you can wave away the fact that he has never managed to do a full season. Maybe he's just a young kid that got unlucky a couple times. Maybe that's just who he is.

Either way there's an uncertainty there that you don't have with Van Aert and Vingegaard who have dominated from February to September without interruption on multiple occasions.

 

[Salvarani]

Van Aert will be 31 later this year.

Was his peak the second half of 2020 to 2022?

He has two consecutive seasons of scoring less now, albeit for different reasons. One could view that as something ominous though.

Lost his coach to another team.

The crashes.

There is a chance he could still produce a big year, but he also has some things fighting against him in the last couple of seasons.

I dont like the Giro-Tour combo at all.

I would have put more faith in Vingegaard to bounce back scoring +2000 points.

 

[repre]

Ayuso has three straight seasons of scoring basically the same number of points and he was pretty popular each time so I guess a bunch of people just moved on. It's tempting to say well he scores 1000 points in half a season so he should get to 2000 in a full season but I don't think you can wave away the fact that he has never managed to do a full season. Maybe he's just a young kid that got unlucky a couple times. Maybe that's just who he is.

Either way there's an uncertainty there that you don't have with Van Aert and Vingegaard who have dominated from February to September without interruption on multiple occasions.

His main issue is his team. He got bumped down in order last season after he was not a winderkind uphill they thought he were.

 

[ingsve]

TORRES ARIAS Pablo - No long climbs so here for experience?

It will really be interesting to see Torres on the climbs of TDU compared to Johannes Staune Mittet last year. JSM struggled even on the easier early stages to stay with the peloton to the end, being dropped in the easiest of climbs. It will be interesting in comparison to see how someone else young a new to WT handles the same situation this early in the season.

 

[ingsve]

Van Aert will be 31 later this year.

Was his peak the second half of 2020 to 2022?

He has two consecutive seasons of scoring less now, albeit for different reasons. One could view that as something ominous though.

Lost his coach to another team.

The crashes.

There is a chance he could still produce a big year, but he also has some things fighting against him in the last couple of seasons.

I dont like the Giro-Tour combo at all.

I would have put more faith in Vingegaard to bounce back scoring +2000 points.

31 is not a high age for a cyclist though if they take care of themselves, especially classics riders. His speed might be affected so he might not feature in bunch sprints as much as he did in his best years but I see no reason why he couldn't keep his level for even another 5 years if he doesn't hurt himself.

 

[Salvarani]

31 is not a high age for a cyclist though if they take care of themselves, especially classics riders. His speed might be affected so he might not feature in bunch sprints as much as he did in his best years but I see no reason why he couldn't keep his level for even another 5 years if he doesn't hurt himself.

I dont disagree, but I also dont think it is a given.

 

[ingsve]

The next 8 riders are all picked by 20 or less owners. Is that a good thing?
NYS Thibau - I just love to watch him finish off a race.
PITHIE Laurence - I just love to watch him finish off a race (both these guys were probably too expensive, but i just want to have some fun this year. Should have probably gone Van Eetvelt instead).
BAUDIN Alex - WTH? This just goes to show you what having ADHD can do to your line ups. This was Lipowitz, and Healy, and Simon Yates, and Jai Hindley, and Derek Gee. I have no idea how I landed on Baudin. You are welcome.
POOLE Max - Missed half the year and looks to keep getting better at climbing. I really liked this one.
VINE Jay - All the talent. One of these days he doubles his points. Need UAE to help him out with a schedule.
HAGENES Per Strand - Cost way too much but I love Norwegians for some reason. And he is pretty good too.
DUNBAR Edward - After watching the Vuelta, I'm hoping he is on an upturn in his career. I had almost given up on him.
TEUTENBERG Tim Torn - I just feel Lidl is going to send him to smaller races. Although I already see Pedersen in a couple smaller French races to start the year.

You seem to have a tendency to like riders that I would pick if they were like 200 points cheaper or so. I had both Dunbar and Poole in my injury list during the season but they ended up being too expensive in the end to where I wanted to go for them. Same with Teutenberg who seemed like a good prospect but he was too good and got too expensive for where I think he might go in a year.

