The official debate: Should Contador have waited for Schleck?

[131313]

At last Albertoe has carved his name in Tour history in a way Lance Armstrong did not. With his classlessness. Bang, bang!

I agree, he's come nowhere close to matching this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T66LLvqgZS4

If I post it enough times, maybe the chamois sniffers will actually look at it.

 

[ManInFull]

I think a lot more people than Armstrong fans wanted to see an exciting and fairly won last week of the tour. Cycling fans in general really wanted this.

Not one AC fanboy has said they would have liked to see him win in a totally fair and undisputed way, which I think is quite telling.

Looks like they're not on strong moral ground anymore to attack other riders who have been accused of wrong doing. They just want a win by any means necessary.

Let's have this discussion if AC WINS the tour by 8 seconds. Otherwise, it is pointless.

 

[kurtinsc]

Officially at the top of the climb, the time gap between ASchleck & AC-SS-DM was 10 seconds....... and Andy lost today in total 39 seconds to AC...

Yes. But there is a difference between descending on your own vs trying to hold a great descender's wheel.

While the time went away on the descent... it simply wouldn't have happened if he hadn't had the chain fall off. Does anyone really think Contador could have attacked Schleck on the descent and gained 29 seconds?

That time gain came from the gap created on the climb. Period. Contador riding on the front likely caused Andy to be unable to catch up.


I'm not saying that was wrong of Contador... I'm just saying that let's not try to rewrite what happened.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I'm sure Schleck would be dismayed to see the sheer number of Lance chamois-sniffers coming to his defense by displaying their stunning lack of any cycling knowledge.

Invariably, Lance's fans demonstrate themselves to be the lowest common denominator of the cycling world.

 

[Mellow Velo]

I'm sure Schleck would be dismayed to see the sheer number of Lance chamois-sniffers coming to his defense by displaying their stunning lack of any cycling knowledge.

Invariably, Lance's fans demonstrate themselves to be the lowest common denominator of the cycling world.

It is like someone has opened termite nest, here. They are flooding out of the woodwork; new posters by the score.
I'll bet half of them haven't even seen the race.

Time to beat a hasty retreat for the stage 16 thread.
Can't stand the creatures.

 

[Barrus]

For anyone saying his TdF win will be tainted, does anyone think he'll only win by 0:37? Really is there anyone who'll even try to argue this? He already was winning with the way the GC looked before today's stage, he'll probably wouldn't have lost anytime and gained more than a minute in the final TT

 

[palmerq]

Another great tweet, now by Greg Henderson:

I think this is not a bad point.... I said bad work from contador but i suppose he had allready started his attack there and there wasnt much of the climb left... the sprinters wouldn't go easy on each other.....I now think it was a awkward situation for contador and the rest...how long would they have had to wait :S....

 

[Piratical]

Now if it had happened 20kms earlier, everyone would have waited. No doubt about that. But stopping the race after the first attack by someone of the top 10 has been made.... Has that ever happened? Ullrich and Armstrong waiting for each other didn't happen in the middle of the fight.

Really? 2003: "On the finishing climb of Luz Ardiden Armstrong attacked with Iban Mayo close behind. Rounding a corner a young spectator held out a musette bag that hooked Armstrong's handle bars sending both he and Mayo to the pavement. Ullrich swerved and avoided the crash. But rather than attack the fallen leader Ullrich observed the Tour tradition of not attacking a fallen Maillot Jaune. An inspired Armstrong regained the lead group and attacked again. He powered to a 40 second stage win. Trailing by 1'07” Ullrich vowed “the Tour is not over…”

http://www.cyclingrevealed.com/Apr06/top25-6.htm

Ullrich: ""Of course, I would wait If I would have won this race by taking advantage of someone's bad luck, then the race was not worth winning."

2001 Jan Ulrich, who is not a good decender, in his haste to catchup with Armstrong pulled out all the stops. Ulrich got careless and misread the road. The German overshot a curve and went into a ravine. Armstrong saw it happen and as a gentleman, Lance slowed down to see if Ulrich was OK. Later in a news conference, The American said, “he did not think it right to take advantage of someone when they had bad luck.”

The only thing hurt on Ulrich was his pride. After tumbling head over the handlebars in to grass and dirt, Ulrich climbed back out of the ditch and rode after the leaders. Armstrong wait until Ulrich had caught up, asked “if he was alright,” then took off again gaining another minute on the third place at that time Ulrich.

http://www.letsride.net/0901.htm

For all that has been said about Armstrong, who is not my favorite cyclist, and Ullrich, who had his own moral downfall -- I really enjoyed watching those two race against each other. Nothing but respect between those two men.

 

[kurtinsc]

I don't understand why AC should have to wait AS. ok, I agree AC should have shown class if he did, but there was a lot at stake. Nobody was waiting AC on stage 3 when he lost 1:30 or so to crash he didn't cause. AC did stopped for a while, but how could he know what happened to Andy and how long it will last to solve the problem, it could have lasted for ages, while Sanchez and Munchov are gaining advantage on both of them. Of course Andy would say he would wait for him... yeh. In Belgium he gained some advantage due to mechanical problems, I didn't read he apologized for that. That's part of the sport, it's in any other why cycling is different.

