Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Red Rick]

"Dude just lose weight and keep the same power" is really just the "hit to his backhand" of cycling.

 

[shadowrider]

In an interview with Sporza he says he’s going to lose 2kg’s by the time it’s important in the TDF. So I guess by the time the third week starts?

1,5 by the start of the Tour. The last 0,5 kg by mid Tour. Not ideal due to his fractured bones. But maybe this will lead to a great third week...

 

[houtdffan]

In 2022 he was lean from CSS til WCC. More than 3 weeks. And they are quite certainly wrong.

If OG are his real goal, they should just say so instead of this farce, claiming he wants to podium the TDF looking like mister Brick House.

right now, he seems to be more on form for a run at the Vuelta if anything

he's about where he was in 2022

 

[shadowrider]

Optimal for TT, climbing or something else?

In the case of Evenepoel and the way his body is built, it's always a compromise. Good enough for a small stagerace, a hilly onedayrace and a challenging TT
with some height differences. But not ideal for a Grand Tour.

 

[Volderke]

In 2022 he was lean from CSS til WCC. More than 3 weeks. And they are quite certainly wrong.

If OG are his real goal, they should just say so instead of this farce, claiming he wants to podium the TDF looking like mister Brick House.

Did he ever say he wants to podium at the Tour? I thought they said to aim for top 5 and maybe a stage or 2.
It seems you're very emotional about Remco's weight. We all know he's fat but you're almost at the point of fatshaming.

 

[danielovichdk2]

Looking at the first week of TdF it seems unlikely Remco will be have a good time. His only options is to be this really pain in the ass and hope for trouble.

I feel bad for Remco. He doesn't deserve the bad press.

The only other contender next to pog is primoz and I have deemed him obsolete winning another gt.

It will be a poor TdF and I believe pog will win it with two fingers in his nose.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Did he ever say he wants to podium at the Tour? I thought they said to aim for top 5 and maybe a stage or 2.
It seems you're very emotional about Remco's weight. We all know he's fat but you're almost at the point of fatshaming.

I'm just exaggerating to make it less tragic. It's not fatshaming, it's calling out a lack of professionalism. He wants to be a GC rider, that's his choice not mine. That means you need to be able to strife for your optimal weight in order to climb as fast as possible consistently over 3 weeks. That's the reality of the matter.

I can't recall whether he said he wanted top 5 or top 3. And it doesn't matter frankly. He also wanted to top 10 in the 2022 Vuelta, right?

 

[Froome]

Not sure that I have ever seen kg/cm as an indicator of anything or even a figure considered worth calculating.

BMI (widely used but not without controversy, especially at the extremes) is calculated as mass/height squared. Using the data above, that gives:
Pogacar 21.0
Roglic 20.7
Evenepoel 21.5

Ponderal Index, less widely used but considered more reliable for those particularly tall or short, is calculated as mass / height cubed, and gives
Pogacar 11.9
Roglic 11.7
Evenepoel 12.6


Not sure that anything very meaningful can be deduced from it though

Right, BMI.....my bad.

Nevertheless, my point was that in proportion mass/height, Evenepoel is similar with Roglic and Pogacar if he is 63 kg.

 

[peterfin]

Eddy Merckx in his prime weighted 73-74kg and had a BMI of 22-22,5. Based on weight and BMI alone he shouldn't be a GC specialist and yet he did pretty good. It helped that bicycles were 5kg heavier at that time but muscle mass and power are definitely part of the equation as well.

 

[Divergence]

Of course not. It's not linear. Because he has not the body of a climber or GC-rider in a GT. Losing 2 kg at maximum will improve his climbing capabilities. Losing 4 kg will lead to breakdowns and even healthissues.

IF he wants to be competitive he needs to do everything he can to make his body to be that of a GC rider. By that I mean that he should have not gone off the rails during his injury time and gained so much weight. It is all about discipline and at the moments he seems to be struggling with it. If he tries to be at a climbing weight for more than a month during the season he might not lose so much power (or even at all). The body simply adapts.
But, maybe ha just wants to be good at TTs...