 

[Anderis]

You seem to have a tendency to like riders that I would pick if they were like 200 points cheaper or so

TBH, being 200 points cheaper would put A LOT more riders into my area of interest so it's not unusual.

 

[repre]

Hey @Shakes , i got an idea for your website. What about drafting the team there?

Is it possible to create a team on the separate page? It would be easier for newbies and also a modern way to create the team. The way we do our teams now are archaich and more convinient way to create the team would be great for recruitment.

I have the league of 23 ukrainians on PCS but they don't play CQ game because it's too hard for starters and also they don't want to waste a lot of time like we do now.

Easier to create a team - more people will play the game.

 

[Wvv]

I still really regret overlooking Kron, and to a lesser extent Dinham. Besides that I'm happy with how my team is looking. However, the Australian races will set me back from the start.

 

[Shakes]

Hey @Shakes , i got an idea for your website. What about drafting the team there?

Is it possible to create a team on the separate page? It would be easier for newbies and also a modern way to create the team. The way we do our teams now are archaich and more convinient way to create the team would be great for recruitment.

I have the league of 23 ukrainians on PCS but they don't play CQ game because it's too hard for starters and also they don't want to waste a lot of time like we do now.

Easier to create a team - more people will play the game.

Yes its possible. Although then I'd first want to get more rider data (country, team, age) to filter on. However a simplified version would be quick like the combo search of today.

Might require some logging in as well (with email). Anyway, a simple version would be quick. Could try for giro game or something.

 

[repre]

Yes its possible. Although then I'd first want to get more rider data (country, team, age) to filter on. However a simplified version would be quick like the combo search of today.

Might require some logging in as well (with email). Anyway, a simple version would be quick. Could try for giro game or something.

It would be great to add this feature for the next year's game

 

[skidmark]

My apologies, I can see how that specific comment sounds harsh. I really didn't mean to sound condescending, but I can see how that comment comes off that way, so I'm sorry about that.

No no, I was trying to be cheeky in response, I didn't take it harshly at all. I was mostly interested in your comments because I (like you) am super interested in game strategy, and your comments highlighted exactly as you say how there are many factors to take into account... and in particular I was intrigued in thinking about how some of the most thoughtful strategists in this game can have different approaches. So it's all taken in good discussion, I was just responding to that particular comment in passing and jokingly!

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Yes its possible. Although then I'd first want to get more rider data (country, team, age) to filter on. However a simplified version would be quick like the combo search of today.

Might require some logging in as well (with email). Anyway, a simple version would be quick. Could try for giro game or something.

with the Giro Game (and other GTs) there is a very limited number of riders to pick from: I make a one page spreadsheet selection tool; the Spring Classics Game, like this one, has an unlimited list to pick from. Be interesting to liaise with you in the prep for that (it uses the end of year prices, the same ones as used in this game, and will close shortly before the Omloop starts on 1st March) (don't take that as the official launch)

 

[skidmark]

Those of you who have picked Jarne Van de Paar, can you tell me what was going on in 2024 and if his issues have been solved? I really wanted to pick him, but I simply couldn't find any information at all, so I thought it was too risky.

I was in the exact same boat as you - I was intrigued because I had no memory of ever hearing about this rider before until I was making my longlist, I couldn't find anything about him, but the pattern of results seemed promising and Lotto is generally pretty good at a) developing talents and b) maximizing any chance they have to score UCI points, which meant if he's healthy they'll put him in a position to win. So I was like, why did he only ride 24 days in 2024? Why nothing really after May aside from a few DNFs? But I couldn't find anything, which made me even more intrigued. In the end, I needed someone about that price, and figured I'd take a flier because he probably wouldn't be popular and no one else spoke to me at that price really.

