The Mike Anderson story

[the big ring]

Actually, TexPat's response doesn't do anything of the sort. .

Actually it does. If you really are a lawyer I can understand your inability to empathise with someone describing discussions about concepts for a new enterprise.

Regardless, your attempt to interpret the response in favour of Armstrong is telling.

TexPat's response merely states that he and Armstrong discussed a shop "conceptually"

You may be attempting to misdirect or obfuscate. Or you may be filtering words through an Armstrong fanboi filter. Or you may be plain having reading comprehension problems.

But Mike did NOT say they "discussed a shop conceptually".

Armstrong illicited the "concepts" Mike had.

Yes, MJ's is very much like what he and I discussed on many occassions. He asked me what I had in mind conceptually, and that was it.

This is the same as saying, "he asked me what my ideas were".

Which is very different (imo) to what you have written. And if my TV watching days tell me anything, lawyers love to twist words.

Having been in this position myself - young, full of ideas and energy - and taken advantage of, I can empathise with what Mike is saying.

 

[LauraLyn]

your posting, I could care less about your behavior as you should not be so confused to judge mine, belongs to the sock puppet thread as was brought up by others.

As kindly as possible I ask you not get too worried about me.

Care about your frantic inputs becoming exposed as trolling.

No worries about you, dear. You seem well capable of taking care of yourself.

The concern is with the others you have insulted, for whatever reasons you may have.

The greater concern is with the tenor of the discussion here. We all are disappointed with Lance Armstrong & Co. We should avoid behaving as he has toward others.

Python, you make excellent contributions. Please allow others to do so as well.

 

[Race Radio]

Good to see RR vindicated. Look forward to the intern apologies...

I expect that there will multiple long winded, incomprehensible posts that will ignore the topic but succeed in making the forum unreadable

 

[the big ring]

I expect that there will multiple long winded, incomprehensible posts that will ignore the topic but succeed in making the forum unreadable

It's like you're friggin' Nostradamus or something. Got any tips for this weekend's lotto numbers?

 

[python]

Python, you make excellent contributions. Please allow others to do so as well.

as I warned mike, your sweetness comes across as fake.

Enough said, and if you try to bring more obfuscation, count on me being there. It will not be your choice when I choose to confront your bs .

 

[autologous]

Python, you make excellent contributions. Please allow others to do so as well.

Who are you to make such a demand? You flood the forum with substanceless flack. You aspire to some kind of righteous tone with the hint of some kind of authority, yet your only "credential" is that you allude to knowing Anna the blogger. BFD.

I lurk, yet read everything closely. And all that is visible the last few days is a barrage of empty volume from you that does nothing except dilute the discussion here.

Kudos to Python for calling you out.

 

[Benotti69]

Who are you to make such a demand? You flood the forum with substanceless flack. You aspire to some kind of righteous tone with the hint of some kind of authority, yet your only "credential" is that you allude to knowing Anna the blogger. BFD.

I lurk, yet read everything closely. And all that is visible the last few days is a barrage of empty volume from you that does nothing except dilute the discussion here.

Kudos to Python for calling you out.

the exact reason for LL, KL and QS to be here trolling only LA related threads. These are not interested in cycling. They are obfuscators and probably 2 are the same sockypuppety.

Chapeau Python.

 

[Digger]

Amazing how quickly people back down when the person they are criticising shows up.
Anna Zimmerman thing annoys me and she actually reflects badly on us men. I've read her stuff. It's ok, but in no way does it justify the reaction it gets. But sadly in my opinion, part of her following is down to her looks. There are outstanding blogs out there by both men and women which don't generate enough interest. They are very well researched and written by long time fans of the sport.

Cyclingfansanonymous was by far the best blog I came across on doping for example....shame that person only writes on twitter now.

Getting back to Mike. He's a good guy. I don't think anyone, even his critics on here, are in a position to pass such harsh judgement. Go up against the resources of lance, in his home state, and it doesn't matter what evidence you have on your side. And ultimately that has to be a very frustrating thing for Mike. The message of the article is common to almost every employee/team mate Lance has had. It doesn't end well. Lance has a way of reneging on promises and of screwing everyone to his own end. Tyler being forced to race 2001 Tour clean being another example. He even fell out with Livingstone. And to top it off, he had a 'thing' with Haven, Tyler's ex wife, just to show who was boss, and that he could get any woman he wanted.

