Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[KoopaCycling]

2-3 months is not much?

All things considered, yes. 2 months ain't much.
He basically started from below zero after a looong winter break.

Honestly, it's hard not to follow Remco positivism/hubris after a good result (BP, Amstel), but in hindsight some realism was in clear order. It took the most of '21 to come back from Lombardia crash. This crash seemed just as bad.

It's not like he started training after a short break. He started training after a long break + suffering from an injury.

 

[red_flanders]

Outdoors cycling from February on. So give 2 and a halve months. I think that is time enough to perform better on climbs than today.

I think the issue is power + endurance, not peak power. He's just not fit enough and doesn't have a deep enough base to generate power for a long climb like today. Maps to what we saw in Brabantse Pijl versus the longer classics, plus the long climb today, and is what one would expect from a rider coming back from a long layoff straight into a hard block of racing.

I don't follow his calendar and plans in any detail, but I would expect to see him looking very good 2-3 weeks after this racing block, whenever that ends. He's put in a ton of big efforts. He'll reap the rewards soon.

 

[jmdirt]

Outdoors cycling from February on. So give 2 and a halve months. I think that is time enough to perform better on climbs than today.

I disagree.

 

[houtdffan]

A good training race for RE.
The interview I watched was fine...just a racer answering questions.
EDIT:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tr8xuWdvnXU

clear from the interview he was riding for Lecerf. He was going at lecerf's pace

Does Lecerf have a very good TT that we don't know about or something?

 

[KoopaCycling]

Remco on sporza. At least according to my own translation.

When I got dropped, it became a bit steeper. When i'm not at my best, I know It's hard to keep up the pace with the peloton when it's steep. I saw Lecerf having a hard time as well. So I asked him what pace he wanted and helped him to the top as fast as possible. I gave the maximum and could not do more. I can't perform miracles. Feeling was better than last week. It's not like I fully exploded. Raced pretty hard. 390-400 watts during the climb. had I followed the peloton for longer I might have exploded. When i'm not in my best shape I need to find my own pace faster. Like during the Dauphine last year. Now I've got more time left till the TdF, so overall i'm satisfied. Could not do more.

 

[laarsland]

Should accept that the injuries have left him with a too narrow base for a GC-tilt at the Tour. Target a few stage wins and build for a sustained peak in the fall rather than wear himself out. Could start to fear for his longevity

 

[Cycling111]

clear from the interview he was riding for Lecerf. He was going at lecerf's pace

Does Lecerf have a very good TT that we don't know about or something?

He was going for Lecerf because he saw he couldn't be with the best today.

If he had been with Vine and Carlos Rodriguez today, he could´ve won GC tomorrow. Do you think he's going to give up on winning the GC?

What he didn't do was drop back completely like Kung to rest for tomorrow's ITT. He opted to help Lecerf instead of finishing the stage five minutes behind thinking about tomorrow's ITT.

 

[Netserk]

Remco on sporza. At least according to my own translation.

When I got dropped, it became a bit steeper, when i'm not at my best I know It's hard to keep up the pace with the peloton when it's steep. I saw Lecerf having a hard time as well. So I asked him what pace he wanted and helped him to the top as fast as possible. I gave the maximum and could not do more. I can't perform miracles. Feeling was better than last week. It's not like I fully exploded. Raced pretty hard. 390-400 watts during the climb. had I followed the peloton for longer I might have exploded. When i'm not in my best shape I need to find my own pace faster. Like during the Dauphine last year. Now I've got more time left till the TdF, so overall i'm satisfied. Could not do more.

For July, it all looks good so far. It's also understandable if his mentality here is with July in mind, given his current shape.

 

[red_flanders]

Should accept that the injuries have left him with a too narrow base for a GC-tilt at the Tour. Target a few stage wins and build for a sustained peak in the fall rather than wear himself out. Could start to fear for his longevity

I would think with another 2 months of training he should be fine.

 

[Salvarani]

He was going for Lecerf because he saw he couldn't be with the best today.

If he had been with Vine and Carlos Rodriguez today, he could´ve won GC tomorrow. Do you think he's going to give up on winning the GC?

He could have definitely tried to limit the damage instead. Ride his own tempo.

Just strange to bow out without even giving it a try.

Given his position going into the stage and with ITT tomorrow.

Like he wasnt up for it too make bigger effort or want to be seen struggling to follow the others. Thats a weak mentality.

