Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[red_flanders]

"Remco won't improve by another 15%, but I really believe that in the one-day races – I'm not talking about stage races – he can become Pogačar's equal." - his new sports director

Hey @proffate just saw this comment and moved it here if that's OK with you. Pretty interesting comments. 15% seems like...a LOT to expect anyone to improve at this level, ever. Not something I'd love to see my sporting director say out loud, the second part. I guess it's the Belgian frankness coming out, but yeesh.

I don't think whether he can beat Pogi is the metric for will he do the Tour this year. Beating him is wildly unlikely. But same goes for everyone else, so...I guess we'll still see a bunch of GC guys out there competing in the biggest race of the year.

 

[AmRacer]

Not a huge difference tho, if any.
Jonas had at the end of the 2022 season 3x 2nd (Dauphine, Itulzia and Tirreno) + 6th (Itulzia) and 8th (Pologne). If we just look at the 4 first that gives an average position of 3,0. Remcos 4 best results in the big one week stages gives 2,75.
But one cant argue in favor of Remco given what Jonas did after 2022.

Onley firsts count

 

[Shortcut]

I think it's just the term 'crazy bad' that some people take offence with.

I can't speak for everyone but personally I agree that his results in the big one-week stage races could/should have been better by now (even if there are some explanations for some results) but there's a whole lot of middle ground before calling someone 'crazy bad' at something.

I hope he puts this discussion to bed next season but honestly I'd actually rather have him win MSR or even a third LBL than a big one-week stage race if I would have to choose.

Yes i did use term "crazy bad", and of course i didn't mean it like insult but crazy bad for Remco. He probably doesn't even care about those races but maybe that is problem. We have seen him how good he can climb when he is all in. So i think schedule like T-A, Romandie,Giro for one year would be good for him. Maybe try LBL too if he doesn't mess with his climbing form.

 

[peterfin]

Yes i did use term "crazy bad", and of course i didn't mean it like insult but crazy bad for Remco. He probably doesn't even care about those races but maybe that is problem. We have seen him how good he can climb when he is all in. So i think schedule like T-A, Romandie,Giro for one year would be good for him. Maybe try LBL too if he doesn't mess with his climbing form.

He should 'try' LBL?

 

[Shortcut]

He should 'try' LBL?

Why do you take everything out of context? "Crazy bad", "try" and so on. Yes "try" at this point, i can't write "win it" since it was 3 years ago last time he won against Pogacar at one day race. I think at this point winning (if miracle happens) one more LBL doesn't change much but winning Giro does.

 

[AmRacer]

Why do you take everything out of context? "Crazy bad", "try" and so on. Yes "try" at this point, i can't write "win it" since it was 3 years ago last time he won against Pogacar at one day race. I think at this point winning (if miracle happens) one more LBL doesn't change much but winning Giro does.

Not gonna happen 2026, Jonas will race the Giro

 

[peterfin]

Why do you take everything out of context? "Crazy bad", "try" and so on. Yes "try" at this point, i can't write "win it" since it was 3 years ago last time he won against Pogacar at one day race. I think at this point winning (if miracle happens) one more LBL doesn't change much but winning Giro does.

You sounded as if he has anything to prove by riding LBL.

If the Giro becomes his main target, he should focus on that. He can try MSR and RVV in the spring if that works for him in the build up. That would be something.

 

[red_flanders]

Not gonna happen 2026, Jonas will race the Giro

Huge challenge but I don't think he's unbeatable.

 

[AmRacer]

Huge challenge but I don't think he's unbeatable.

Nope, Pogi does it most of the time but not always.

 

[Berniece]

I think riding for RBH and training under their staff will do wonders for him. He’ll win a monument, GT and big stage race next season

 

[proffate]

Hey @proffate just saw this comment and moved it here if that's OK with you. Pretty interesting comments. 15% seems like...a LOT to expect anyone to improve at this level, ever. Not something I'd love to see my sporting director say out loud, the second part. I guess it's the Belgian frankness coming out, but yeesh.

I don't think whether he can beat Pogi is the metric for will he do the Tour this year. Beating him is wildly unlikely. But same goes for everyone else, so...I guess we'll still see a bunch of GC guys out there competing in the biggest race of the year.

yeah 15% is a lot, but realistically he's not 15% behind Pog in any case, at least if you're talking about FTP watts/kg. Maybe he thinks Remco can get almost 15% more UCI points?