 

[Divergence]

Eddy Merckx in his prime weighted 73-74kg and had a BMI of 22-22,5. Based on weight and BMI alone he shouldn't be a GC specialist and yet he did pretty good. It helped that bicycles were 5kg heavier at that time but muscle mass and power are definitely part of the equation as well.

Merckx was great when the standards in cycling were quite low. His shape would not cut it in today's age.

 

[Volderke]

I'm just exaggerating to make it less tragic. It's not fatshaming, it's calling out a lack of professionalism. He wants to be a GC rider, that's his choice not mine. That means you need to be able to strife for your optimal weight in order to climb as fast as possible consistently over 3 weeks. That's the reality of the matter.

I can't recall whether he said he wanted top 5 or top 3. And it doesn't matter frankly. He also wanted to top 10 in the 2022 Vuelta, right?

Not necessarily directed to you alone (I read other similar comments), but if he doesn't get on his ideal weight, so be it. He clearly does great in TT and if he says top 5 and gets 15th, we'll have to do with that. If he wins some stages (e.g. the low-hanging fruit = the TT), it will already be OK-ish.
He already had a lot of setbacks for being only 24, and if he wasn't living like a monk after all the hard work and the crash, it is like it is. We've seen countless athletes failing because they e.g. were so much focused on weight, they lost power and weren't competitive either. As I said before, Remco seems to have to walk a very fine line between optimal climbing vs. optimal power, and for now his power is great and he's working on his climbing. We'll see how far he gets with that. He's at 2:15 of a very in-shape Roglic after a hard week of racing (ofcourse tomorrow he can lose more time), that's not too bad if you see where he comes from, and he is, in his own mind, in an upwards trajectory. He won't win the Tour and he won't smash Pog and probably also not Roglic and maybe some others, but as long as he's consistent and not crashing, he can do good things in the Tour.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Right, BMI.....my bad.

Nevertheless, my point was that in proportion mass/height, Evenepoel is similar with Roglic and Pogacar if he is 63 kg.

Yeah, no. For Evenepoel to have the same BMI as Pogacar, he would need to weigh 61.5kg. That's 1.5kg less than his supposed 63kg weight (at the start of the Tour, like it was at the start of the Giro). For him to have the same BMI as Roglic, he'd need to weigh 60.5kg. Not comparable at all, when you want to be fighting for the win/podium. That's a 1.5 and 2.5kg difference from what SQS has us believe is his optimal weight. And likely at least 3 and 4 kg less than what he weighs now. That's a huge difference going uphill. In both cases that's less than what he was during the '22 Vuelta.

Not necessarily directed to you alone (I read other similar comments), but if he doesn't get on his ideal weight, so be it. He clearly does great in TT and if he says top 5 and gets 15th, we'll have to do with that. If he wins some stages (e.g. the low-hanging fruit = the TT), it will already be OK-ish.
He already had a lot of setbacks for being only 24, and if he wasn't living like a monk after all the hard work and the crash, it is like it is. We've seen countless athletes failing because they e.g. were so much focused on weight, they lost power and weren't competitive either. As I said before, Remco seems to have to walk a very fine line between optimal climbing vs. optimal power, and for now his power is great and he's working on his climbing. We'll see how far he gets with that. He's at 2:15 of a very in-shape Roglic after a hard week of racing (ofcourse tomorrow he can lose more time), that's not too bad if you see where he comes from, and he is, in his own mind, in an upwards trajectory. He won't win the Tour and he won't smash Pog and probably also not Roglic and maybe some others, but as long as he's consistent and not crashing, he can do good things in the Tour.

Why would you assume Roglic is so much in shape? Evenepoel is getting dropped by Romo, Gee, Jorgenson, fcking Lazkano and Meintjes.
But again, it's his choice, no problem if he says he's done with riding for GC. But as long as he stays the course, we should be able to call out and criticise him/them and hold them to the standard of what it takes to be a GC rider.

 

[Bolder]

In the case of Evenepoel and the way his body is built, it's always a compromise. Good enough for a small stagerace, a hilly onedayrace and a challenging TT
with some height differences. But not ideal for a Grand Tour.

And that's fine, tbh. He's just got a bigger frame. He can win (and has) huge races without winning another GT.

