Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[houtdffan]

Some crazy takes in this thread:

• Remco is supremely talented; IMO, only Pogacar has his all around talent in the modern day peloton
• His palmares are already exceptional
• Those palmares reflect that he is an all-rounder, evidenced by a GT win, a Monument win (twice), and double gold in the Olympics
• However, unlike Pogacar, he is only the best in one discipline (hilly ITTs)
• He has dealt with serious setbacks, including crashes, illness, and possibly mismanagement
• This has undoubtedly reduced his palmares and caused them to lag behind his potential
• He is far from alone in this: Roglic, for example, in particular has faced as many or more setbacks (no privileged cycling background, late start, poor 2019 GT choice, crash in 2020 Dauphine before Tour, many more crashes, bad knee, shoulder surgery, illnesses, more crashes); Vingegaard has faced his setbacks; even Pogacar arguably (based on what we’ve seen since, or even say likely) lost the 2023 Tour due to a crash.
• Remco will return and win many more races, though the Tour is likely (not impossible)
• Evidence indicates he is best suited for WCITT, WCRR, Olympics ITT, Olympics RR, select monuments, and GTs with heavy flat ITT and no Pogacar or Vingegaard.
• The Tour should put in a 100km flat ITT next year.

not a 100km flat ITT, ~100km total of flat ITT, though if the giro would put in 80-90, I'd still recommend he do a giro/vuelta double next year

 

[Berniece]

Pogacar isn’t at lotto because he’s miles ahead of Remco as a grand tour rider.
How can you blame a team for a crash that’s the riders own fault ? If it’s a known dangerous descent, maybe he should have took it a bit easier ? 20 years olds are not allowed to ride Lombardy now? Wasn’t Pogacar winning the tour at 20…maybe he shouldn’t have been allowed? He might have crashed…
This is just an excuse for Remco. He could still have finished on the podium this year at the tour but decided to quit. The crashes and team is a bs excuse, he could have well finished third this year.l if he wanted to.

It’s like you didn’t understand a single point logic made about his development. And then you follow it up with saying he could’ve finished on the podium this TDF… in what world?

 

[Red Rick]

The obsession with 100km of ITT in the Tour parcours when he has far bigger issues I'll never get.

 

[Berniece]

The obsession with 100km of ITT in the Tour parcours when he has far bigger issues I'll never get.

Indeed, even if it’s a pan flat ITT with wind head on he won’t take 10min. Which he might lose now in the other stages.

 

[Charlyghoul]

It’s like you didn’t understand a single point logic made about his development. And then you follow it up with saying he could’ve finished on the podium this TDF… in what world?

He’s developed fine he just can’t climb with the very best.
He was third after two weeks , he had a bad day, he was still third…maybe he’s too good to fight for third?

 

[Berniece]

He’s developed fine he just can’t climb with the very best.
He was third after two weeks , he had a bad day, he was still third…maybe he’s too good to fight for third?

He had 3 bad days in a row…

 

[Charlyghoul]

He had 3 bad days in a row…

Still third. Just knew he has no chance against the top two and doesn’t want to fight for third. Would he quit if those two weren’t there and he was leading ?

 

[QueenStagiaire]

Still third. Just knew he has no chance against the top two and doesn’t want to fight for third. Would he quit if those two weren’t there and he was leading ?

He wasn‘t third virtually because he was dropped 100+ k from the finish. Of course he could have finished the stage but I doubt he could have gotten any GC result in this Tour.

 

[Charlyghoul]

He wasn‘t third virtually because he was dropped 100+ k from the finish. Of course he could have finished the stage but I doubt he could have gotten any GC result in this Tour.

Maybe , we don’t know now.
I think it’s right what some people said , he had bad legs but it’s more that his heads gone.
I think it’s a mistake for him to ride the tour next year, he needs to try win giro and come back to the tour later.

 

[Charlyghoul]

Vingegaards crash last year was massive and in April too, must have affected him a lot at that time of the season for the tour but came back and got second . Just gets on with it and accept that he’s second best at the moment. Remco needs to accept he’s third best and deal with it or just not bother with the tour if he can’t handle fighting for third.

 

[Berniece]

Still third. Just knew he has no chance against the top two and doesn’t want to fight for third. Would he quit if those two weren’t there and he was leading ?

What does finishing third have to do with it? He was clearly on the verge of collapse. Should he have completely emptied the tank and risked ending his season? By that logic, maybe MVDP should keep racing too, instead of stopping now—he still has to fight for the green jersey, even with pneumonia, right? And Evenepoel should just push his body to the limit and crawl to 25th place in the GC?

 

[motty89]

I'm not an evenepoel fan but some of the takes on here saying that he's not a gc riders are pretty hilarious. I'm interested to see how he does on another team as tbh I don't trust soudal to prepare him for stage racing and I'm not sure if he's just a really fragile rider or it's an issue with his coaching/nutrition etc.

