Teams & Riders The Great Big Cycling Transfers, Extensions, and Rumours Thread

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SafeBet

SafeBet

Sep 2, 2011
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Valv.Piti said:
Why is that?

I always wondered why literally none of all these puncheurs actually made a name of themselves on the big stage.
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There's no easy answer. Mayo gave you some insights on how some teams operate.

I'll add that the Italian youth / u23 system has been broken for a long time, most of the teams and coaches haven't updated their training approaches for years. Riders struggle to adapt when they turn pro (abroad).

The Italian calendar for youth categories has major flaws too. Riders have to race almost every weekend, most of the time one day races with very similar parcours (short, sometimes technical circuit with hills) which is the reason why you'll see a gazillion very promising punchers but seldom a climber or rouleur. Very few opportunities to ride stage races. And generally speaking not enough international competitions. Having to race every weekend (while going to school) will also give less chances to train properly.

Many talented kids will never have an opportunity to prove themselves in these conditions, so they quit early. Luca Vergallito (winner of the Zwift Academy last year and having a more than decent debut season in 2023) is an example. He started training on his own after quitting cycling for some months and reached a much higher level than when training with his u23 team.
 
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Zoetemelk-fan

Zoetemelk-fan

Oct 5, 2009
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Mayomaniac

Mayomaniac

Apr 10, 2019
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SafeBet said:
There's no easy answer. Mayo gave you some insights on how some teams operate.

I'll add that the Italian youth / u23 system has been broken for a long time, most of the teams and coaches haven't updated their training approaches for years. Riders struggle to adapt when they turn pro (abroad).

The Italian calendar for youth categories has major flaws too. Riders have to race almost every weekend, most of the time one day races with very similar parcours (short, sometimes technical circuit with hills) which is the reason why you'll see a gazillion very promising punchers but seldom a climber or rouleur. Very few opportunities to ride stage races. And generally speaking not enough international competitions. Having to race every weekend (while going to school) will also give less chances to train properly.

Many talented kids will never have an opportunity to prove themselves in these conditions, so they quit early. Luca Vergallito (winner of the Zwift Academy last year and having a more than decent debut season in 2023) is an example. He started training on his own after quitting cycling for some months and reached a much higher level than when training with his u23 team.
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Yeah, the lack of stage races in the youth ranks is a problem. Racing every week and being expected to score results every week also makes it really hard to do proper training blocks with progressive overload for some time to later peak for an event.

There's a lot of shorter uphill tts in the junior ranks, but the usually feature a 4-5% tempogrinder or a short, punchy climb (it won't get harder than San Luca).

Still interesting how despite everything Italy only seems to produce good rouleurs atm, I guess the track system has it's benefits. That's also one of the few saving graces of team Colpack, they had Ivan Quaranta as a specific track coach and guys like Consonni and Ganna were able to combine it with road racing really well in the u23 ranks.
 
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J

janraaskalt

Jan 3, 2010
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Zoetemelk-fan said:
Poor Jorgenson :(
He had all his future in his hands in the right bowl - where he could grow his own ambitions.
Before this QS horror year I was thinking he could develop further on own ambitions at LeFevre, but was quite happy he didn't took such turn.
But this turn is even worse for him.
I guess frecking $$$ still rules :(
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Jorgenson used all the $$$ he got from Movistar to go on private training camps and hire extra staff to improve, which worked out wonderfully. He chose the team "where everybody gets better". It might not be the $$$.
 
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T

theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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Zoetemelk-fan said:
Poor Jorgenson :(
He had all his future in his hands in the right bowl - where he could grow his own ambitions.
Before this QS horror year I was thinking he could develop further on own ambitions at LeFevre, but was quite happy he didn't took such turn.
But this turn is even worse for him.
I guess frecking $$$ still rules :(
Click to expand...
Given the choice, where would you rather ride, as a rider of Jorgenson's profile: Movistar or Jumbo? And keep in mind that at Movistar, Jorgenson had to arrange and pay for his own private altitude camps.

I doubt he'll earn much more at Jumbo than he did at Movistar. Jumbo are not a UAE who can simply outbid any other team. Like they did for George Bennett for example, that's a guy who really went for the money.
 
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Zoetemelk-fan

Zoetemelk-fan

Oct 5, 2009
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janraaskalt said:
Jorgenson used all the $$$ he got from Movistar to go on private training camps and hire extra staff to improve, which worked out wonderfully. He chose the team "where everybody gets better". It might not be the $$$.
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theyoungest said:
Given the choice, where would you rather ride, as a rider of Jorgenson's profile: Movistar or Jumbo? And keep in mind that at Movistar, Jorgenson had to arrange and pay for his own private altitude camps.

I doubt he'll earn much more at Jumbo than he did at Movistar. Jumbo are not a UAE who can simply outbid any other team. Like they did for George Bennett for example, that's a guy who really went for the money.
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I like your positive attitudes.

Let's hope Matteo gets tons of chances for personal goals at TJV.
 
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RedheadDane

RedheadDane

May 5, 2010
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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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tobydawq said:
I don't really get the pessimism here... Four different riders from TJV won a cobbled classic this year!
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They just need to find a way to make it work in the Monuments. There they haven't really profited from their collective strength. Although if Pogi decides to forego the cobbles that will increase their chances massively. Then it's 8 Jumbo riders against Van der Poel.

And yes, then also Matteo Jorgenson has the chance to win De Ronde.
 
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Samu Cuenca

Samu Cuenca

Sep 26, 2020
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