Teams & Riders The Red Bull - Bora - Hansgrohe team thread

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It was bound to happen. Cycling works in mysterious ways, i.e. in this instance meant Red Bull's bright plan to take a sprinter had to backfire.

The irony of the backup crew who're there to win something when Rogla's crashes out... actually hitting the deck themselves... is what makes cycling such a weird sport.

The irony is that in the last two or three editions, Bora was bringing a sprinter and changed their mind at the last minute, while, this time they were not bringing a sprinter and made a last minute change of plans.
 
I mean if they took a sprinter it's a shitty outcome, for the crash to occur. So hopefully the sprinters side of the team is still salvageable. Somehow it does seem that sprinter section is not at sync at all, two riders sprinting for themself. So all in all i guess not much thought was put into this. For me personally it's obvious that any decent shot they have is regarding GC anyway. Winning the Tour can still save their season as a whole.
 
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I mean if they took a sprinter it's a shitty outcome, for the crash to occur. So hopefully the sprinters side of the team is still salvageable. Somehow it does seem that sprinter section is not at sync at all, two riders sprinting for themself. So all in all i guess not much thought was put into this. For me personally it's obvious that any decent shot they have is regarding GC anyway. Winning the Tour can still save their season as a whole.
I don't understand your criticism. Why are two riders sprinting on their own? Yes, Danny as well as Jordi and Laurence had lost each other shortly before the crash. But in general, Danny and Jordi worked really well together. Danny also wanted a sprinter to come along.
I still think it was the right decision. Precisely because they didn't leave any mountain riders in top form at home. And Roglic seems to be having problems again. Just like in the Giro right from the start, he's not fighting for seconds. I don't know what happened before the Giro. He's ridden quite differently this year.
 
But overall if they don't crash in the next two sprint stages (a big if) the result is okay if you already had low expectations. Places one and two are gone as everyone knew before the Tour. Behind that it looked like a possible podium battle between Remco, Jorgensen and Almeida with possibly Almeida now out I think Roglic and Lipowitz could be the 6th and 7th best riders in the high mountains. I would think Gall will be better he can really surprise I think.

Vauquelin and Onley are beatable I think and the others are quite far back and didn't look in top shape e.g. Mas or Skjelmose. Fighting for place 5-10 was the realistic scenario before the Tour and they are in there. Not enough for their budget and the team performance is horrible but in the end it is in line with the low expectations.
 
mur-de-bretagne


 
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Does anyone know why there was a change in the team car at the Tour and Bernie Eisel has now switched from the second car to the first car? He is at the wheel, Gasparotto next to him.
Slightly off topic, pparently nowadays common sense has prevailed and the guy next to the driver is operating the radio, no longer the driver. Took cycling long enough to do the reasonable, safer thing.
 
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Jul 22, 2024
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Slightly off topic, pparently nowadays common sense has prevailed and the guy next to the driver is operating the radio, no longer the driver. Took cycling long enough to do the reasonable, safer thing.
That's how it should be. In many cases, however, this is still not the case today. You often see this with Velon.

In addition, the driver is the one who has direct control of the car and contact with the riders at the car. I would think that there must be a reason for such a change
 
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Jul 22, 2024
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The current Tour is once again bringing a lot of learnings for the team. Some riders have been strong all year, but many haven’t found their form—whether due to various reasons or perhaps because they’re simply not ideal support riders.

That’s the case again on this Tour. The sprint squad hasn’t been able to make an impact, largely because of crashes. And of course, it was clear from the start that the team setup would offer limited support in the mountains. But when riders like Nils Politt are pulling at the front for days and staying in the peloton much longer than all of RBH’s helpers—even today—that makes you think. Or look at riders like Campenaerts. Or how impressively broad Arkea’s presence is, despite being a smaller team.

It’s becoming apparent that to aim for major victories in the future, there’s a lack of quality in depth—or maybe, in some cases, not enough willingness to give everything as a domestique and push just a bit further.

It was obvious that Vlasov isn’t in shape, and there are reasons for that. But if you put him in the breakaway group, he sprints for mountain points on the first climb, gets dropped twice on the descents, and beyond collecting rain jackets, contributes very little—then something’s not right. Either with the team or with him. If the form isn’t there, a different approach is needed.