 

[Nerlo]

Remco is a weird one. Apart from Tadej, he is probably the most talented rider in the peloton. Yet you always have the feeling that it’s not quite coming together. Maybe a change of environment will be good, but I have a feeling he will retire young

 

[Red Rick]

Equating different crashes to same circumstances and conclusion never makes sense.

 

[houtdffan]

was it a full on heat stroke like at tds 2022?

That would explain why he had nothing left the next couple of days. Same as happened to him at TDS 2022. Similar to when Ullrich was finally able to drop Lance

He was trying to stuff ice down his shirt before the mountains, a sign he was overheated.

In real time, it seemed once he was able to cool his body, he was able to climb at his normal pace again. That said, it took a LOT out of him having to chase and he may have overheated again on Hautacam

If so, this is a damning look on QS for letting it happen again. It's like these guys never learn

 

[Charlyghoul]

What does finishing third have to do with it? He was clearly on the verge of collapse. Should he have completely emptied the tank and risked ending his season? By that logic, maybe MVDP should keep racing too, instead of stopping now—he still has to fight for the green jersey, even with pneumonia, right? And Evenepoel should just push his body to the limit and crawl to 25th place in the GC?

Well why even start the race if he’s feeling so bad ?
He’s performed fine this season and was third after two weeks, I don’t believe he was physically suffering that badly. The shoulder can’t be that bad if he’s performing as he is, he doesn’t look in pain on the bike, and he wasn’t ill, he’s mentally cracked because he can’t beat pog and vingegaard.

 

[Berniece]

Well why even start the race if he’s feeling so bad ?
He’s performed fine this season and was third after two weeks, I don’t believe he was physically suffering that badly. The shoulder can’t be that bad if he’s performing as he is, he doesn’t look in pain on the bike, and he wasn’t ill, he’s mentally cracked because he can’t beat pog and vingegaard.

Yeah that’s what everyone is saying. Why let him start.

 

[Red Rick]

was it a full on heat stroke like at tds 2022?

I don't believe heat stroke fits at all with coming back from getting dropped after the Soulor and then fighting back on Hautacam as well.

 

[Berniece]

I’m just tired of the excuses.
He was too young to ride Lombardy, his team is terrible, the shoulder, he can’t train one day since spring, what complete nonsense. The stuff he comes out with it’s like he has some kind of debilitating disease and can’t get out of bed, just turns up at the tour and wins the tt.

Just to reiterate, Evenepoel himself mentioned that the shoulder isn’t affecting his racing. Are you overlooking that point? Considering your active presence in this thread, I’m surprised you seem to have missed it.

 

[Charlyghoul]

Just to reiterate, Evenepoel himself mentioned that the shoulder isn’t affecting his racing. Are you overlooking that point? Considering your active presence in this thread, I’m surprised you seem to have missed it.

Thats maybe a bit harsh to Remco yes, but his fans on this thread have been talking about the shoulder like it’s a huge thing and he himself says it isn’t ? Pog and Vin you never seem to hear this lingering talk about injuries but they both have had them too. Roglic as well. And things like he shouldn’t be racing Lombardy at a young age, it’s just silly.

 

[Berniece]

Thats maybe a bit harsh to Remco yes, but his fans on this thread have been talking about the shoulder like it’s a huge thing and he himself says it isn’t ? Pog and Vin you never seem to hear this lingering talk about injuries but they both have had them too. Roglic as well. And things like he shouldn’t be racing Lombardy at a young age, it’s just silly.

Logic didn't say he shouldn't have raced Lombardy. He said they should've prepared him better for it.

 

[Charlyghoul]

Not much logic behind it all.
But we all understood your point Charlyghoul. You don't like Remco and are enjoying emphasizing that now that he's in the slums.

Take your victory lap in your dislike of him.

I don’t like or dislike him, same as all of the current top riders.
What I and others don’t like is his fans and maybe him as well cant seem to accept where his level is and come up with reasons for him supposedly underperforming.
This doesn’t seem to happen with anyone else in the peloton to the same extent
He comes from a privileged sporting background, from cycling royalty stock in fact, that’s what makes this stuff even worse.

 

[Charlyghoul]

He’s hardly in the slums, he’s still winning big races, will surely win more big races this season, abandoned the tour while in third, where he finished last season, (his best tour season) , but there’s a rhetoric like he’s had a total capitulation this year, all of a sudden he can’t train etc, he’s having a horrendous season, I don’t see it , that’s just the level he is at.

 

[Berniece]

He’s hardly in the slums, he’s still winning big races, will surely win more big races this season, abandoned the tour while in third, where he finished last season, (his best tour season) , but there’s a rhetoric like he’s had a total capitulation this year, all of a sudden he can’t train etc, he’s having a horrendous season, I don’t see it , that’s just the level he is at.

It's very weird you don't see a difference in performances between Evenepoel this year and last year at the TDF.

 

[Jumbo Visma Fan :)]

Probably annoyed his teams mountain riders actually started to ride after he abandoned.