Ironically based on our last discussion about risk, I guess I wasn't risk-averse in this situation. I guess its easier at 200 points than 800+. Honestly I kind of do this every year, like there's someone I just decide to throw on at the end because they're a bit of a mystery and I'm just sick of combing through the list of riders trying to make a decision so I decide to go with something novel. Last year it was Zeb Kyffin and that worked out horribly (and Thomas Gloag, who I couldn't find any info on). So, probably not the worst choice of yours to not take him.

 

[skidmark]

Although it would mean that he is below the stipulated 25 riders. Not sure if there is a sanction for self-penalisation like that.

(Other than Firefly's entry of 25 names, I see a handful of teams with 32: miscounting, or not believing that there are any zero pointers capable of getting something on the board?)

It's happened once or twice before, and back then the community (and I) agreed that since there wasn't any benefit to having fewer than 25 riders, if someone wanted to play that way they are free to do so. Honestly I've been meaning to take out the qualification of 25 riders minimum, as it seems self evident. But if someone wants to make a boutique team with fewer players I'd be happy to accept it.

I responded to Shakes' DM on this, but yes that rider has been dropped. Also noticed NorthAmericanScum had the same naming for that rider but was still within 7500 with his 47 points, so I just corrected the spelling.

 

[Shakes]

with the Giro Game (and other GTs) there is a very limited number of riders to pick from: I make a one page spreadsheet selection tool; the Spring Classics Game, like this one, has an unlimited list to pick from. Be interesting to liaise with you in the prep for that (it uses the end of year prices, the same ones as used in this game, and will close shortly before the Omloop starts on 1st March) (don't take that as the official launch)

Happy to have a look!

 

[skidmark]

Yes its possible. Although then I'd first want to get more rider data (country, team, age) to filter on. However a simplified version would be quick like the combo search of today.

Might require some logging in as well (with email). Anyway, a simple version would be quick. Could try for giro game or something.

That sounds great, totally agree this would be a good idea. I am happy compiling teams in the 'analog' (I mean, spreadsheets are still digital, but pretty archaic) way and it feels like a fun tradition, but really the possibilities of the website you've built have been making me think. I didn't really consider it at the start of this year as the website just came on mid-stream last year, but I'm very into what repre is suggesting in terms of making it easier for the user to participate (rather than try to access a shared spreadsheet and download it, etc).

Anyway, we can flesh out these ideas this year - I'm excited about anything that makes the game better, and honestly there are probably ways the site could be used to ease administrative burden significantly.

Still like the tradition of weekly updates though, so those aren't going anywhere!

 

[repre]

That sounds great, totally agree this would be a good idea. I am happy compiling teams in the 'analog' (I mean, spreadsheets are still digital, but pretty archaic) way and it feels like a fun tradition, but really the possibilities of the website you've built have been making me think. I didn't really consider it at the start of this year as the website just came on mid-stream last year, but I'm very into what repre is suggesting in terms of making it easier for the user to participate (rather than try to access a shared spreadsheet and download it, etc).

Anyway, we can flesh out these ideas this year - I'm excited about anything that makes the game better, and honestly there are probably ways the site could be used to ease administrative burden significantly.

Still like the tradition of weekly updates though, so those aren't going anywhere!

Updates are cool. With website u can make them more fun and less 'administrative'. Maybe some funny nominations instead of the spreadsheet work!

 

[EvansIsTheBest]

Updates are cool. With website u can make them more fun and less 'administrative'. Maybe some funny nominations instead of the spreadshit work!

Spreadshit is one of the funniest typo I've ever read.

 

[repre]

Spreadshit is one of the funniest typo I've ever read.

It's so evident that i don't like Excel?))

 

[EvansIsTheBest]

I figure I should explain some of the less popular picks on my team.

DE SCHUYTENEER Steffen (125 points, picked 20 times)
PTSD from missing out on De Lie in 2022.