I also agree with RR. Lance has nothing but disdain for the groupees and Livestrong idiots. In fairness how could he? How could he respect people who believe him no matter what the lie?
If it was just that Lance doped, I wouldn't have a massive issue with him. But he destroyed lives and actually got a kick from this. And that's the part i honestly hope he suffers for. I hope he loses the millions and lives a life of disgrace. And everyday that goes by, he's getting closer to this.

However, the Mike Andersons, Floyd Landis' and Tyler Hamiltons have all paid their dues and are coming out the other side. They deserve every bit of fortune they get.

 

[Benotti69]

Amazing how quickly people back down when the person they are criticising shows up.
Anna Zimmerman thing annoys me and she actually reflects badly on us men. I've read her stuff. It's ok, but in no way does it justify the reaction it gets. But sadly in my opinion, part of her following is down to her looks. There are outstanding blogs out there by both men and women which don't generate enough interest. They are very well researched and written by long time fans of the sport.

Cyclingfansanonymous was by far the best blog I came across on doping for example....shame that person only writes on twitter now.

+1

Zimmerman's fame i think is due to Armstrong hitting on her and failing. Seems to be failing a lot doesn't he.

Getting back to Mike. He's a good guy. I don't think anyone, even his critics on here, are in a position to pass such harsh judgement. Go up against the resources of lance, in his home state, and it doesn't matter what evidence you have on your side. And ultimately that has to be a very frustrating thing for Mike. The message of the article is common to almost every employee/team mate Lance has had. It doesn't end well. Lance has a way of reneging on promises and of screwing everyone to his own end. Tyler being forced to race 2001 Tour clean being another example. He even fell out with Livingstone. And to top it off, he had a 'thing' with Haven, Tyler's ex wife, just to show who was boss, and that he could get any woman he wanted.

I also agree with RR. Lance has nothing but disdain for the groupees and Livestrong idiots. In fairness how could he? How could he respect people who believe him no matter what the lie?
If it was just that Lance doped, I wouldn't have a massive issue with him. But he destroyed lives and actually got a kick from this. And that's the part i honestly hope he suffers for. I hope he loses the millions and lives a life of disgrace. And everyday that goes by, he's getting closer to this.

However, the Mike Andersons, Floyd Landis' and Tyler Hamiltons have all paid their dues and are coming out the other side. They deserve every bit of fortune they get.

Dont forget the Andreu's.

 

[Anonymous]

I expect that there will multiple long winded, incomprehensible posts that will ignore the topic but succeed in making the forum unreadable

This.

Why anybody believes or responds to Quickstepper or Laura is puzzling... but we have seen it before. I guess we will see it again.

 

[LauraLyn]

Who are you to make such a demand? You flood the forum with substanceless flack. You aspire to some kind of righteous tone with the hint of some kind of authority, yet your only "credential" is that you allude to knowing Anna the blogger. BFD.

I lurk, yet read everything closely. And all that is visible the last few days is a barrage of empty volume from you that does nothing except dilute the discussion here.

Kudos to Python for calling you out.

Blogging is an important part of the current discussions in our societies, including that on Lance Armstrong.

Replacing one false god with another is not a solution. Replacing one amerti with another will not solve the problem. Insisting on group think similar to insisting that the only way you can ride is to dope.

If something someone says is indeed "obfuscating", then indeed call it out. If someone says something at is false or misleading, call it out.

But do not hurl meaningless personal insults at contributors because their position is different than that of your own or of some group think.

Bullying, individually or in a group, does not improve the discussion.

Perhaps we should get back on topic: How do we really clean up cycling from doping and cheating?

 

[Anonymous]

No worries about you, dear. You seem well capable of taking care of yourself.

The concern is with the others you have insulted, for whatever reasons you may have.

The greater concern is with the tenor of the discussion here. We all are disappointed with Lance Armstrong & Co. We should avoid behaving as he has toward others.

Python, you make excellent contributions. Please allow others to do so as well.

I'm curious. What does Armstrong owe you an apology for? He still owe you money for your word count?

 

[QuickStepper]

. . . Bullying, individually or in a group, does not improve the discussion.. .

