Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Peyroteo94]

great post.

I actually think remco could totally be on par with pog pre-2024.

it is what happened since then that makes it impossible -- pog's truly ridiculous improvement.

vingo is a diffrent beast - historically high VO2 and light as a feather -- he was always to climb better than remco. so it would depend on remco coming in in 2022 Vuelta shape and having a fair amount of flat ITT. I still think vingo would have him by a couple of minutes, but it would be good traditional fight between the TTer who can climb and the climber who can TT.

pog just makes it all ridiculous now.

interesting that Netflix showed pog being pretty devastated by the trouncing at Combloux ITT. and since then the strange transformation has taken place.

No, he couldn't be on par with Pogacar 2022 or 2023 (in the high mountains). Forget it. Pogacar and Vingegaard in 2022 were 2 steps above Remco 2022. Just because he won the Vuelta,it doesn't mean he would have a chance in the Tour.

@Mayomaniac this is why I'm saying he is lying. With a broken rib, he doesn't win stages at all. We just look to Almeida with a broken rib and he was getting dropped on flat roads.

 

[Berniece]

Again, another incoherence. "Makes no sense to lie". How many times did he lie this year? Wasn't Remco who said he was racing the Nationals to get that little spark to be at his best in the Tour? Today he is writing a post saying he never felt good this season and was always in a rush.
This year, he lied on multiple occasions and he is very incoherent in what he says before a race and after a race.
You can believe in what you want. I just don't buy it specially when facts show he already lied to us (fans).

I don't see how racing NC to get a little spark for TDF can't be combined with his body feeling fatigued. They might really have thought he needed that push for his body.

I do think they don't tell us everything when something is wrong. No one does that. Would tell your opponents that your weak which they will try to exploit. I've never seen him lie afterwards about why he was ***. He doesn't make things up after the facts.

 

[KoopaCycling]

He means an improved Version of Remco, not remco in 2022. But an improved version could battle with Pogacar of 2022.
Before he went nuclear.

 

[Berniece]

@Mayomaniac this is why I'm saying he is lying. With a broken rib, he doesn't win stages at all. We just look to Almeida with a broken rib and he was getting dropped on flat roads.

But Evenepoel broke a rib 1-2 weeks before, and couldn't there be a difference in which rib you broke and the impact from it on your performance?

 

[bah]

Again, another incoherence. "Makes no sense to lie". How many times did he lie this year? Wasn't Remco who said he was racing the Nationals to get that little spark to be at his best in the Tour? Today he is writing a post saying he never felt good this season and was always in a rush.
This year, he lied on multiple occasions and he is very incoherent in what he says before a race and after a race.
You can believe in what you want. I just don't buy it specially when facts show he already lied to us (fans).

I mean, I guess it depends on what you mean by "lying"...is a bit of hyperbole "lying"? Was Vingegaard "lying" today when he said the Tour wasn't over? You do understand that these are professional atheletes who need to say the right things and not appear defeatist?

 

[kingjr]

He said he broke a rib before the Tour. There are 2 ways to see it:
- He really is a beast and suffers like no one. A broken rib and he was still strong in the first week. Comparing his performance to Almeida is laughable.
- Or he is lying.

I bet in option number 2. I don't believe Soudal would let him race the Tour and despite his subpar performance, he still rode a good first week (was very hard and intense).
This kid really needs to heal his head, way more than his legs.

Wait, you're saying every broken rib is the same?

 

[AlpRaid]

He means an improved Version of Remco, not remco in 2022. But an improved version could battle with Pogacar of 2022.
Before he went nuclear.

bingo.

as has already been noted, remco 2024 TDF numbers could have rivaled Pog in 2022 and 2023.

it is the really mind-blowing jump pog has made since start of 2024 that makes it impossible...

 

[bah]

great post.

one cab=veat, however. I actually think remco could totally be on par with pog, the pre-2024 version, that had bad days and would get dropped once in a while.

it is what happened since then that makes it impossible -- pog's crazy-a$$ improvement.

vingo is a different beast - historically/naturally high VO2 and light as a feather -- he was always to climb better than remco. so it would depend on remco coming in in 2022 Vuelta shape and having a fair amount of flat ITT. I still think vingo would have him by a couple of minutes, but it would be good traditional fight between the TTer who can climb and the climber who can TT.

pog just makes it all ridiculous now.

interesting that Netflix showed pog being pretty devastated by the trouncing at Combloux ITT. and since then the strange transformation has taken place.

Agreed, but a discussion for another forum...

 

[Peyroteo94]

bingo.

as has already been noted, remco 2024 TDF numbers could have rivaled Pog in 2022 and 2023.

it is the really mind-blowing jump pog has made since start of 2024 that makes it impossible...

According you, Vingegaard didn't make that leap and he still is miles better. It's not just Pogacar.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Wait, you're saying every broken rib is the same?