Again... no problem with what Contador did... but there was never an issue with Menchove and Sanchez riding away.

Because Contador was at the front. He summitted the climb ahead of both of them.

 

[nvpacchi]

I have a hard time beliving that all these advocates of the honoring the MJ would be singing the same song had the roles been reversed.

What if neither AS or AC was in yellow, and AS's chain dropped? What argument would people come up with then? Pure distaste for Contador I'm sure.

No one should attack AS b/c he is in the MJ is a real simple argument to make in Andy's defense, and IMHO carries no water in this specific situation.

 

[TahoeNL]

I'm sure Schleck would be dismayed to see the sheer number of Lance chamois-sniffers coming to his defense by displaying their stunning lack of any cycling knowledge.

Invariably, Lance's fans demonstrate themselves to be the lowest common denominator of the cycling world.

Give the LA hate a rest, and focus on AC's litlle repute... or start your own post on why you can't get-off the LA trip.

 

[roundabout]

For anyone saying his TdF win will be tainted, does anyone think he'll only win by 0:37? Really is there anyone who'll even try to argue this? He already was winning with the way the GC looked before today's stage, he'll probably wouldn't have lost anytime and gained more than a minute in the final TT

That's why Contador didn't contribute at any stage once Schleck had his mishap. Oh, wait...

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

In real time?

I said "ouch' when I saw the bike wheel lift and then I spotted Andys legs twirling and spotted his chain.
At first I thought Vino was AC - but then it went to the moto shot and it appeared AC shot by AS and he must have known that the chain was off.

I fully expected AC to look bach and realise that AS had not managed to get his chain on (without stopping) and I expected AC to cool his jets.

 

[US Patent Exploding Cyclist]

I don't think that AC HAD to wait. I expected him too as I thought that was his character.

This could make for a very exciting stage on Thursday. Who knows? We might see a shake up tomorrow.

 

[BYOP88]

Would people be p1ssed if Contador attacked and when Schleck went to follow his chain came off(If the answer is Yes, shouldn't these people be p1ssed with Schleck for carrying on when Chav was held up on stage 3)?

Also noone waited for Roche who had a flat a few km's before "chaingate".

 

[Hugh Januss]

Bottom line is racing luck has helped Contador gain back some of the time he lost to AS due to a mechanical and being caught behind a crash on stage 3.

 

[The Crusher]

So is anyone going to try to dispute this?

After Andy got back on his bike, he went up the hill FASTER than Alberto!

Doesn't that answer one question?

 

[sometriguy]

Ok, serious question: how many of you knew what was going on with Andy when he shut down the attack?

I knew he had slipped a gear pretty immediately.

Generally slipping a gear is a 2 second fix though, contador was gone (way gone), but the time I realized just how bad he had ****ed it up

FWIW, I don't think contador should have to wait because this was clearly andy's fault.

He shouldn't have dropped his chain, he should have fixed it quickly with a proper shift, he shouldn't have tried to get on his bike before he fixed it.... he made a complete disaster out of a simple mistake

 

[Hugh Januss]

So is anyone going to try to dispute this?

After Andy got back on his bike, he went up the hill FASTER than Alberto!

Doesn't that answer one question?

Just shows Contador was waiting?

 

[Barrus]

So is anyone going to try to dispute this?

After Andy got back on his bike, he went up the hill FASTER than Alberto!

Doesn't that answer one question?

well, this can be argued to ways, one Andy would have dropped Contador (unlikely, although some posters appear to think otherwise)
Two: AC did not go full throttle

 

[The Crusher]

Just shows Contador was waiting?

Ha! Nice job, I knew someone would do that.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

So is anyone going to try to dispute this?

After Andy got back on his bike, he went up the hill FASTER than Alberto!

Doesn't that answer one question?

Yes. It answers the question "Did Contador slow down to wait for Schleck?"

Ah, HJ beat me to it.

 

[roundabout]

Just shows Contador was waiting?

Are you calling Conatdor a liar? Tsk, tsk.

 

[Deagol]

Little known fact to nitwits who bag on Huffy bikes.

Hampsten won his Giro on a....Huffy.

This is so totally off the point and could be either confirmed or denied by someone else, but I have heard that those “Huffys” were actually Serottas that had Huffy decals on them.

Another point: a lot on this forum seem to link a dislike of AC with a love of LA. If you think AC broke a rule, then you love LA. That does seem to be true with at least one poster here (and we all know who that is) but not necessarily everyone. I started out liking LA back in the day. His behavior last year (combined with a deeper investigation of his past) changed that, I actually started liking AC better because of the mature way in which he dealt with LA’s antics. The %^&*$ pistol solute not withstanding, he started the season out with a lot of class. Today, he took a few steps backward IMO. I am rooting for Schleck, and yes, LA still sucks…. .

 

[IndyJoe]

All you AC fanboys are missing the point: It wasn't that he should slow and wait for Andy, it was that HE ATTACKED WHEN HE KNEW ANDY HAD A PROBLEM. HE WENT FULL GAS!

That's the problem. Had he slowed as HE SAW HIS TEAMMATE DO, and rode tempo waiting on the other chasers to grab their wheel if they went on the attack than that's completely different.