Teams & Riders The Red Bull - Bora - Hansgrohe team thread

[Axel Hangleck]

I've said before, but eventually RB will make the important decisions, not Denk.......He doesn't seem a great man manager.

 

[Faserr]

Agreed. But there's also another huge factor: Lidl wants the team to sign notable German riders. There aren't that many anymore that can deliver and Kämna (if healthy) is at the top of the list. Would be also no surprise if the take Schachmann into the roster. So Lidl is very motivated to sign Kämna and probably was in contact with him for monts also before the crash. So possibly the transfer would have been done either way.

Yes, Lidl wants some german riders. I also thought about Schachmann. Teutenberg and Behrens could go up in the next 1-2 years. On the other hand it really crowded hat Lidl-Trek at the moment. Not much space for new riders.

 

[Statze2]

The next rider is leaving. Schachmann. Denk confirmed it an german daily tour podcast. The agent told them that Schachmann needs a change.

 

[MLKarlos]

Maximilian Schachmann vertrekt bij Red Bull-BORA-hansgrohe

Maximilian Schachmann is bezig aan zijn laatste maanden in dienst van Red Bull-BORA-hansgrohe. Dat heeft teammanager Ralph Denk bevestigd. De 29-jarige Schachmann komt al sinds 2019 uit voor de Duitse formatie. “Max is aan verandering toe”, geeft Denk aan. De Duitse coureur reed in de eerste...

www.wielerflits.nl

Schachmann and Gamper to Jayco.
As expected, Max leaves the team.

All in all I think the incoming riders are way stronger then the ones who leave. Only Lenny hurts I think.

In my estimation the departure of Emu, Max and Higuita should free something like 2 mil.
You have this money on top of the Red Bull financial boost.
Of course they already used it for Pithie, Lazkano etc. but I doubt that they are done

 

[MLKarlos]

What is your view on the Vuelta?

Should RB Bora Hansgrohe try to seek redemption for this years Tour and send a super team with Roglic, Vlasov, Martínez and Lipowitz? If the first two are not injured

 

[Hell-G]

What is your view on the Vuelta?

Should RB Bora Hansgrohe try to seek redemption for this years Tour and send a super team with Roglic, Vlasov, Martínez and Lipowitz? If the first two are not injured

Would Love it. ;-)

 

[Remy55]

If he stays healthy, Lipowitz will finish the Vuelta on the podium

 

[MLKarlos]

If he stays healthy, Lipowitz will finish the Vuelta on the podium

Depends who starts for Red Bull I guess. If Vlasov or Primoz is there he will be a donestique I guess

 

[yaco]

If he stays healthy, Lipowitz will finish the Vuelta on the podium

Are you serious. At this stage, Lipowitz has shown nothing to indicate he can podium a GT.

 

[Statze2]

Lührs will leave the Team (confirmed by Denk). Talks with Haller will take Place, but to me it sounded Not very likely that Haller will stay.

 

[MLKarlos]

Lührs will leave the Team (confirmed by Denk). Talks with Haller will take Place, but to me it sounded Not very likely that Haller will stay.

Not suprised by the Lührs news. Somehow he didn’t really progress I think.
Suprised by the Haller news. I figured he would be still useful in races not named TdF.

If Haller also leaves they have 9 open spots?

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

Are you serious. At this stage, Lipowitz has shown nothing to indicate he can podium a GT.

Agreed, all we know is he could've won Romandie if he wasn't so green behind the ears, and that he won the Sibiru Tour against Leknessund, which indicates he's on a good track for the Vuelta. But it will be very interesting to see how he can do for sure.

 

[Statze2]

Some more news from Benson were coming in, can´t read everything (its behind a paywall - maybe one of you read the whole articel?), but i´ll try to do a short update.

Lets start with the contract extensions which happend in the last weeks.