 

[dercuforever]

"Dude just lose weight and keep the same power" is really just the "hit to his backhand" of cycling.

Just don't get hit of league of legends.
Might as well ask him to attack on the valley.

 

[Salvarani]

In the last few seasons he has been quite dominant, in a few races. Had bigger margins. He seems a lot closer to the "rest" this year. Couldnt be the start of an early decline already? He hasnt gotten better this year compared to other years, at least I didnt think so after Algarve or P-N... despite the crash of course that came later.

But as I have thought, Olympics is his big goal then Worlds. Win any of those or both and it is a great year.

Honestly, I would love to hear PLs thoughts... will he dish it out like he has towards Ala? We will see I guess depending on how the rest of the season goes.

 

[peterfin]

In the last few seasons he has been quite dominant, in a few races. Had bigger margins. He seems a lot closer to the "rest" this year. Couldnt be the start of an early decline already? He hasnt gotten better this year compared to other years, at least I didnt think so after Algarve or P-N... despite the crash of course that came later.

But as I have thought, Olympics is his big goal then Worlds. Win any of those or both and it is a great year.

Honestly, I would love to hear PLs thoughts... will he dish it out like he has towards Ala? We will see I guess depending on how the rest of the season goes.

An early decline?? He had a better early season than usual. He is never top during the spring and yet he won almost everything that was a goal. Only a tactical mistake in P-N and a crash in the TT of Itzulia could stop him. His injuries were a serious set back. That is the only conclusion we can make.

 

[Salvarani]

An early decline?? He had a better early season than usual. He is never top during the spring and yet he won almost everything that was a goal. Only a tactical mistake in P-N and a crash in the TT of Itzulia could stop him. His injuries were a serious set back. That is the only conclusion we can make.

I just posed a question. It is not that serious.

I dont really got those feelings from the those races but ok. I think I gave him some slack in the post as well. So no problem.

 

[peterfin]

If Remco has good legs tomorrow and the GC group has still a chance to win the stage, he should test himself with a long range attack. Go 500m before the top of the La Saleve climb and start a 60km TT. He doesn't have the legs to accelerate during the last climb so he needs to be able to diesel to the top. He has a chance. Bora could take it easy. Ineos could organise the chase but they know Roglic will be eager to capitalize on their efforts.

 

[Motopace]

Remco will win the TDF. Like, one day, not this year of course, but don't be impatient. Come on people, it's not that big of an achievement, even GC G did this, what an overhyped race

 

[gregrowlerson]

I was right from the start and we can see the signs at the Dauphine!

I understand what happened.

His DS instructed, "Show the world who is the strongest."

Remco just interpreted that differently to Jonas.

 

[Oldermanish]

He still climbs worse than Landa who also broke his ribs. So not really reassuring.

He won the TT; the metric he can rely on for his recovery form. Landa's climbing has always been unpredictable but it's early to judge him, too. Soudal has a shallow Tour team IMO and they are/should be planning for some stage results first. Worry later about the Olympic Gold and other stuff until the base data is solid and reliable.

 

[Oldermanish]

"Dude just lose weight and keep the same power" is really just the "hit to his backhand" of cycling.

....or turn the throttle to 11...just twist it harder!

 

[Peyroteo94]

Remco will win the TDF. Like, one day, not this year of course, but don't be impatient. Come on people, it's not that big of an achievement, even GC G did this, what an overhyped race

No, he won't. Remco is 15 months younger than Pogacar and 3 years younger than Vingegaard. Probably, we will have, in the future, 2 or 3 riders who will step up and become world class gc riders so Remco needs a lot of luck to win a Tour. A little bit like Nibali.

 

[Oldermanish]

Did he ever say he wants to podium at the Tour? I thought they said to aim for top 5 and maybe a stage or 2.
It seems you're very emotional about Remco's weight. We all know he's fat but you're almost at the point of fatshaming.

"We all know he's fat but"
The guy successfully recovered from a serious structural injury, won a TT and has managed to do it with a healthy body to support that. That's muscle, dude. He can shed that if it matters.
Accusing someone of "fatshaming" while actually doing that must be a joke. Right?