Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Red Rick]

Winners' mentality is typically just a catch all phrase for "I like this guy and he wins a lot." when usually the winning is 90% down to ability and less than 10% down to mentality.

 

[KoopaCycling]

Dude, sporza released a video of that Paris nice. anyone can tell the truth by watching that youtube video.
I'll not waste a second further on your lies. I find it baffling you would choose to stoop this low.
But i guess i should not be surprised by some people on this forum. No self-respect at all imo. To lie this bad and so bold.

Guess i now got 3 people on my block list. no time for liars.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Winners' mentality is typically just a catch all phrase for "I like this guy and he wins a lot." when usually the winning is 90% down to ability and less than 10% down to mentality.

100% this. One guy, I really think, has a winning mentality (all or nothing) is Carapaz. He doesn't care if he explodes, he will always try to win.

 

[Netserk]

Dude, sporza released a video of that Paris nice. anyone can tell the truth by watching that youtube video.
I'll not waste a second further on your lies. I find it baffling you would choose to stoop this low.
But i guess i should not be surprised by some people on this forum. No self-respect at all imo. To lie this bad and so bold.

You set a very high bar for winning mentality. Vingegaard doesn't have it.

So PN must have involved something from Evenepoel that Vingegaard never showed. I don't see it.

I think Contador raced with an extraordinary amount of winning mentality. His losses in PN were not like Evenepoel's.

 

[peterfin]

Gemini: "A winner's mentality is a powerful mindset characterized by self-belief, resilience, and a relentless pursuit of improvement that allows individuals to overcome obstacles and achieve their goals. Key traits include taking responsibility, persevering through challenges, and viewing setbacks as opportunities to learn rather than failures. This mindset is about more than just winning, but about finding purpose and developing the drive to fulfill it consistently." Remco is a clear example of somebody with winner's mentality and his 6 gold medals at juniors (NC, EC, WC) and 21 medals at pro championships in just 5 years exemplifies it. It doesn't need any argument to the contrary. Facts are facts.

 

[Netserk]

Gemini: "A winner's mentality is a powerful mindset characterized by self-belief, resilience, and a relentless pursuit of improvement that allows individuals to overcome obstacles and achieve their goals. Key traits include taking responsibility, persevering through challenges, and viewing setbacks as opportunities to learn rather than failures. This mindset is about more than just winning, but about finding purpose and developing the drive to fulfill it consistently." Remco is a clear example of somebody with winner's mentality and his 6 gold medals at juniors (NC, EC, WC) and 21 medals at pro championships in just 5 years exemplifies it. It doesn't need any argument to the contrary. Facts are facts.

We agree that it also applies to Vingegaard?

 

[Red Rick]

taking responsibilit persevering through challenges,

Gemini: "Evenepoel ain't got no winning mentality"

 

[Netserk]

I've seen someone comment along the lines that Remco & his fans need not bother with EUC RR cause Pogacar will smash that as well. probably. But remco should still go out there and compete. And his fans should cheer and hope for the win. that is sports. If i wanted someone that rode not to lose and is ultimately fine with being second i'd be a Van aert or Vingegaard fan. I'm not. I cheer for Remco cause he has a winning mentality.

This set the standard for winning mentality.

Evenepoel in PN supposedly didn't ride not to lose and wasn't fine with being second. He had a winning mentality.

Vingegaard didn't meet that standard. Supposedly he did nothing this year comparable to Evenepoel in PN.

 

[Berniece]

We agree that it also applies to Vingegaard?

Definitely, his 2024 season showed that.

 

[peterfin]

Gemini: "Evenepoel ain't got no winning mentality"

That's just cherry picking to fit your narrative.

 

[peterfin]

We agree that it also applies to Vingegaard?

Yes, Vingegaard has shown a winner's mentality too. His comeback if that injury in 2024 was amazing.

 

[kingjr]

Wait, did we get here because someone argued Vingegaard doesn't have a winning mentality?

 

[Netserk]

Wait, did we get here because someone argued Vingegaard doesn't have a winning mentality?

Apparently, arguing that Evenepoel doesn't have a greater winning mentality than Vingegaard in stage races makes me a bad and bold liar without any self-respect.

 

[Red Rick]

That's just cherry picking to fit your narrative.

Naturally Gemini craps out the standard motivational speech stuff out for 'winning mentality' and we're really only talking in circles because people always equate mentality with outcome when the athlete they like wins and talk about poor menality when the athlete they dislike loses.

Why? because it's inherently *** lazy.

So within that, if you're going to use specific definitions of winning mentality, I'm going to be able to give counterexamples to show why it's wrong. And complaining about cherry picking itself is just an often used crutch for poor argumentation anyway.