I’m curious to see what changes in the run-up to 2026. The hope is that things go better in the Classics. There’s potential with Lipo in the Grand Tours, and hopefully Guilio continues to grow. And if Remco really were to join, then the team needs to be stronger in terms of depth. The riders are already there. But the form needs to be on point, and so does the determination. That usually comes naturally in teams where the atmosphere is right and there’s a belief that you can make a difference.
 
Normally you would think a team with 2 riders in top 6 has good tactical opportunities for attacking the leader. But it seems not this year. As also not in 2004 for example.

Normally you'd also expect a team that has two riders in the top 6 of this stage to have more than these two riders who can do something in the race. But they haven't. It's all a bit strange, also how seemingly only Lipowitz really seems to have found top form of anyone on the squad.
 
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During yesterday's podcast, Denk said that the TT bike used was 7kg only (with a single chainring), and the setup was developed together with the Red Bull F1 team.

No wonder Woods thinks the differences between the teams get larger and larger ;).
 
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So far i would say that criticising them in regards to the Tour performance in terms of GC results is unfounded. Giro would be good too, not for the crashes, Vuelta still to come. Classics, over there it was explained, objective reasons, on why poor results this season, but the classics season is not over yet.
 
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A good result says nothing about how it came about. If the Tour were over now, it would be a top result, but the team's performance would still not be top - or if you say it was and the riders can no do it better, you have to think about which riders you take with you in the future. A Nils Politt is in team no. 7 or 8 on the mountain - and is still there after a lot of work when the two captains are alone at RBH. As soon as one of the captains needs help because he has a small problem or because a competitor has broken away, things can quickly go wrong.

And it's also clear that many don't have the form, generally speaking not for the Tour team. The team was never planned like this. RBH will be the best team.

Even Roglic. He won a stage race this year and was lively. That was all gone at the Giro, even before the crashes. And also now at the Tour. Beside of that, of course, he's riding well.
 
@Links2003

In GT GC racing i would put them at No.3 now and i sense some trouble in paradise, when it comes to Visma. So maybe they can move up to No.2 as soon as season 2026. For UAE obviously that can't come overnight. All of them are now doing long solos, are national champs, win GC races consistently, on top of classics ... Such team should realistically not even exist. Still, after moving in No.2 spot, why not, lets tackle UAE too, as what else is one going to do. The idea is to become No.1 and hence there is no way around it, hopefully with Rogla still riding for the team. We'll see.
 
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I´ll do a short transfer prediction for Bora.
What do we know until now? Thornley will get a WT contract for 2026, we have rumors on Vermeersch and Cattaneo as incoming transfers. Rumors on outgoing transfers: Welsford, Adria and Koch.
On contract extensions we had the rumor that Roglic contract was extended until the end of 2026 and Lipowitz signed a multi year contract - don´t know how long this one is valid. Also Moscon signed a longer contract then visible on PCS, but I don´t know for how long. Just heard in an interview. But he will be with the team minimum 2026. This makes 22 riders with a valid contract for 2026. So the core of the team will stay together.

Contracts expiring:

- Adria
- Koch
- Welsford
- Maciejuk
- Mullen
- Palzer
- Sobrero
- Wandahl

Adria is very likely to leave the team and head over to Movistar. This year he is not as succesful as last year, but I would have loved if he renewed his contract. He is a very valuable asset as a domestique and in some races he can ride for himself. But I think he wants more leadership in hilly races and I think thats not possible at Bora at the moment.

There are some rumors that Koch is about to leave to UAE. I would also renew his contract as he is helpful domestique, but it will be his last bigger contract and I see a possibility that he is leaving and with Thornley you already have the perfect replacement with a higher ceiling in the coming years.

Welsford is leaving to Ineos (based on the latest rumors). Outside the australian races he was just not performing at Bora. Don´t know if he is struggling to much with the "european" races or other things are blocking him. With the right schedule - Australian races, smaller stage races he can deliver nice wins but he didn´t made the step to a high class sprinter and so its good that he is leaving Bora.

