Teams & Riders The Red Bull - Bora - Hansgrohe team thread

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pablohidalgo7

Aug 31, 2014
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www.wielerflits.nl

Red Bull ziet Danny van Poppel puur als sprinter: “Geen Tour, maar Giro voor eigen kansen”

Ontdek hoe Danny van Poppel bij Red Bull zijn nieuwe rol als sprinter omarmt en zijn kansen op de Giro benut. Lees meer en volg zijn avontuur!
www.wielerflits.nl www.wielerflits.nl

It was pretty clear that Van Poppel would be a sprinter in 2026 after his strong 2025, but some things in this article surprise me. We were recently wondering if Marit would be an option for sprints or a lead-out man for Meeus, and it seems it will be the latter (maybe even for Van Poppel). However, what surprises me most is that Haimar Etxeberria also seems destined to have the lead-out man role as his primary function. I think it's a waste that someone with his "puncheur" potential ends up as a lead-out man on a team that already has Drizners, Marit, the Van Dijkes, or even Pithie and Thornley (although they should also have freedom).

Honestly, I would give sprinters of the level of Van Poppel or Meeus, Drizners and at most the Van Dijke brothers for the entire season. Cyclists like Haimar, Marit, Pithie or Thornley seem too good and versatile for that; they should only act as lead-out men in certain contexts.
 
Berniece

Berniece

Sep 12, 2022
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pablohidalgo7 said:
However, what surprises me most is that Haimar Etxeberria also seems destined to have the lead-out man role as his primary function. I think it's a waste that someone with his "puncheur" potential ends up as a lead-out man on a team that already has Drizners, Marit, the Van Dijkes, or even Pithie and Thornley (although they should also have freedom).
Click to expand...
Etxeberria probably has his free role if Van Poppel would drop and he's still in the peloton?
 
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Wyndbrook

Oct 4, 2020
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MLKarlos said:
Seems Like Hammond left the team as Sport Director.

Back in October he was still mentioned in their official post:


Now he appears to have signed with Rockets
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Fall guy for underwhelming classics campaign perhaps. Generally Hammond is a get up the front and race type of director, riders must have been been on strike.
Never mind, I'm sure the ex national team manager will soon have them racing against each other.
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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“I remember a phase in the final stage of the Dauphine in June,” he explained. “After a lot of climbing we came into a valley with an elite group. I looked around and there were three or four guys from Red Bull in our group. And I thought: ‘Man, I’m sitting here completely alone. And they’re riding around here with four guys.’”
For Evenepoel, the image was confronting, but also clarifying. It highlighted the value of depth and support at the highest level, and planted a seed that would later influence his decision-making.

“That motivated me so much, already knowing what would happen a few months later,” he said. “That evening after the stage I could think of only one thing: ‘Gosh, just imagine if I were surrounded like that. If we could start the final climb with five.’”
Click to expand...


That much for having five team members undertaking the ultimate climb vs not having them and on how supposedly that doesn't matter at all.
 
Berniece

Berniece

Sep 12, 2022
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red_flanders

red_flanders

Apr 3, 2009
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CyclistAbi said:
@Berniece

Remco seems to agree.
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That you think a statement to the effect of "Hey they have 4 guys left and I'm all alone" is the same as "bring a team of all leaders and climbers" pretty much says all that needs to be said about your ability to parse bike racing.

Of course he would want to be surrounded by 3 teammates in the high mountains.

Of course they also need guys for the days that aren't big cols.

Not complicated.
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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@red_flanders

It seems the you only read, or at least only acknowledged, the first paragraph. This is the second paragraph from the quote:

“That motivated me so much, already knowing what would happen a few months later,” he said. “That evening after the stage I could think of only one thing: ‘Gosh, just imagine if I were surrounded like that. If we could start the final climb with five.’”
Click to expand...

IMHO this doesn't leave much room for interpretation wouldn't you agree?
 
red_flanders

red_flanders

Apr 3, 2009
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CyclistAbi said:
@red_flanders

It seems the you only read, or at least only acknowledged, the first paragraph. This is the second paragraph from the quote:



IMHO this doesn't leave much room for interpretation wouldn't you agree?
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No, I don't agree, nor does anyone who understands bike racing. I don't see how this is confusing for you.

You need guys for the long periods of races which happen on flat or rolling terrain. Guys without ambitions. How many guys are on a team? Subtract 5 from that. What does that leave? Sure AF not 3 more climbers. And for sure Remco doesn't think that the 5 guys he wants at the bottom of a climb are all co-leaders or guys with ambitions. FFS.

And having guys at the START of a long climb means just that. The start. So guys burn off during the climb. Like in every GT you've ever seen. It also doesn't mean that the 5 are necessarily climbers, just guys who have big motors who can get to the bottom of the last climb. Guys who can climb, yes. But there are also guys who are super strong on the flats and the climbs, who can help everywhere. With no ambitions.
 
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YavorD

YavorD

Jul 8, 2017
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CyclistAbi said:
@red_flanders

It seems the you only read, or at least only acknowledged, the first paragraph. This is the second paragraph from the quote:



IMHO this doesn't leave much room for interpretation wouldn't you agree?
Click to expand...