You assume that those who are criticizing you are really here to "improve the discussion" rather than just to listen to themselves give us all the same opinions, over and over and over. This is the echo chamber, and if they were really interested in hearing another point of view, or really asking questions, and not afraid of the answers, they wouldn't feel the need to respond in the manner they do.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Amazing how quickly people back down when the person they are criticising shows up.
Anna Zimmerman thing annoys me and she actually reflects badly on us men. I've read her stuff. It's ok, but in no way does it justify the reaction it gets. But sadly in my opinion, part of her following is down to her looks. There are outstanding blogs out there by both men and women which don't generate enough interest. They are very well researched and written by long time fans of the sport.

Cyclingfansanonymous was by far the best blog I came across on doping for example....shame that person only writes on twitter now.

Getting back to Mike. He's a good guy. I don't think anyone, even his critics on here, are in a position to pass such harsh judgement. Go up against the resources of lance, in his home state, and it doesn't matter what evidence you have on your side. And ultimately that has to be a very frustrating thing for Mike. The message of the article is common to almost every employee/team mate Lance has had. It doesn't end well. Lance has a way of reneging on promises and of screwing everyone to his own end. Tyler being forced to race 2001 Tour clean being another example. He even fell out with Livingstone. And to top it off, he had a 'thing' with Haven, Tyler's ex wife, just to show who was boss, and that he could get any woman he wanted.

I also agree with RR. Lance has nothing but disdain for the groupees and Livestrong idiots. In fairness how could he? How could he respect people who believe him no matter what the lie?
If it was just that Lance doped, I wouldn't have a massive issue with him. But he destroyed lives and actually got a kick from this. And that's the part i honestly hope he suffers for. I hope he loses the millions and lives a life of disgrace. And everyday that goes by, he's getting closer to this.

However, the Mike Andersons, Floyd Landis' and Tyler Hamiltons have all paid their dues and are coming out the other side. They deserve every bit of fortune they get.

Nicely said digger.
I agree with your Anna assessment too. As I've said before, she may act out disgust with her 'stalking' from lance but it serves her well for PR and visibility. The blog's 'cuteness' jargon is wearing thin.

The rest of your post +1

 

[Elagabalus]

I don't want to derail this thread and get us both band for being arrogant
but briefly

... Let's start general and see how far you want to play along. Maybe we'll start with a spectacular western economy that values individual rights only as a necessary fiction and/or in specific cases where individuals are productive within that economy....

I think this is overly general to the point of being irrelevant. In any case you did not address how Mike may be able to "challenge" this idea/ideal?

... Are you telling me there were no other jobs at that pay scale in the greater Austin area? ...

I'm sorry but I'm still unsure of your definition of "contesting the world in which their(his) story occurred". Does "contesting" simply mean to get another job? To me it seems to imply something much more grandiose.

 

[Elagabalus]

...
No. I don't believe that Webster (or anyone here) intended to insult you. I genuinely do not believe that. I disagreed as well with Webster on some of his responses, but I think he made good contributions, including regarding your excellent discussion in Outside.
...

I'm sorry, Laura, but Webster was definitely out of line with some of his content which included a couple of ***** slaps that did not need to be there had he not intended them to be there.

 

[webster]

Amazing how quickly people back down when the person they are criticising shows up.

I wish Mike well, not that he needs it. I stand by everything I wrote, but I am stepping aside because I have nothing new to add. I just think that of all of Lance's transgressions, Mike's interaction with him does not really seem that scandalous. I don't think Lance owes him anything for discussions of a bike shop, and I don't think their relationship sounds much different from any celebrtiy/assistant relationship.

This is not coming from a "fanboy" perspective at all, just the two cents of another person on the internet.

 

[hrotha]

"Zimmerman" is full of it. She is a groupie at best. She has been around for a year or two - maybe. Anyone who uses her as a source for anything is laughable.

I read some of her stuff, and it was good. Not ground-breaking or anything, but good. I think the current anti-Zimmerman hipster backlash is kind of funny, and every bit as motivated by her looks as whatever fanboydom she gets.

 

[Elagabalus]

I wish Mike well, not that he needs it. I stand by everything I wrote, but I am stepping aside because I have nothing new to add. I just think that of all of Lance's transgressions, Mike's interaction with him does not really seem that scandalous. I don't think Lance owes him anything for discussions of a bike shop, and I don't think their relationship sounds much different from any celebrtiy/assistant relationship.

This is not coming from a "fanboy" perspective at all, just the two cents of another person on the internet.