- Vlasov
- Hindley
- Denz
- Lipowitz

On the other side Benedetti announced his career ending. Buchmann will not renew his contract with Bora. Higuita is linked with 3 other world tour teams, Kämna is heavily linked with Lidl Trek (i´m sad about this), but Denk mentioned some days ago that the team wants to extend the contract with him. He also mentioned that a contract extension with Schachmann is complicated because he does not like to extent contracts with a smaller wage than the existing one. So if Schachmann can deliver some results in the coming races than maybe this will happen, but i think that Schachmann is also leaving.

These riders are still unknown
- Aleotti (was mentioned in the Benson news but i don´t know what it says about him)
- Jungels (some rumours about leaving, but also Denk mentioned that he is making a transition to road captain, that sounds like a possible contract extension for me)
- Sobrero (no rumours in any direction)
- Koch
- Palzer
- Lührs
- Zwiehoff (he was a guest in a german podcast and there it sounded like hes not leaving, but its more or less a guessing from my side)
- Meeus
- Gamper
- Haller (mentioned as free agent)

News about incoming riders:

- Pellizzari
- Tim van Dijcke
- Mick van Dijcke
- Finn Fisher-Black
- Jan Tratnik
- Oier Lazkano
- Laurance Pithie

According to PCS and the news. 14 Riders with a valid contract for next year + 7 new riders = 21 Riders
27 Riders already safe for next season according to benson. This means that some more riders have a valid contract or already signed a renewal.
So i think Aleotti, Jungels, Sobrero, Meeus, Zwiehoff, Koch already signed contract extensions.

The open contracts or talks with Gamper, Haller, Schachmann and Kämna are for the last 3 spots and maybe one new addition?
Palzer and Lührs are out or will join the Devo Team (just my opinion).

Any additions?

And again an update and summary of the last weeks.

We are at 21 Riders with a valid contract according to pcs and the transfer news.
Denk confirmed the departure of Schachmann and Lührs.

These riders are still unknown or heavily linked to different teams:

- Aleotti (was mentioned in the Benson news but i don´t know what it says about him)
- Jungels (heavily linked with ineos)
- Sobrero (no rumours in any direction)
- Koch (no rumours in any direction)
- Palzer (no rumours in any direction)
- Zwiehoff (no rumours in any direction)
- Meeus (wielerflits mentioned a contract extension)
- Haller (talks will take place in the next days)
- Gamper (linked to jayco)

So there will be a minimum of two more new additions which we haven´t heard about. And i think even more are possible because i can´t imagine that all the above mentioned riders (excepted Jungels, Gamper) renew the contract or Bora wants to renew the contracts.
Any suggestions? Did i missed any serious rumors?

Lets switch to the upcoming racing. Who will start the vuelta?
Martinez is very likely because he didn´t participated in any race after the giro and he performed very well at the giro.
Lipowitz will start according to Bora.
Roglic is very likely if he can recover til end of july, currently he is just able to ride indoors.
Meeus will ride the vuelta and he stayed at altitude with Maciejuk, so i think Maciejuk will be also at the vuelta.

So five spots have been taken. Who could jump on the vuelta train?
Vlasov? Can´t see someone recover from a broken ankle and be competitive at the vuelta.
Aleotti and Zwiehoff are on the longlist according to media interviews. If you look at the contract situations the following riders could be part of a vuelta line up: Adria, Koch, Mullen, Wandahl

My team would be:

Roglic, Martinez, Lipowitz, Zwiehoff, Adria, Meeus, Maciejuk, Koch

 

[OJRvE]

What about Hindley in the Vuelta? I thougth he was awful in the Tour because he came in undercooked so he could lead the Vuelta later.

 

[AmRacer]

What about Hindley in the Vuelta? I thougth I was awful in the Tour because he came in undercooked so he could lead the Vuelta later.

Maybe Rogla will give it a try.

 

[MLKarlos]

And again an update and summary of the last weeks.

We are at 21 Riders with a valid contract according to pcs and the transfer news.
Denk confirmed the departure of Schachmann and Lührs.

