Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Berflamand]

Belgian national coach and former CX rider Sven Vanthourenhout says that there was actually some CX training with Evenepoel planned last winter but that it was obviously not possible because of his revalidation. He should and probably will train on it in the off season.

Vanthourenhout also doesn't fear the descents at the Olympics because apparently they are not technical at all.

 

[LesDiablesRouges]

Can't see Bernal losing 2 minutes to Remco in the final TT. Bernal has shown he can defend quite well in a final TT, see the Tour De Suisse against Rohan Dennis. He isn't a terrible TTer when on form, and he has the recovery too.

Yeah, that's not a good ITT to draw from as it was 2 years ago. Sure he finished 11th, however, if you recall, Dennis, at that time, was in huge war with Bahrain vis a vis his TT equipment and this was also prior to Bernal having back issues. Furthermore this was a 19.2 km ITT with a slight incline profile where the winner was Yves Lampaert. The Winning KPH was 52. 443 which is likely 2-3 KPH below the winning speed for stage 21.

His 2021 ITTs are a much more relevant for comparison. He's going to lose a significant amount of time on the ITT somewhere around 1 minute 30.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Belgian national coach and former CX rider Sven Vanthourenhout says that there was actually some CX training with Evenepoel planned last winter but that it was obviously not possible because of his revalidation. He should and probably will train on it in the off season.

Vanthourenhout also doesn't fear the descents at the Olympics because apparently they are not technical at all.

There were even talks of doing it last year (winter 2019-2020), but they didn't bother eventually. I'm sure they regret it now.

Remco asked in January 2020 (before last season), but to train him the following winter.

 

[LesDiablesRouges]

There were even talks of doing it last year (winter 2019-2020), but they didn't bother eventually. I'm sure they regret it now.

Oof, that likely cost him twice, Lombardy and the Giro.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Oof, that likely cost him twice, Lombardy and the Giro.

I was wrong. I looked it up, Remco asked in January 2020 (before last season), but to train him the following winter.

 

[LesDiablesRouges]

I was wrong. I looked it up, Remco asked in January 2020 (before last season), but to train him the following winter.

Ahh then that would make more sense. I'm guessing he's definitely going to do Cx this winter. I'm still at a loss that he didn't seem to recognize or was unwilling that his poor positioning on the gravel played a massive role in him blowing up unless he was suggesting that he couldn't even position because his legs were bad.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Ahh then that would make more sense. I'm guessing he's definitely going to do Cx this winter. I'm still at a loss that he didn't seem to recognize or was unwilling that his poor positioning on the gravel played a massive role in him blowing up unless he was suggesting that he couldn't even position because his legs were bad.

The thing is i don't understand that it took so long to come to the conclusion to do some CX considering his short cycling career and limited technical skills. I suggested as much in this thread back in 2018. Cian Uijtdebroeks, who's been racing since he was 12, has made that call to do CX this (coming) winter, but he's 3 years younger.

 

[Bolder]

Belgian national coach and former CX rider Sven Vanthourenhout says that there was actually some CX training with Evenepoel planned last winter but that it was obviously not possible because of his revalidation. He should and probably will train on it in the off season.

Vanthourenhout also doesn't fear the descents at the Olympics because apparently they are not technical at all.

Mountain biking is much more fun.

 

[Valanga]

Mountain biking is much more fun.

Yes but also less similarity with road racing.
CX is perfect imho. All about explosivity and bike handling, the two aspects of cycling he's lacking.

 

[Riek s]

So, we have this young dude, who was proven himself to be a great rider in the past, but who we have never seen in any great mountain stage so far.

This young dude has lost time on almost every important stage in the Giro so far. Besides yesterday all of these stages have shown some similarity to stages where he previously performed perfectly fine such as Alto de Fóia and Picon Blanco.

And now many seem to expect this guy to make a recovery in stages where he is completely untested. Even taking into account that he is racing three weeks for the first time where his previous max. has been like 7 stages on a very low level in Argentinia. And also taking into account that this youngster has had an awful preparation after coming back from a heavy injury after crashing last year.

yes

The thing is i don't understand that it took so long to come to the conclusion to do some CX considering his short cycling career and limited technical skills. I suggested as much in this thread back in 2018. Cian Uijtdebroeks, who's been racing since he was 12, has made that call to do CX this (coming) winter, but he's 3 years younger.