You do realize Mike has a bike shop in NZ don't you? And I believe he stated in one post or another (you'll have to go back over them yourself) that it was in part paid for by LA (but I could be wrong). As Mike said above he found the email. So no worries, then ...

 

[ScienceIsCool]

I'll get back to this later. It's Sunday morning in NZ, and I'm taking the kids to the open day at the local BMX club.

Like, like, like! Well done. Enjoy your Sunday with the family and thank you for being honest and true. Lance did not win. He did not beat you down. You have everything that he does not. Congratulations, good sir.

John Swanson

 

[aphronesis]

I don't want to derail this thread and get us both band for being arrogant
but briefly



I think this is overly general to the point of being irrelevant. In any case you did not address how Mike may be able to "challenge" this idea/ideal?



I'm sorry but I'm still unsure of your definition of "contesting the world in which their(his) story occurred". Does "contesting" simply mean to get another job? To me it seems to imply something much more grandiose.

I told you I'd start general: that said, I think the aspects of individual rights and service economies are moderately precise.
And you are misreading me, I didn't say what he could or should have done, but posed the question where to from here.

Grandiose is not at all how i would characterize the proposed condition. Call it minor-anti- heroic even.

 

[QuickStepper]

You do realize Mike has a bike shop in NZ don't you? And I believe he stated in one post or another (you'll have to go back over them yourself) that it was in part paid for by LA (but I could be wrong). As Mike said above he found the email. So no worries, then ...

Maybe I missed that post where he said he actually found the e-mail from Armstrong. The counter-complaint he filed actually said exactly the opposite, that he couldn't locate it.

Can you tell me in which of the posts "above" where Mike said he found the e-mail that Armstrong sent him in which Armstrong made the promise to fund the purchase of a bike shop by Mike Anderson?

These are all the posts "above" by Mike. I honestly do not see a statement that he"found the e-mail.":

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008108#post1008108
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008072#post1008072
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008047#post1008047
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008042#post1008042
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008035#post1008035

I think if you read the counterclaim allegations and in particular, the exchange between Anderson's lawyers and Amrstrong's about settlement prior to the filing of the lawsuit, Mike's position was that he could testify to what he remembered the e-mail saying,but he could not produce a copy of it because it had been deleted from his computer. I think he also says in the Outside article that he eventually decided not to spend the time or money trying to do a forensics reconstruction of the deleted materials on the drive of his computer, and at least part of the article mentions that he regrets he didn't save a copy and that he was so naive about Armstrong's later conduct, never suspecting that Armstrong would lie about this aspect of their discussions. .

But as you say, I could be wrong too, and if you have better info or links to something else, please provide it.

 

[the big ring]

Maybe I missed that post where he said he actually found the e-mail from Armstrong. The counter-complaint he filed actually said exactly the opposite, that he couldn't locate it.

Can you tell me in which of the posts "above" where Mike said he found the e-mail that Armstrong sent him in which Armstrong made the promise to fund the purchase of a bike shop by Mike Anderson?

These are all the posts "above" by Mike. I honestly do not see a statement that he"found the e-mail.":

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008108#post1008108
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008072#post1008072
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008047#post1008047
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008042#post1008042
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1008035#post1008035

Looks like I was spot on. Trouble with reading comprehension.

The first is addressed by the above. However, I'll add that his attorneys challenged us to spend the money to find the email using forensic computer analysis, which we did successfully. Somewhere out there is a copy.

 

[Anonymous]

Looks like I was spot on. Trouble with reading comprehension.

I'm thinking it's willful.

 

[Velodude]

You do realize Mike has a bike shop in NZ don't you? And I believe he stated in one post or another (you'll have to go back over them yourself) that it was in part paid for by LA (but I could be wrong). As Mike said above he found the email. So no worries, then ...

The Anderson/Armstrong dispute was settled on confidential terms.

It is a long bow to presume that if a settlement was favorable to MA then part of that unknown and confidential settlement was a compensatory payment relating to the promised bike shop.

Once the vultures (lawyers) got in for their chop there is usually crumbs remaining any way.

On the other issue of QS probing MA about bike shop drawings being filed is support of MA's case.

QS, appearing to be loyal to the LA cause, wants a eureka moment in calling out RR over the accuracy, integrity and reliability of his intelligence gathering so as to report back to Head Office in Austin, Tx.