 

[KoopaCycling]

Should accept that the injuries have left him with a too narrow base for a GC-tilt at the Tour. Target a few stage wins and build for a sustained peak in the fall rather than wear himself out. Could start to fear for his longevity

All those calculated peaks can't be good for anyone's body. Especially the ones coming back from crashes. I don't think he should give up on this year TdF though.

Vingegaard and Pogacar will probably both show up looking great. But there is always a chance that Vingegaard lack of racing will show. Not likely but there is that possibility. Lets' say Vingegaard shows up looking well initially, gives Pogacar a fight. Pogacar looks for the margins , his crashing luck runs out , and has a crash from which he does not come back immediately. And Vingegaard fades during the third week with Pogacar gone. If Remco is there abouts he has a chance. Now i'm not wishing a crash on Pogacar, and i'm hoping Vingegaard comes back right. I'm just saying lesser riders than Evenepoel have won GT cause of random stuff, showing up and being almost good enoough to beat the best. Hell if Oscar Pereiro can win the TdF, so can a lot of other riders. Sometimes all you need is being in the right place at the right time when being just good enough.

Cause admittedly with Evenepoel not having a proper winter, he could not take a step forward. So this year 3rd place does indeed seem most possible if every piece falls where it should fall in a perfect world. But the world ain't perfect. The race needs to be ridden. Jusk ask Roglic.

 

[AmRacer]

He has much more time preparing for the Tour than he had last year after the crash.

 

[Gigs_98]

I don't know what to make of it. He decides to help Lecerf early on the climb. Drops 45 sec rather rapidly while watching if Lecerf can follow and then keeps dragging him and others for 7 km while slowly dropping a similar amount, still watching continuously if Lecerf follows. What would be his result if he would simply hang on without pulling? A 30-45 sec loss max? A potential 2nd place with a small chance of 1st if Almeida has an issue tomorrow? Who is making these decisions in the team? Remco himself?

He won the UAE tour and Poland.

I'm proud to have forgotten about those two.

 

[Berniece]

Outdoors cycling from February on. So give 2 and a halve months. I think that is time enough to perform better on climbs than today.

Most riders start training again in December, so add 2.5 months you are halfway February. I think his performance here would be very similar to a performance in Algarve, but then everyone rides at a lower level.

 

[KoopaCycling]

Most riders start training again in December, so add 2.5 months you are halfway February. I think his performance here would be very similar to a performance in Algarve, but then everyone rides at a lower level.

Yeah, i got similar vibes as well. Early season form, not spring classics form.

Another reason why I think he'll be good for TdF is cause Remco is like those pendulums. One moment you overestimate what he's capable of, then you start underestimating him, and he comes back swinging.

I will say after that crash. i'll take a podium at the Tdf. (If it's Pogacar and Vingegaard ahead of him). especially if he has another GT without a bad day. If he has another GT without a bad day I think that will go a long way for the future.

 

[Ripper]

I would think with another 2 months of training he should be fine.

Possibly!

But I do really wonder at the medical advice certain Belgian riders get. I'm not saying he should have tried rushing back too quickly, 'rebuilt' up his damaged parts, and racing earlier. But I do think he full on rested (as in no stationary bike work, no other aerobic work, not a whole lot of gym work) for longer than likely needed. I seem to recall Wout also taking a lot of time to recover.

And to anyone getting hot under the collar about these ideas ... I do have experience in healthcare and rehabilitation. This is not just random armchair quarterback musings.

While not directly related it is somewhat analogous to the science of concussion recovery. It used to be rest, rest, rest, and then rest some more. Don't overstimulate the brain, etc. It now is a much more structured and graded, but early, return to exercise and other stressors. And it appears to be much more successful.

 

[kingjr]

While not directly related it is somewhat analogous to the science of concussion recovery. It used to be rest, rest, rest, and then rest some more. Don't overstimulate the brain, etc. It now is a much more structured and graded, but early, return to exercise and other stressors. And it appears to be much more successful.

Interesting, I have had very similar experiences with seizures. Basically, the more active you are, the quicker you feel normal again.

 

[theyoungest]

Possibly!

But I do really wonder at the medical advice certain Belgian riders get. I'm not saying he should have tried rushing back too quickly, 'rebuilt' up his damaged parts, and racing earlier. But I do think he full on rested (as in no stationary bike work, no other aerobic work, not a whole lot of gym work) for longer than likely needed. I seem to recall Wout also taking a lot of time to recover.