RICCITELLO Matthew (333 points, picked 17 times)
Exactly the type of picks I tend to make. Young, ascending GC rider with a consistent baseline and the potential to break through. His results in stage races last season: 12th in UAE tour, DNF in Catalunya, 13th in the Giro d’Abruzzo, 5th in the Tour de Suisse, 6th in the Sibiu Tour and 30th in the Vuelta (where he was much more impressive than that GC would let you believe). I think he is ready to get a few top 10s in WT one week races.

TEUTENBERG Tim Torn (253 points, picked 17 times)
Impressive in Mallorca last year. He was consistently good at the lower levels last year. It’s time to step up now and replicate that form in bigger races.

HATHERLY Alan (18 points, 8 picks)
Recent cross overs from mountain bike to road racing haven’t been the instant sensations that Cadel Evans or Jean-Christophe Péraud were but it’s always fun to follow riders from other disciplines try their hand at road racing. There’s also not much downside at that price. I don’t recall ever picking Impey or Van Rensburg so I believe this is my first South African ever.

RONDEL Mathys (131 points, 9 picks)
Did you know that his score is artificially low because he was stripped of his win in stage 3 of the Istrian Spring Trophy (for going through a roundabout in a non UCI approved manner) ? Well now you know and understand why it’s only a matter of time before Hirschi, Alaphilippe, Trentin and Storer are his domestiques. More seriously, I like what Tudor is building but they don’t have a ton of climbers yet so I can definitely see him get a few GC opportunities.

ISIDORE Noa (127 points, 9 picks)
He had some interesting results at the .2 level including winning the GC of the Istrian Spring Trophy (in a field that included Pellizari for instance). Bet you didn’t expect two references to that race in the span of a couple sentences. Anyway, he can score in one day races as well as GCs which is always a plus. Honestly his results versus pros are more impressive than his U23 results which is kind of rare. It looks like, the bigger the race, the better the stronger he is so I’m curious to see how he handles the step up in competition.

CRAPS Lars (132 points, 3 picks)
Every year I try to get one or two riders that are reasonable picks that I expect to be rare/unique so I have somebody to cheer for. Lars Craps is that guy in 2025.

SÖDERQVIST Jakob (164 points, 3 picks)
I’ve talked a bit about him already. Quite expensive for a guy on a development team but I don’t expect him to stay there all year. Worst case, just call him up for a couple stage races where an ITT determines the GC like Poitou Charentes or Denmark plus dominate the U23 scene and it should turn out fine.

CHRISTEN Jan (547 points, 14 picks)
I had him in my team last year until I swapped him out last minute. We all make mistakes, we don’t have to repeat them. So he is in this time. With Hirschi and Ulissi gone, he is about to Hirschi the UCI calendar like nobody has ever Hirschied before (yes I know it’s not a verb, leave me alone).

PIGANZOLI Davide (523 points, 1 pick)
Does it make sense to spend over 500 points on a rider from Polti ? Probably not but Piganzoli checks a LOT of boxes. Is he the best rider on his team and will get every leadership oportunity he can handle ? Check. Want a guy that will consistenly crank out points in every stage race he enters ? Check (his 8 stage races in 2024: 14th in Valenciana, 1st in Antalya, 18th in Tirreno, 10th in the Alps, 13th in the Giro, 11th in Burgos, 9th in Luxembourg with only a DNF in Slovenia due to a crash). Want a guy that can dominate against weaker competition ? Check (see his Antalya result). Sure he might get that kind of easy points most of the time but he is also riding for Polti, it’s not like he’ll see a bunch of WT riders every week. Did he seem to improve as the Giro wore on, showing good recovery skills ? Check. Do you want a 22 years old that just did the best time trial AND the best one day race of his career in the last month of his season hinting that he hasn’t reached his full potential yet ? Check. Want a guy that can score a lot during the Italian fall to carry my team and avoid my usual September collapse ? Check. Want an expensive rider that is also going to be quite rare and exciting to follow ? Check. What more could you want ?

By the way, he isn’t on my team but I’m absolutely shocked that nobody picked Gautherat. How often do you see a guy score over 400 points as a 21 years old, go into the next season healthy as far as I can tell and not get selected even once ?