In this case, Evenepoel blaming things outside of his own control for losses is not a one time event. It's something he does all the time.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

@Netserk Vingegaard does not have the same winner's mentality. No idea how a dedicated Vingegaard supporter can state that with a straight face. That's like Evenepoel supporters claiming Evenepoel always remains levelheaded. Both statements are equally absurd.

Examples? Remember the Bambi nickname you gave Evenepoel and why? Well, last year all three of them were ahead of the peloton in the gravel stage in the Tour. Remember who didn't want to ride? It wasn't the guy who crashed in every corner on the gravel during his first pro season at Adriatica Ionica. It wasn't the guy who made a spectacle of himself during the 2021 Giro gravel stage. It wasn't the guy who got nicknamed Bambi by you. No, it was the reigning TDF champion who peed his pants. Remember Itzulia 2022, when Alaphilippe went on the attack and Vingegaard was in his group, with both Roglic and Evenepoel behind in the peloton? Remember who didn't want to ride? Same dude. That's why people say he doesn't ride like a winner. He rides very calculated and will leave it to others to do the heavy lifting. It may be smart, but it's not what riding like a winner is. He doesn't go to races where he knows his chances are slim, not exactly a winners mentality. He will try to attack only as a last resort.

You are mistaking his perseverance, which he undoubtedly has as evident from overcoming adversity and maximising his chances against the odds, with winner mentality.

 

[Netserk]

@Netserk Vingegaard does not have the same winner's mentality. No idea how a dedicated Vingegaard supporter can state that with a straight face. That's like Evenepoel supporters claiming Evenepoel always remains levelheaded. Both statements are equally absurd.

Examples? Remember the Bambi nickname you gave Evenepoel and why? Well, last year all three of them were ahead of the peloton in the gravel stage in the Tour. Remember who didn't want to ride? It wasn't the guy who crashed every corner during his first pro season at Adriatica Ionica. It wasn't the guy who made a spectacle of himself during the 2021 Giro. It wasn't the guy who got nicknamed Bambi by you. No, it was the reigning TDF champion who peed his pants. Remember Itzulia 2022, when Alaphilippe went on the attack and Vingegaard was in his group, with both Roglic and Evenepoel behind in the peloton? Remember who didn't want to ride? Same dude. That's why people say he doesn't ride like a winner. He rides very calculated and will leave it to others to do the heavy lifting. It may be smart, but it's not what riding like a winner is.

You are mistaking his perseverance, which he undoubtedly has as evident from overcoming adversity and maximising his chances against the odds, with winner mentality.

I remember the gravel well, and I don't think Vingegaard peed his pants. He defended himself well and rode optimally--in pursuit of the overall victory.

Why would a winner ride away with his rivals from Jorgenson and Laporte?

Being mindless is not being brave.

 

[Netserk]

It's like arguing that Evenepoel shouldn't pace himself on climbs, but go with the speed of the best climber until he blows up. Otherwise he is peeing his pants.

 

[Peyroteo94]

@Netserk Vingegaard does not have the same winner's mentality. No idea how a dedicated Vingegaard supporter can state that with a straight face. That's like Evenepoel supporters claiming Evenepoel always remains levelheaded. Both statements are equally absurd.

Examples? Remember the Bambi nickname you gave Evenepoel and why? Well, last year all three of them were ahead of the peloton in the gravel stage in the Tour. Remember who didn't want to ride? It wasn't the guy who crashed in every corner on the gravel during his first pro season at Adriatica Ionica. It wasn't the guy who made a spectacle of himself during the 2021 Giro gravel stage. It wasn't the guy who got nicknamed Bambi by you. No, it was the reigning TDF champion who peed his pants. Remember Itzulia 2022, when Alaphilippe went on the attack and Vingegaard was in his group, with both Roglic and Evenepoel behind in the peloton? Remember who didn't want to ride? Same dude. That's why people say he doesn't ride like a winner. He rides very calculated and will leave it to others to do the heavy lifting. It may be smart, but it's not what riding like a winner is. He doesn't go to races where he knows his chances are slim, not exactly a winners mentality. He will try to attack only as a last resort.

You are mistaking his perseverance, which he undoubtedly has as evident from overcoming adversity and maximising his chances against the odds, with winner mentality.

This is absurd. This is like saying Pidock should work as much as Pogacar in SB to be considered a "winner". In this case, having a winner mentality is clearly not work with a much better rider in order to get a chance of winning.