And to anyone getting hot under the collar about these ideas ... I do have experience in healthcare and rehabilitation. This is not just random armchair quarterback musings.

I'm sure you have experience, but with top level athletes? Belgium isn't exactly a backwater in terms of healthcare and rehabilitation of athetes. Some of the most prominent experts in this field, certainly in pro cycling, are Belgian. Van Aert and Evenepoel have returned surprisingly quickly from injuries, but also not so quickly, depending on the injury.

They're still human though. At some point enough is enough. For Van Aert it seems that moment has unfortunately arrived where he can't quite reach his former level anymore. For Evenepoel it seems more like he needs a few more weeks of base training, because for a few days in Brabantse Pijl and Amstel, he actually was really strong.

 

[jmdirt]

But I do think he full on rested (as in no stationary bike work, no other aerobic work, not a whole lot of gym work) for longer than likely needed.

Based on?

 

[jmdirt]

Most riders start training again in December,

I guess there would have to be an agreement about what 'most' means before we could really debate this? Most of the racers who are racing in January? Most of the racers competing in the spring classics? Most of the entire platoon (irrelevant really)?

Also likely the need to discuss what 'training' means?

 

[wheresmybrakes]

All those calculated peaks can't be good for anyone's body. Especially the ones coming back from crashes. I don't think he should give up on this year TdF though.

Vingegaard and Pogacar will probably both show up looking great. But there is always a chance that Vingegaard lack of racing will show. Not likely but there is that possibility. Lets' say Vingegaard shows up looking well initially, gives Pogacar a fight. Pogacar looks for the margins , his crashing luck runs out , and has a crash from which he does not come back immediately. And Vingegaard fades during the third week with Pogacar gone. If Remco is there abouts he has a chance. Now i'm not wishing a crash on Pogacar, and i'm hoping Vingegaard comes back right. I'm just saying lesser riders than Evenepoel have won GT cause of random stuff, showing up and being almost good enoough to beat the best. Hell if Oscar Pereiro can win the TdF, so can a lot of other riders. Sometimes all you need is being in the right place at the right time when being just good enough.

Cause admittedly with Evenepoel not having a proper winter, he could not take a step forward. So this year 3rd place does indeed seem most possible if every piece falls where it should fall in a perfect world. But the world ain't perfect. The race needs to be ridden. Jusk ask Roglic.

You make it sound like there's only 3 riders in the Tour, and if Pog and Vingo have problems somewhere along the line, Remco has a chance. Lucky for him he can TT to give him a chance of Podium, because that's his best outcome unless he goes for a GT without the big 2.

 

[KoopaCycling]

You make it sound like there's only 3 riders in the Tour, and if Pog and Vingo have problems somewhere along the line, Remco has a chance. Lucky for him he can TT to give him a chance of Podium, because that's his best outcome unless he goes for a GT without the big 2.

I think you need to re-read what I posted, not to mention you are contradicting yourself in your own post.

 

[red_flanders]

Possibly!

But I do really wonder at the medical advice certain Belgian riders get. I'm not saying he should have tried rushing back too quickly, 'rebuilt' up his damaged parts, and racing earlier. But I do think he full on rested (as in no stationary bike work, no other aerobic work, not a whole lot of gym work) for longer than likely needed. I seem to recall Wout also taking a lot of time to recover.

And to anyone getting hot under the collar about these ideas ... I do have experience in healthcare and rehabilitation. This is not just random armchair quarterback musings.

While not directly related it is somewhat analogous to the science of concussion recovery. It used to be rest, rest, rest, and then rest some more. Don't overstimulate the brain, etc. It now is a much more structured and graded, but early, return to exercise and other stressors. And it appears to be much more successful.

Well I don't know about any of that. I'm just saying that with where he is now, and how much racing he's getting in, I think I would expect him to be on quite good form in 2 months.

 

[Ripper]

Based on?

I made it up ... just kidding!

I recall reading updates of various sorts where he claimed zero activity, then very gentle activity, etc. And a long time without riding. Of course, that does not mean it was entirely accurate and who knows what he was actually doing.

 

[Ripper]

Well I don't know about any of that. I'm just saying that with where he is now, and how much racing he's getting in, I think I would expect him to be on quite good form in 2 months.

I agree, the time is there. Then I went on a tangent