Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Red Rick]

Olympics are big man. Riders base their schedule during an Olympic season heavily around the Olympics. Much more so than for monuments.

 

[houtdffan]

My ranking of the importance

1. TDF
2. Giro/Vuelta
3. WCRR, OlyRR
4. MSR, RVV, PR, LBL, Lombardia, PN, TA, Dauphine, TDS
5. WCTT, OlyTT
6. All other world tour races

 

[tobydawq]

Olympics are big man. Riders base their schedule during an Olympic season heavily around the Olympics. Much more so than for monuments.

Exactly.

 

[tobydawq]

My ranking of the importance

1. TDF
2. Giro/Vuelta
3. WCRR, OlyRR
4. MSR, RVV, PR, LBL, Lombardia, PN, TA, Dauphine, TDS
5. WCTT, OlyTT
6. All other world tour races

One-week races are not equal to monuments, wut?

 

[Extinction]

I actually consider the Olympics almost meaningless in a cyclist palmares. It has none of the cycling tradition of the monuments or Worlds. Especially since it used to be the territory only of “amateur” riders. It’s also this oddity the happens every four years and where cycling is only a small piece in the entire event.

I am aware that cyclists do target it and find it important. As a fan, I do not hold it high in a cycling palmares.

TDF
Worlds
Giro
Vuelta
P-R, LBL, Ronde, Lombardia
Strade, San Sebastián
MSR
Dauphine
TDS
Itzulia
Paris-Nice, T-A

My 2 cents.

Your positioning of MSR is sacrelige, however, as it goes after PR, LBL, Ronde, (Lombardia?). I know, the course is easy, but the time of the year and the capi make it magical. And I'd put Itzulia after PN and TDS, with San Sebastian and Strade (bless it's soul) at the bottom, but only for historical reasons. Worlds depends on the course and who wins, if not terribly hard and won by an outsider, then after Giro and Vuelta. If epic and won by a champion then where you put it.

 

[Extinction]

Yea, but Big Doopie is considering Olympics in the sport from the pro perspective in the past. And he's right in that it was not a race, unlike the Worlds, of pros on national teams, for which the cycling Worlds coopted the Olympics rainbow colors. The Cold War distorted things in the 80s, however, within the US-Soviet rivalry for the involved countries in cycling-hockey-basketball, when only amateurs competed. At that time, as Big Doopie indicated, the Olympic RR on the Continent was meaningless to pro cycling in comparison to the WCRR. Now things are totally different, however, the WCRR has a different historical legacy for the sport.

 

[Extinction]

One-week races are not equal to monuments, wut?

They are not.

 

[Berniece]

They are not.

I'm even surprised people put Giro/Vuelta above some monuments. I would prefer to win de Ronde or Roubaix compared to a Vuelta

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

So now we’re debating relative importance of races again huh. I see

 

[Extinction]

I'm even surprised people put Giro/Vuelta above some monuments. I would prefer to win de Ronde or Roubaix compared to a Vuelta

Ah, well, depends on your nationality and history I suppose. I mean, how can you choose between pavé, Belgian beer and sterate, the Dolomiti and Brunello? It's impossibile! Although, out of respect, the Italians call the Ronde and classics racing in Belgium generally the "university of cycling."

 

[hayneplane]

I think we can deduce from the Velo D’or shortlist that even the award judges don’t view the monuments as having equal merit as 3/5 were won by superstars but of the other 2 one Van Baarle (PR) made the list and one Mohoric (MSR) did not even though both had similar year long success levels.

 

[Netserk]

Olympics are big man. Riders base their schedule during an Olympic season heavily around the Olympics. Much more so than for monuments.

The flip side of this is that Strade is very overrated here. It's a great race, but it doesn't have the prestige some want it to have.

 

[tobydawq]

The flip side of this is that Strade is very overrated here. It's a great race, but it doesn't have the prestige some want it to have.

Look at which riders perform well in a race instead of stating random opinions based on nothing.

 

[Big Doopie]

Well, it's not.

Which is y I specifically said: “I am aware that riders target it…”

As @Extinction pointed out Olympics simply do not have the history and tradition within pro cycling. That is a simple fact. The Worlds Champ wears a specific jersey for an entire year. For the Olympics, the rider has to be provided with a golden helmet or bike by their sponsor as a gimmick. How many pro cycling Olympics have there been? 7-8? All in recent times so…

Meaningless to me anyway.

 

[Extinction]

The flip side of this is that Strade is very overrated here. It's a great race, but it doesn't have the prestige some want it to have.

I don't think it's overrated, in the sense that it doesn't go before monuments, but it has rapidly since its recent inception effectively become the latest classic. I think it's beauty and challenges warrant such an honor, I would only lengthen it to 250 km.

 

[Extinction]

Which is y I specifically said: “I am aware that riders target it…”

As @Extinction pointed out Olympics simply do not have the history and tradition within pro cycling. That is a simple fact. The Worlds Champ wears a specific jersey for an entire year. For the Olympics, the rider has to be provided with a golden helmet or bike by their sponsor as a gimmick. How many pro cycling Olympics have there been? 7-8? All in recent times so…

Meaningless to me anyway.

I hear you, but it surely isn't meaningless as any pro today would love to have it on his palmarès.

 

[Netserk]

Look at which riders perform well in a race instead of stating random opinions based on nothing.

An indicator of the Olympics' prestige: "Riders base their schedule during an Olympic season heavily around the Olympics."

Of the riders who can perform well in the race, who targeted it and to what degree did they base their schedule around it?

My contention is not that it is unimportant, but that the claim that it has the same prestige as Amstel is overstated.

 

[hayneplane]

I don't think it's overrated, in the sense that it doesn't go before monuments, but it has rapidly since its recent inception effectively become the latest classic. I think it's beauty and challenges warrant such an honor, I would only lengthen it to 250 km.

Possibly though maybe it’s hard enough already given how rare it is for riders in the top 10 to finish in groups larger than 2.

 

[Extinction]

Possibly though maybe it’s hard enough already given how rare it is for riders in the top 10 to finish in groups larger than 2.

Ok, but 230-240 km would be optimal to elevate the cojones.

 

[houtdffan]

I'm even surprised people put Giro/Vuelta above some monuments. I would prefer to win de Ronde or Roubaix compared to a Vuelta

a GT is above any 1 day race

 

[hayneplane]

Ok, but 230-240 km would be optimal to elevate the cojones.

Sounds good to me, putting it on a par with Gent-Wevelgem for distance, as long as that does not put any riders off ahead of T-A and MSR.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

I have been in contact with people from Netflix and they are interested in making a docu series about this thread.

 

[Berniece]

a GT is above any 1 day race

Why? Because it's more days? Then a 1 week stage race is also above any 1 day race?

I'm on the fence about it btw. I was writing a paragraph on why 1 day races can be more important, but while writing it I felt that I might be wrong.

 

[Red Rick]

Why? Because it's more days? Then a 1 week stage race is also above any 1 day race?

I'm on the fence about it btw. I was writing a paragraph on why 1 day races can be more important, but while writing it I felt that I might be wrong.

The 1 week stage races aren't the biggest of their own kind. And neither are the monuments. WC/ORR vs Vuelta maayyybe but that's it.

I assume you're talking mainly about RvV and Paris Roubaix, they have too much variance in my taste, especially Roubaix, and too many fluke winners.

Also, if they're greater than say Giro/Vuelta, then Ronde-Roubaix double would basically be better than Giro/Vuelta double, which has been accomplished once this century.

 

[Netserk]

Roubaix is above the WC.