Maybe because he never really realized how bad it was? In a normal descend, it doesn't really matter that much.
Of course for a GT is does, but he never really rode a descend in the wheels at full speed (aside the one where he crashed due to it), let alone with gravel.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Maybe because he never really realized how bad it was? In a normal descend, it doesn't really matter that much.
Of course for a GT is does, but he never really rode a descend in the wheels at full speed (aside the one where he crashed due to it), let alone with gravel.

He crashed hard, on sterrati, in the summer of 2019, had teammates (Sénéchal) declare in the press how bad his bikehandling skills were. He lost his GC because of that stage. If it wasn't clear to him, it should have been clear to the team.

But now, the message has come across, better late than never, Lefevere said they need to work on bikehandling skills. Hallelujah! He also says the time Evenepoel lost was due to... bad technical skills on gravel.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1395412020611198979

View: https://twitter.com/VerhelstBr/status/1395412020611198979

 

[LesDiablesRouges]

I think he got away with things because he had a much bigger engine in Juniors and was able to get away with it in lesser races. In order to win the big races he's gotta improve to avoid losing time especially when he's not at his best. He can't just bully a race by having the biggest tank.

 

[memyselfandI]

Most important thing still is to ride through complete Giro. It's more important than anything in this whole season, hopefully his team see this too. Much more important than Olympics or later gt's because now he's solid and healthy. Oly nobody knows, later maybe new accident or something else. So now this completely, then all else is big big plus.

That way only he can understand how fit he must be, how form evolves in three weeks, what it takes mentally, what is possible to speak in front of media aso aso. Huge amount of details. Things that he doesn't handle yet.

Because all adult champions, even classic spesialists typically handle at least one gt per season, many handle more and all that jazz.

 

[Lequack]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1395473311858151428

View: https://twitter.com/EvenepoelRemco/status/1395473311858151428

 

[CyclistAbi]

Looks like they had that beer.

 

[red_flanders]

Most important thing still is to ride through complete Giro. It's more important than anything in this whole season, hopefully his team see this too. Much more important than Olympics or later gt's because now he's solid and healthy. Oly nobody knows, later maybe new accident or something else. So now this completely, then all else is big big plus.

That way only he can understand how fit he must be, how form evolves in three weeks, what it takes mentally, what is possible to speak in front of media aso aso. Huge amount of details. Things that he doesn't handle yet.

Because all adult champions, even classic spesialists typically handle at least one gt per season, many handle more and all that jazz.

Good points about finishing. RE: the media, I don't understand what you're talking about. The guy is amazingly media savvy for a 21 year old.

 

[Zoef-Lightning]

Belgian national coach and former CX rider Sven Vanthourenhout says that there was actually some CX training with Evenepoel planned last winter but that it was obviously not possible because of his revalidation. He should and probably will train on it in the off season.

Vanthourenhout also doesn't fear the descents at the Olympics because apparently they are not technical at all.

But Lefevere declared something else. The plan was (is) that Evenepoel would/should be trained in winter by a motoGP-specialist. Which is totally stupid. GP-racing is a totally different discipline. With different curve technique, speed, (gravel) surface etc. He should indeed train CX and participate at a few races next winter. Races with uphill and downhill. Koppenberg (also training cobbles technique), Gavere, Namur.

 

[Berflamand]

But Lefevere declared something else. The plan was (is) that Evenepoel would/should be trained in winter by a motoGP-specialist. Which is totally stupid. GP-racing is a totally different discipline. With different curve technique, speed, (gravel) surface etc. He should indeed train CX and participate at a few races next winter. Races with uphill and downhill. Koppenberg (also training cobbles technique), Gavere, Namur.

Yeah, I read that as well. I think (or at least I hope) they had (and still have) both plans, CX training for overall bike handling technique and riding on dirt roads, training with MotoGP Pilot for specific descending techniques and courage.

The MotoGP Pilot is Cal Crutchlow, a good friend of Cav and a passionate cyclist and big fan of Specialized bikes. I guess they must know he has exceptional skills also on the bike and I can imagine there can be some similarities with MotoGP, especially regarding trust and courage.