These riders are still unknown or heavily linked to different teams:

- Aleotti (was mentioned in the Benson news but i don´t know what it says about him)
- Jungels (heavily linked with ineos)
- Sobrero (no rumours in any direction)
- Koch (no rumours in any direction)
- Palzer (no rumours in any direction)
- Zwiehoff (no rumours in any direction)
- Meeus (wielerflits mentioned a contract extension)
- Haller (talks will take place in the next days)
- Gamper (linked to jayco)

So there will be a minimum of two more new additions which we haven´t heard about. And i think even more are possible because i can´t imagine that all the above mentioned riders (excepted Jungels, Gamper) renew the contract or Bora wants to renew the contracts.
Any suggestions? Did i missed any serious rumors?

Lets switch to the upcoming racing. Who will start the vuelta?
Martinez is very likely because he didn´t participated in any race after the giro and he performed very well at the giro.
Lipowitz will start according to Bora.
Roglic is very likely if he can recover til end of july, currently he is just able to ride indoors.
Meeus will ride the vuelta and he stayed at altitude with Maciejuk, so i think Maciejuk will be also at the vuelta.

So five spots have been taken. Who could jump on the vuelta train?
Vlasov? Can´t see someone recover from a broken ankle and be competitive at the vuelta.
Aleotti and Zwiehoff are on the longlist according to media interviews. If you look at the contract situations the following riders could be part of a vuelta line up: Adria, Koch, Mullen, Wandahl

My team would be:

Roglic, Martinez, Lipowitz, Zwiehoff, Adria, Meeus, Maciejuk, Koch

Great summary.
I wonder what’s going on with Welsford? He hasn’t raced in a long time. I thought that back then that he moves to the Vuelta after the Giro removal.

Ryan Mullen did a pretty decent job at the Giro, I wonder if he’s on the longlist as well.

 

[MLKarlos]

Maybe Rogla will give it a try.

4 Vuelta wins will put him in ahead of Contador etc.
That’s something!

 

[acm]

And again an update and summary of the last weeks.

We are at 21 Riders with a valid contract according to pcs and the transfer news.
Denk confirmed the departure of Schachmann and Lührs.

These riders are still unknown or heavily linked to different teams:

- Aleotti (was mentioned in the Benson news but i don´t know what it says about him)
- Jungels (heavily linked with ineos)
- Sobrero (no rumours in any direction)
- Koch (no rumours in any direction)
- Palzer (no rumours in any direction)
- Zwiehoff (no rumours in any direction)
- Meeus (wielerflits mentioned a contract extension)
- Haller (talks will take place in the next days)
- Gamper (linked to jayco)

So there will be a minimum of two more new additions which we haven´t heard about. And i think even more are possible because i can´t imagine that all the above mentioned riders (excepted Jungels, Gamper) renew the contract or Bora wants to renew the contracts.
Any suggestions? Did i missed any serious rumors?

Lets switch to the upcoming racing. Who will start the vuelta?
Martinez is very likely because he didn´t participated in any race after the giro and he performed very well at the giro.
Lipowitz will start according to Bora.
Roglic is very likely if he can recover til end of july, currently he is just able to ride indoors.
Meeus will ride the vuelta and he stayed at altitude with Maciejuk, so i think Maciejuk will be also at the vuelta.

So five spots have been taken. Who could jump on the vuelta train?
Vlasov? Can´t see someone recover from a broken ankle and be competitive at the vuelta.
Aleotti and Zwiehoff are on the longlist according to media interviews. If you look at the contract situations the following riders could be part of a vuelta line up: Adria, Koch, Mullen, Wandahl

My team would be:

Roglic, Martinez, Lipowitz, Zwiehoff, Adria, Meeus, Maciejuk, Koch

Aleotti is staying, according to Benson.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

What about Hindley in the Vuelta? I thougth he was awful in the Tour because he came in undercooked so he could lead the Vuelta later.

