The official debate: Should Contador have waited for Schleck?

[Mellow Velo]

Perhaps the only positive in today's stage is that the Lance fans really have their panties in a knot.

Wow! You got that almost right. Even Speeway has crawled out from under his rock. He's had to wait almost 3 weeks.

No, there is another positive.
Tomorrow's stage is going to be a b*tch to control. Forget the final 60kms: straight up the Peyresourde and bang!
Saxo get to plan what the want to do, instead of being stuck on the front.
Probably, the same for Thursday. The whole race dynamic may have changed and it isn't all in Contador's favour.
I wonder what wacky tactics we have in store, next?

IMO Schleck looked the stronger, if he isn't wasted, then maybe Speedway will get another reason to find his way out into the light?

 

[christianpetrin]

Just read Riis interpretation to the occurred. It's quite weird what he said, specially he being the one losing as much as AS with AC lack of class.

My guesses: he's saying that because he knows he's losing AS (AS is most certainly joining this new team they are forming) and IT IS KNOWN HE IS TRYING TO SIGN AC to replace the loss of AS. Of course, he doesn´t want to make any comment against AC because if he does, forget signing AC for next year.

I'd say he's being a businessman already thinking by next year, but it also shows he doesn't care much about fairness and class (which is not necessarily unexpected from a former doper).

 

[MKirilenko]

You left out the dotted lines from his eyes to Andy's drivetrain. But yes, this is an excellent shot showing that Alberto had plenty of time and the right angle to see Andy looking down at his dangling chain.

Of course, because Contador's main interest lies in Andy's bike. Ur starting to cross the lines of absurdity here.

 

[pistolero]

This is racing,andy attacks when ac was boxed,vino neutralize his attack and when ac jumps off he cant see whats happening behind him.samu and menchov probably will but they go full gas too.theres too many people waiting for a bad day for ac but sh**t happens.remember that day in spa?as was loosing more than 4 minutes and the race stops for him,we talk about 30 seconds or 4 minutes?and finally,the yellow jersey its not suposed to wait and wait for the attack of the others,now he had to do his best in tourmalet.

 

[hrotha]

It's like no one has ever seen an attacker shut down an attack after he's being closed down. They do it all the time. Watching freeze frames of shots is not how the riders saw it or how it played out. It was in the heat of a very tense moment and AC was in full flight to catch Andy. I don't know if he knew WHY Andy had stopped his attack, but I can't imagine anyone really expects that he should have slowed down to figure it out.

Now one can ask the question of why he continued to race AFTER he found out, but at the moment he was flying up the road, is probably the wrong time to expect him (or any other rider) to ask that question.

Btw, does anyone know what was the gap between the group at the top of the climb? I have it in my mind that it was less than 15 seconds (13 actually), but I think my ears may misinterpreted 30 as 13.

I think it was more than 13, but it definitely was less than 30. I remember thinking the gap was pretty stable at 25 seconds during the descent. My guess would be 20-25 seconds at the top.

 

[Publicus]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

 

[Biological Entity]

I don't think so.

Only if the margin of overall victory is less than AC's gain today - and I really don't think that will happen.

But it has the potental to be a long rivalry.

No because this completely changes the race now. If AS was able to get a small time gain today, he would only need another small couple of time gain from the other stages to get his gap. It still could have been close in the TT but that was going to be the strategy.

But now AS has to totally change the plan. He has to go for some ridiculously big and unlikely attack that will be high risk and could well blow up in his face, losing even more time.

Plus Contador has the big psychological advantage now. He knows that Schleck knows that all he needs to do is do one small attack to finish him off - if he's not finished off already - and make it impossible for him. We saw what happened to Armstrong when that burden was imposed on him.

 

[Von Mises]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

I knew. Eurosport commentators knew.

 

[Arnout]

Thats why I wrote: " Even if Saxo and Schleck did wrong on stage 3, it does not justify Contador´s action."
Some AC fans are trying to defend todays situation with an argument that "others are bad too", but even if true that there have been other clasless tactics, it does not justify what happened today. In fact, with this justification they are admitting that Contador´s action was wrong.

No. What we're saying is that this is what racing is all about. There is no right and wrong about continuing or stopping.