 

[bNator]

But Lefevere declared something else. The plan was (is) that Evenepoel would/should be trained in winter by a motoGP-specialist. Which is totally stupid. GP-racing is a totally different discipline. With different curve technique, speed, (gravel) surface etc. He should indeed train CX and participate at a few races next winter. Races with uphill and downhill. Koppenberg (also training cobbles technique), Gavere, Namur.

There are plenty of Moto GP riders who are also avid cyclists. One of them (Aleix Espargaro) is even reported to be considering a swith to becoming pro cyclist (I think ususally he is linked toMovistar?). Then you have Dani Pedrosa for instance, and sadly Nicky Hayden who was killed on a road bike...

Moto GP riders are usually also active in different terrain as well - motocross, etc. I certainly don't consider that idea totally stupid. I bet Espargaro would be absolutely top descender if he ever does make a switch to cycling. Hell, I bet any Moto GP rider would beat any pro cylist on any descent if you give him one day to get familiar with the road bike. No doubt in my mind about that...

Edit: I've seen cyclists do the classic target fixation error so many times on a descent I can't believe it. There's a technique to avoid that for instance which is common to anything that has two wheels... I guarantee you that there's not a single Moto GP rider who will do target fixation - ever. And half the peloton does it as soon as the situation gets difficult... If Remco stops target fixating, he will be a much better descender.

 

[Axel Hangleck]

Some off road (most likely CX) cycle training for bike handling/ technique, though he'll never be a natural like Bernal - and then some tutorship from Cal, in regards line choice, braking points, getting back on the 'power', etc makes a lot of sense.

 

[bambino]

Yeah, that's not a good ITT to draw from as it was 2 years ago. Sure he finished 11th, however, if you recall, Dennis, at that time, was in huge war with Bahrain vis a vis his TT equipment and this was also prior to Bernal having back issues. Furthermore this was a 19.2 km ITT with a slight incline profile where the winner was Yves Lampaert. The Winning KPH was 52. 443 which is likely 2-3 KPH below the winning speed for stage 21.

His 2021 ITTs are a much more relevant for comparison. He's going to lose a significant amount of time on the ITT somewhere around 1 minute 30.

If this would be single ITT like WCRR, start of GT or stage race, I would agree.

However an ITT after 3 weeks of racing in the legs normally is different and the time differences sligthly smaller favoring the smaller GC climbers. I have hard times to believe the gaps are going to be that massive (unless you are called Pogacar), but I can be proved to be wrong.

 

[spalco]

Edit: I've seen cyclists do the classic target fixation error so many times on a descent I can't believe it. There's a technique to avoid that for instance which is common to anything that has two wheels... I guarantee you that there's not a single Moto GP rider who will do target fixation - ever. And half the peloton does it as soon as the situation gets difficult... If Remco stops target fixating, he will be a much better descender.

I've never heard of that before (not a motorcycle rider), but watched a couple youtube videos on that now - yeah indeed, road cyclist do this all the time. This is really enlightening. Even watching Remco's Lombardy crash again, that's at least partially exactly what happened there.

Weird how many cyclists put so much pain and suffering into training and yet fail to learn the simplest crafts of their job.

 

[BlueRoads]

Also I suppose that there was a lot of fear involved, since he didn't want to admit his gravel problems. Why would you not admit that, it's no shame after coming into cycling so late? No more than bad legs. So I would guess fear is something people don't like to admit that easily and moto gp could be more useful for that than cross, although for technique cross is certainly very helpful. I suspect mtb is a bit dangerous for someone who lacks the technique, seeing that they shall usually stay away from any dangerous sports. In cross nothing serious will happen.

 

[Bolder]

Yes but also less similarity with road racing.
CX is perfect imho. All about explosivity and bike handling, the two aspects of cycling he's lacking.

I used to race VTT before I got into road riding, and it made the transition very easy, especially having no fear about bunny hopping curbs etc. But both VTT and CX involve finding a good line, explosiveness and subtle weight shifts to keep control and contact. I tried CX a few times but much prefer VTT...

 

[Netserk]

So, did Bambi *** his diapers when Nibali attacked on the descent? Anyone heard from him?