Edit: So like @Netserk said, that is a difference between mindless and "winner".
Vingegaard was smart to not race with Pogacar. On the other hand, Remco was mindless because he was willing to work with a much better rider, like we all saw later in the stage.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

It's like arguing that Evenepoel shouldn't pace himself on climbs, but go with the speed of the best climber until he blows up. Otherwise he is peeing his pants.

I made an addition to my post:
He doesn't go to races where he knows his chances are slim, not exactly a winners mentality. He will try to attack only as a last resort.

That's very different from Evenepoel or Pogacar.

 

[Netserk]

I made an addition to my post:
He doesn't go to races where he knows his chances are slim, not exactly a winners mentality. He will try to attack only as a last resort.

That's very different from Evenepoel or Pogacar.

Was Marie-Blanque a last resort? Tourmalet the day after?

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

This is absurd. This is like saying Pidock should work as much as Pogacar in SB to be considered a "winner". In this case, having a winner mentality is clearly not work with a much better rider in order to get a chance of winning.

There is a difference between not taking equal pulls, and flat out refusing to cooperate and waiting for the babysit to arrive.

 

[kingjr]

I think having a winner's mentality is showing a willingness to do whatever it takes to win (excluding illegal means), how exactly that plays out depends on each individual rider and circumstances.

 

[Netserk]

I think having a winner's mentality is showing a willingness to do whatever it takes to win (excluding illegal means), how exactly that plays out depends on each individual rider and circumstances.

Vino and Contador are the first that comes to my mind.

 

[peterfin]

Naturally Gemini craps out the standard motivational speech stuff out for 'winning mentality' and we're really only talking in circles because people always equate mentality with outcome when the athlete they like wins and talk about poor menality when the athlete they dislike loses.

Why? because it's inherently *** lazy.

So within that, if you're going to use specific definitions of winning mentality, I'm going to be able to give counterexamples to show why it's wrong. And complaining about cherry picking itself is just an often used crutch for poor argumentation anyway.

In this case, Evenepoel blaming things outside of his own control for losses is not a one time event. It's something he does all the time.

You are mixing up his extroverted character with his mentality. Sometimes he is right, sometimes he overreacts and sometimes he is wrong and you need to give him a moment to see things clearly.

 

[Extinction]

@Netserk Vingegaard does not have the same winner's mentality. No idea how a dedicated Vingegaard supporter can state that with a straight face. That's like Evenepoel supporters claiming Evenepoel always remains levelheaded. Both statements are equally absurd.

Examples? Remember the Bambi nickname you gave Evenepoel and why? Well, last year all three of them were ahead of the peloton in the gravel stage in the Tour. Remember who didn't want to ride? It wasn't the guy who crashed in every corner on the gravel during his first pro season at Adriatica Ionica. It wasn't the guy who made a spectacle of himself during the 2021 Giro gravel stage. It wasn't the guy who got nicknamed Bambi by you. No, it was the reigning TDF champion who peed his pants. Remember Itzulia 2022, when Alaphilippe went on the attack and Vingegaard was in his group, with both Roglic and Evenepoel behind in the peloton? Remember who didn't want to ride? Same dude. That's why people say he doesn't ride like a winner. He rides very calculated and will leave it to others to do the heavy lifting. It may be smart, but it's not what riding like a winner is. He doesn't go to races where he knows his chances are slim, not exactly a winners mentality. He will try to attack only as a last resort.

You are mistaking his perseverance, which he undoubtedly has as evident from overcoming adversity and maximising his chances against the odds, with winner mentality.

Yea, and you forgot to mention Almeida at this last Vuelta, after Vingeggard sat on his wheel for the enth time, saying that "eh, sure, Vingeggard never wants to pull." When Vingeggard does some classics or a Worlds with more than 5000 meters of elevation (or any Worlds for that matter), I'll start to consider him having a similar "winner's mentality" as Evenepoel. I think there is confusion about equating winning the Tour twice against Pogacar with having a hors categorie winner's mentality. Let's face it, any one at his level has one, but Evenepoel's is simply off the charts. He just can't stand losing, which destroys him particularly when he cannot beat two better climbers. To a fault, because I think particularly Pogacar has gotten into his head. Remco has, beyond all his misfortune (serious crashes and illnesses), suffered immensely, because he has not achieved what his winner's mentality (reinforced by having been the best junior in the history of the sport, who then immediatly started winning as a pro) thought he should have by now. That's because he unexpectedly (at the time many, without baseless reason, thought the "new Merckx" had arrived) came up against two better climbers and one better all-rounder. Let's see if Bora can close the gap, which ties into the investment gamble I referred to up-thread, but which evidently nobody thought worthy of commenting upon.