On Palzer there were some rumors that he will extend his contract, don´t know why. I like him but he missed again to make the next step. Maybe a one year extension to give his spot in 2027 to a youngster? As Palzer is very likely to sign "any kind of contract" (short term and low on salary)

Mullen and Maciejuk are depending on the sprint situation I think. I believe that no big sprint name is coming in. So the sprinters for the next season will be Meeus, van Poppel and Pithie. If you give these riders the right support and the right races they will deliver wins and you don´t need a new expensive sprinter, as there is no top guy on the market (except Kooij who is heading to Decathlon). I´m alright on that, as Bora is unlikely to send a big sprint train to a GT and all of these three guys can be versitail and can score results without big support and when you give them the support they can win even in bigger stage or one day races. Maybe not 10 wins a year, but 3-5 are possible.

Wandahl didn´t made the step due to different reasons. I think its time to part ways for both sides. Bora can no longer give him freedom in some races and he is to young to be a pure domestique. Maybe UNO X would be a good fit?

I would extend the contract of Matteo Sobrero. Medium mountain guy, that is also good in the flat (or vice versa). Perfect rider for a GT as a domestique.

So in my scenario 4 are leaving (Adria, Koch, Welsford and Wandahl) and one new rider is safe (Thornley). So 4 spots left (as Bora had only 29 riders under contract in 2025).

Gianni Vermeersch is likely to join. A classic rider with experience in gravel races (former gravel world champion). He perfectly fills a open spot in the team, he can support the GC leaders in gravel stages during grand tours. Is a experienced guy in the classics that can step in as a leader when needed or advice the younger classic guys in what to do and where to be in the decisive moments.

Mattia Cattaneo is also a perfect fit. Moutain domestique and good TT rider. You can send him to grand tours and he will be a good domestique without ambitions on personal results in these races. This is a spot where Bora struggled these days. Who will ride first in the mountains and sacrifices his own chances? Now you have a rider that can take over this job and still be there until the last climb and then the leaders can race.

Two spots left. For me two more Devo guys will step up. After his very impressive Giro Next Gen I see Luke Tuckwell as WT rider in 2026. Good hilly/mountain rider. The other one should be Lennart Jasch. He made the switch from Ice skating to road cycling, he has an impressive engine and already showed his talent when riding with the world tour squad. Also his performance in the german nationals was quite good. Next week he will start in the sibiu tour as a leader. I believe he can achieve a top 5 GC result here. This can likely be the race where he is securing his WT contract.

No room for a surprising addition from the outside. But you have two riders Mullen and Palzer that you can "sacrifice" for a good opportunity from the outside or for another rider from the Devo team that could step up. Boichis and Putz would be the logical candidates, regarding Boichis I don´t see how he could combine this with MTB and Putz is very loyal but I think a little bit is missing for a contract at Bora.

Finn should ride one more year with the Devo Team. He had to finish school this first half of the year. So he is just starting to fully focus on cycling. Give him some smaller races with the world tour and leadership at Giro and l´Avenir next year and all good (of course just if he already signed a WT contract with Bora for 2027 otherwise sign him in 2026).

If all this is happening (or close to it), then Bora is heading in the right direction in my point of view. Even next year they wont be a super team as UAE, Visma and Lidl, some people do have to high expectations. It will take another year or two. But they will do one step up. Be more competitive in grand tours and classics, because they adressed weaknesses and some riders will hopefully do not have as much bad luck as this first half of the year (Vlasov, Lazkano, Hindley, van Gils, Martinez) and some riders will progress (Pithie, Pellizzari, van Dijke).
And also the staff around the team will learn from this season and hopefully will do a step up in teamwork, classic tactics etc. and who knows maybe we will see more transfers on the staff too.
So my first prediction was wrong, Wandahl extended his contract. He wants to ride a grand tour but put his focus on one day races. The team expect that he starts racing again in the second half of the season, nothing mentioned about the Vuelta.
 
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Bad timing with Van Poppel's youngster. He leaves the Tour before today's stage. The stage where the sprinters can still have hope and Meeus has probably recovered a bit from the crash. The sprints didn't really work out for RBH at the Tour - for various reasons. Danny would have been important today.
But of course it's right that he goes home. Congratulations!