 

[warmfuzzies]

I really feel bad for Alberto. Last year he had to ride the whole Tour with the whole LA/JB crap on his dinner table every single day. The guy makes a mistake (ok I don't think he should have waited after nobody waited for him...but lets call it a mistake for argument's sake) and now we have thousands or LA fanboys, french cynics and haters writing thousands of garbage articles. These are basically the same guys that were criticizing him last year for not sticking to JB's "plan"

I know the guy is easy to hate for American audiences (i.e. humble, down to earth, soft spoken, Spanish) but come on...

I can't wait to see AC crushing AS during the TT

Albertoe = classless rider who flouted a sporting tradition in cycling's biggest race in order to put himself in yellow. I'm forecasting a sharp inflection point in pisTOOLero gear sales. Bang, bang!

 

[MKirilenko]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

Obvious answer, no1. Everyone is now an expert after watching the footage 10 times.

 

[roundabout]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

Seriously? It was obvious that he threw the chain and i don't own the biggest TV set in the universe.

 

[Ninety5rpm]

No. What we're saying is that this is what racing is all about. There is no right and wrong about continuing or stopping.

Exactly. This is what I just posted in the thread that is a poll about this topic.

 

[MKirilenko]

Albertoe = classless rider who flouted a sporting tradition in cycling's biggest race in order to put himself in yellow. I'm forecasting a sharp inflection point in pisTOOLero gear sales. Bang, bang!

Wow, what a leak of frustration! Cry us a river maybe?

 

[Biological Entity]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

David Harmon of Eurosport was straight on it, saying he's had a problem even before AC had past him. You don't launch a big attack and then just stop peddling and look down for ages.

 

[Anonymous]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

When his back wheel hopped I thought he snapped his chain. He is using SRAM afterall.

I think AC knew.

 

[The Crusher]

Btw, does anyone know what was the gap between the group at the top of the climb? I have it in my mind that it was less than 15 seconds (13 actually), but I think my ears may misinterpreted 30 as 13.

P&P had the gap around 15 seconds and shrinking as they were going uphill. It wasn't until the downhill that the gap started growing again.

Yes maybe the big racing news is Andy was out-gunned on the descent. But that's not nearly so much fun as to gossip about did Alberto really know or not? Would Andy have been caught or not? Was the mechanical his fault or not?

 

[saganftw]

Wow, what a leak of frustration! Cry us a river maybe?

you are obvious contador fanboy everything you say is irrelevant

 

[Mellow Velo]

Educate yourself on Tour de France tradition. It is an integral part of what makes the race great. Until today, not attacking the yellow jersey during a mechanical was a fairly well respected tradition in the peloton.

Stuck in the Tour's second grade, again?

Hands up who can tell us what happened to Thor Hushovd's yellow jersey in 2004?

Yup, that's right, Armstrong put the Hincapie hammer into a crashed Iban Mayo and the poor Maillot Jeune, through now fault of his own, was stuck behind in traffic.

The trouble with 3 W Fboys, is the that history keeps proving their rhetoric false, time after time.

 

[hrotha]

I knew. Eurosport commentators knew.

Yeah, it was pretty obvious on TV. It might have been different right there, on a bike, but I doubt it.

 

[Ninety5rpm]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

I didn't know for sure that he threw a chain, but it was immediately obvious that something was wrong with his bike; not with him.

I mean, one second he's attacking and pulling away, the next second he's slowed WAY down and staring down at his drive train in that telltale manner. Totally obvious.

 

[scribe]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

Immediately. If Phil and Paul can figure it out right away, anyone can.

 

[hfer07]

I only have a single question:

what if instead of a chain falling off, Andy had a puncture?

 

[Publicus]

That seals the deal. We have a single frame from a photographer shooting at high speed (surely over 1000 ASO probably closer to 3200 ASO) that proves that AC wasn't closing the gap, but waited until he saw Andy slow, determine that it was because of mechanical and decided to attack Andy to gain advantage because he was afraid and weaker and saw it as his only time to win the Tour de France against the superior climber and time trialist, despite the heap of scorn that awaited him as a result of his dishonorable and indefensible actions.

All of that, in a single frame.

 

[Piratical]

No. What we're saying is that this is what racing is all about. There is no right and wrong about continuing or stopping.

Mildly disagree. There is no absolute right or wrong that must be accepted by everyone, but each person is free to judge right or wrong as against their own personal codes of sportsmanship. As I said earlier, Contador could have avoided any questions about his sportsmanship by waiting -- he did not do so. He may win the event as a result, so it's fair to suggest that winning is more important to him than winning with grace and style. In today's result-oriented approach to sports - hard to argue with his decision.