Had the same thought. If Roglic can get fit and Hindley in form, they could go with Rogla, Martinez, Hindley and Lipowitz, which would look pretty strong for the mountains.

 

[Remy55]

Had the same thought. If Roglic can get fit and Hindley in form, they could go with Rogla, Martinez, Hindley and Lipowitz, which would look pretty strong for the mountains.

After Tirreno, Hindley was three times sick before the Tour. I don't expect him at the Vuelta, he will get a break and then prepare for the Italian classics.
Vlasov should be ready for the Vuelta.

 

[yaco]

Great summary.
I wonder what’s going on with Welsford? He hasn’t raced in a long time. I thought that back then that he moves to the Vuelta after the Giro removal.

Ryan Mullen did a pretty decent job at the Giro, I wonder if he’s on the longlist as well.

Preparing to ride the 4K pursuit at the Olympic Games.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

RBH ...
RuBbisH
at the Tour, perhaps?

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Denk confirmed the departure of Schachmann and Lührs.

I do think this confirms the problem with riders who move straight from the juniors to the WT (which many people predicted around the time he turned pro already). Was obvious that Lührs wasn't ready for that level yet and it's hard to develop when you're constantly having to strain to keep up. Now, he will likely be cast aside from the sport altogether at an age where he could still have been a U23 next season.

It's hard to say that everyone should go through the U23s when the likes of Evenepoel and Tarling exist. However, in my view, there are still things you can do to lower the risk of cases like Lührs:

• WT teams should not be allowed to sign riders directly from the juniors if they don't have a U23 setup in which said rider can do part of his races (at least initially), or, if necessary, drop down to entirely
• Junior riders who are signed directly to the WT should be guaranteed a contract for the duration of their (nominal) U23 period (also means teams need to think harder about whether they want to have someone make that jump immediately)

 

[acm]

After Tirreno, Hindley was three times sick before the Tour. I don't expect him at the Vuelta, he will get a break and then prepare for the Italian classics.
Vlasov should be ready for the Vuelta.

Vlasov is still on crutches.

 

[Links2003]

Had the same thought. If Roglic can get fit and Hindley in form, they could go with Rogla, Martinez, Hindley and Lipowitz, which would look pretty strong for the mountains.

I think the team managers are facing a big problem: Some riders are certainly on the long list - injuries may now add riders who were not planned - but may be strong or have legitimate interest.
It's likely that Jordi was guaranteed the Vuelta. With a strong team for the overall ranking, you might want to change that. But you also have to think about the satisfaction of all the riders.
I think that the following drivers were originally considered or are now under discussion due to changes:

Adria (home tour and deserved a start after a strong year)
Aleotti (Good Giro, maybe the plan was to give him a bit more freedom and keep testing)
Hajek (Perhaps a little early, but a GT in the legs often helps young riders get ahead)
Higuita (Always a candidate when in good shape)
Hindley (Helper at the Tour, not ridden much - perhaps with his own ambitions?)
Lipowitz (Bad luck at the Giro, he has a secure starting position)
Martinez (Strong Giro, was Tour candidate - no Vuelta would surprise)
Maciejuk (I was at an altitude training camp. Surprised me, not such a good year, but you need a rider for the flat)
Meeus (Last year Tour (with stage win), good spring. No GT would be hard to explain to him)
Palzer (Red Bull athlet...)
Roglic (In the last years always a 2nd good GT (think without a crash at the TDF he would not have been provided to give his teammates a chance)
Vlasov (if he is fit certainly an option, originally maybe even as GT captain)
Wandahl (Apparently they're also planning to use him in 2025 - so they'll have to give him a GT for once)
Zwiehoff (Not a good year, but valuable for GTs in recent years=

I think the team will consist of:
Martinez, Roglic, Adria, Lipowitz, Meeus, Hindley or Vlasov, Maciejuk, Zwiehoff