It isn't but I know what doctors say about broken ribs and what riders who already had broken ribs say about riding with a broken rib. They all claim it is almost like a knife piercing your body in every breath you take.

 

[kingjr]

It isn't but I know what doctors say about broken ribs and what riders who already had broken ribs say about riding with a broken rib. They all claim it is almost like a knife piercing your body in every breath you take.

I think it very much depends on the type of fracture. Like, people who are legally blind can still see something.

 

[AlpRaid]

According you, Vingegaard didn't make that leap and he still is miles better. It's not just Pogacar.

vingo still has bad days despite an extraordinary VO2 to boot.

cheers.

 

[Peyroteo94]

vingo still has bad days despite an extraordinary VO2 to boot.

cheers.

In what does this change anything from what I said?

 

[zlev11]

He also dropped Onley who might finish on the podium this year. So what's your point?

you better check the results, he did not drop Onley anywhere in this race.

edit: oh you mean last year lol. yeah he dropped a 21 year old guy not even riding GC in his first ever grand tour. clutching at big straws with that one.

 

[red_flanders]

I think it very much depends on the type of fracture. Like, people who are legally blind can still see something.

Can verify that any rib fracture will impact cycling performance. The body uses resources to heal. Other things suffer.

It's really not about managing the pain, that comes quickly enough.

 

[Oldman]

Wait, you're saying every broken rib is the same?

Thanks. I found it incredible that the "medical experts" weighing in are this clueless. Same folks catagorize any improvement Pogacar (or anyone else) as "strange....extraterrestrial..." in thinly veiled implications. None of it has anything to do with Remco, himself.
I'm still wondering how many here think Remco was a lock for 3rd and would have buried all other contenders. Give him a break.

 

[FroomeWagon]

Does anyone have Remco climbing data (w/kg) from previous grand tours so that it can be compared to the other GC riders?

I think that could go a long way to solving this argument.

 

[Oldman]

It isn't but I know what doctors say about broken ribs and what riders who already had broken ribs say about riding with a broken rib. They all claim it is almost like a knife piercing your body in every breath you take.

It certainly does. In my younger days I won our regional TT championship (40km) on a flat course a week after I broke a rib and collarbone. I didn't do my best but just good enough.
Had to be helped off my bike and didn't ride for a week and the rib was the worst of the two. It's can be hard to breath quickly and recover to lower pulse rates because nothing in the core will relax after you start stressing the area. Cracked ribs, cartilage....you can tough that out but not the same as a broken/displaced rib.

 

[Oldman]

Does anyone have Remco climbing data (w/kg) from previous grand tours so that it can be compared to the other GC riders?

I think that could go a long way to solving this argument.

Has anyone ever actually had source data from GC contenders that did well? Anyone? Conjecture aside I doubt anyone shares actual data outside of a team.

 

[Red Rick]

Has anyone ever actually had source data from GC contenders that did well? Anyone? Conjecture aside I doubt anyone shares actual data outside of a team.

Evenepoel said his own values of that Tour - and I'm pretty sure they were below the estimates. His trainer also said they were overestimated last year.

Which makes sense cause you can literally see the tailwind on the flags on Isola and PdB.

 

[Cycling111]

He wasn't injured at the Dauphine, and Lipowtiz was superior to him. It seems self-delusional to think he would have been superior to Vingegaard, not to mention challenging Pogacar for the Tour

 

[Berniece]

you better check the results, he did not drop Onley anywhere in this race.

edit: oh you mean last year lol. yeah he dropped a 21 year old guy not even riding GC in his first ever grand tour. clutching at big straws with that one.

Yeah, because Evenepoel being dropped by 80 riders is completely normal and a reason to say last year wasn’t special

 

[peterfin]

Does anyone have Remco climbing data (w/kg) from previous grand tours so that it can be compared to the other GC riders?

I think that could go a long way to solving this argument.

Performance Index Cycling - Watts2Win - Best performers in 2025

The ultimate database of cycling performance

watts2win.eu

Not ideal but at least it can be used for relative comparisons. Remco did 3x 6.4 w/kg for 40 minutes in 2024. This year he never came close to this.

 

[Eddy Evenepoel]

He wasn't injured at the Dauphine, and Lipowtiz was superior to him. It seems self-delusional to think he would have been superior to Vingegaard, not to mention challenging Pogacar for the Tour

Who says this?

 

[FroomeWagon]

Performance Index Cycling - Watts2Win - Best performers in 2025

The ultimate database of cycling performance

watts2win.eu

Not ideal but at least it can be used for relative comparisons. Remco did 3x 6.4 w/kg for 40 minutes in 2024. This year he never came close to this.

Wow ... what a great site. Talk about going down the Rabbit Hole.

I asked ChatGPT to give me some peak climbing numbers at the Grand Tours over the recent years. I don't know how accurate it is and I ran out of credits to refine the list. Anyways here is what ChatGPT says FWIW.