Then what?
I still remember maybe twice he aas having more team mates than Vingegaard in the Tour 2024. He was indeed dropping Vingegaard on every MTF..

It doesn't matter how many rider you're surrounded by, all that matters is how strong YOU are, especially on the final climb.
 
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CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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@YavorD

If RBH ever gets to there, having a myriad of strong climbers on the ultimate climbs, once the bunch is already substantially reduced, or as Remco said in that elite group.

Well, best to wait and see, on what comment Pogi and Jonas will have in regards to that. As they are the reference ATM, so best to leave it to them, to tell it like it is. Hopefully Rogla to still be around to take a jab.
 
red_flanders

red_flanders

Apr 3, 2009
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CyclistAbi said:
@red_flanders

Note that you aren't arguing with me this time, you are arguing with Remco. Give him benefit of a doubt, to me it makes perfect sense on what he is saying. We'll see.
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I agree with Remco.

I don't agree with what you've been claiming over and over in this and other threads about how RBH should formulate their team. For you to conflate what Remco is saying with what you've been saying makes zero sense. They aren't close. Remco wants a bunch of guys left at the start of the final climb. Of course. You've been suggesting they bring a team of all climbers. For all the reasons said a million times, this is a terrible idea and no team will ever do it.

Even if Remco gets his dream and has 4 guys to support him on the final climb, that leaves 3 guys for the flats and rolling. And there is no scenario where 5 guys with ambitions to win makes any sense. 1 of those 5 could be a strong roleur who can climb. 3 strong climbers, and 2, even 3 guys threatening to win a stage or the race? Could make sense. 8 top climbing guys? Does not.
 
Hugh Januss

Hugh Januss

Jul 9, 2009
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YavorD said:
Then what?
I still remember maybe twice he aas having more team mates than Vingegaard in the Tour 2024. He was indeed dropping Vingegaard on every MTF..

It doesn't matter how many rider you're surrounded by, all that matters is how strong YOU are, especially on the final climb.
Click to expand...
And Vingegaard was dropping everyone not named Pogacar no matter how many of them there were in the lead group when Pogacar attacked.
 
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YavorD

YavorD

Jul 8, 2017
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Hugh Januss said:
And Vingegaard was dropping everyone not named Pogacar no matter how many of them there were in the lead group when Pogacar attacked.
Click to expand...

Pretty much this. Let alone that Pogacar and Vingegaard's domestiques are stronger than anyone in Red Bull bar Evenepoel, perhaps.
How many times Lipowitz, the supposed to be co-leader of RBH, was dropped by a domestique? I could at least 3.

So ultimately it doesn't matter how many riders are surrounding Evenepoel, as they will be dropped anyway, all that matters is whether he improved (a lot) or not.
 
red_flanders

red_flanders

Apr 3, 2009
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Hugh Januss said:
And Vingegaard was dropping everyone not named Pogacar no matter how many of them there were in the lead group when Pogacar attacked.
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This is on point, of course. I do think it's also true that having your guys around you is psychologically beneficial, and does provide support (wheels, etc.), as well as giving the team some options to launch attacks others have to follow.

But of course at the end of the day, in a race as long and tough as a GT, the strongest guy is gonna win. And having your teammates around you doesn't change that.

If you're RBH, you're hoping to get more performance out of Remco (and everyone) every year, and then you start to hopefully have options.
 
C

CyclistAbi

May 29, 2019
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@red_flanders @Berniece

If you two agree with what Remco said that is good enough for me.

As for what will actually be the outcome in the 2026 season in regards to the RBH team and the Tour performance, that is for Remco to be as he says ideally a part of 5-ish RBH riders in that elite group, undertaking the ultimate climb, after a day of extensive climbing already in the legs, or if instead there will be more of a 2-ish or DIY team by that point remaining. We'll see. By now around four to five rider names is circulating already, on who will likely undertake the Tour and we can i guess start making some conclusions, on what will be left of the team, once Visma and especially UAE do their part.

As for Rogla schedule:

cyclinguptodate.com

"That's Primoz' priority" - Roglic himself has asked not to be at the Tour de France to prioritize chance to make history at La Vuelta

Red Bull - BORA - hansgrohe are cycling's new 'super team' however within this massively talented structure, a lot of choices had to be made - a lot of riders must be kept happy. As a result the Tour...
cyclinguptodate.com cyclinguptodate.com

But a supporting role, or chasing stage wins, was not what he wanted.
Click to expand...

So for Rogla co-leadership it seems was not at play in terms of the Tour 2026. So indeed a Tour attempt in 2026 season doesn't make much sense, focusing on Vuelta and doing good over there, that takes priority. At Giro it was hinted there are already a plethora of other ambitious riders over there, so giving them the freedom indeed makes much sense to me. At Vuelta hopefully support won't be all that bad for Rogla as for example UAE seems to be taking a strong team. We'll see.
 
A

AmRacer

Sep 1, 2023
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CyclistAbi said:
Rogla already rode in supporting role on when Pogi was beaten at the Tour so your remark is unfounded. As for RBH not offering Rogla co-leadership for the Tour, we'll see on how that one goes.
Click to expand...
Roglic is done with the Tour, he made it to Paris last year.
 
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