 

[HashRouge]

I think riding for RBH and training under their staff will do wonders for him. He’ll win a monument, GT and big stage race next season

I'd love to see him do that. However, I still really want to see him to ride the Tour again - at the moment, I'd rather he did that than the Giro or Vuelta in an attempt to avoid Pogacar/ Vingegaard. He'll be 26 next year and has only finished the Tour once, I'm sure that both he and Bora will be keen to see how he performs there with a different team and new training set up. Also, for all the moaning about the lack of flat TT KM in the 2026 Tour, the general opinion I'm hearing is that the route is actually easier than this year's. Surely fewer MTFs would be good for Remco?

 

[Berniece]

I'd love to see him do that. However, I still really want to see him to ride the Tour again - at the moment, I'd rather he did that than the Giro or Vuelta in an attempt to avoid Pogacar/ Vingegaard. He'll be 26 next year and has only finished the Tour once, I'm sure that both he and Bora will be keen to see how he performs there with a different team and new training set up. Also, for all the moaning about the lack of flat TT KM in the 2026 Tour, the general opinion I'm hearing is that the route is actually easier than this year's. Surely fewer MTFs would be good for Remco?

As long as Pogacar is so much better in the mountains the amount of ITT kilometers or MTF’s doesn’t matter. If he would lose the TDF by 1-2min, sure then you can say we could use a 50km ITT. But he lost the ‘24 edition by 10min…

 

[Red Rick]

Huge challenge but I don't think he's unbeatable.

Rode around with illness for a significant part of the Vuelta after doing the Tour and still won it without much trouble.

 

[Berniece]

Rode around with illness for a significant part of the Vuelta after doing the Tour and still won it without much trouble.

Pidcock was third

 

[Salvarani]

Rode around with illness for a significant part of the Vuelta after doing the Tour and still won it without much trouble.

Question is how motivated he still is in a year or so. Like winning Giro is most likely a big goal, so he would have won all three GTs.

I dont know how long he sticks around and cares about things after that, but who knows.

Anyway, for next season. He shouldnt be too far off from the past seasons and therefore having an advantage over Remco. I would imagine at least. He "only" has to drop him big once on a tough mountain and then ride calculated, which I think would be a very likely outcome.

Remco would need to improve 2024 Tour-form by some to beat him. Not impossible, but for next season Vinge is likely still ahead. After that, I dont know.

 

[Red Rick]

Pidcock was third

Yes, so he beat a strong field at the Vuelta.

 

[Netserk]

Pidcock was third

Thomas was 3rd in the 2022 Tour. Didn't make Pogi or Vingegaard any worse.

 

[red_flanders]

Rode around with illness for a significant part of the Vuelta after doing the Tour and still won it without much trouble.

He did ride with illness. I wouldn't personally describe beating Almeida by 1:16 as "not much trouble", but either way, I would comfortably stand by my comment that beating him would be "huge challenge" but it's not like he's "unbeatable".

There might be (IMO) riders more able to challenge him than Almeida in the Giro. I think even Roglic could compete with him admirably given a clean race.

 

[Berniece]

Thomas was 3rd in the 2022 Tour. Didn't make Pogi or Vingegaard any worse.

Didn’t know Pidcock also won a TDF and almost beat Roglic at the Giro… you are acting as if they are similar when Thomas showed way more as a GT rider

 

[Netserk]

Didn’t know Pidcock also won a TDF and almost beat Roglic at the Giro… you are acting as if they are similar when Thomas showed way more as a GT rider

Okay, if that doesn't convince you that the level of those you beat don't make you worse, then consider that Pogi was 2 places better than Gaudu (similar to Vingegaard and Pidders). He doesn't have the best track record as a GC rider, and his performances in that Tour were not really better than what Pidders managed.

 

[Berniece]

Okay, if that doesn't convince you that the level of those you beat don't make you worse

I just think Thomas was a bad example to make your point. Not to mention, Vingegaard won that Vuelta by 3min on Pidcock. That's not a lot. I think it’s about who you beat, and how you beat them

 

[Red Rick]

I just think Thomas was a bad example to make your point. Not to mention, Vingegaard won that Vuelta by 3min on Pidcock. That's not a lot. I think it’s about who you beat, and how you beat them

Evenepoel won the Vuelta by losing time in the high mountains to Enricky Mas. But then we back worshipping Sobek in The Nile again.

 

[Netserk]

I just think Thomas was a bad example to make your point. Not to mention, Vingegaard won that Vuelta by 3min on Pidcock. That's not a lot.

It's not, but it was a route for small gaps. And Pidders was really good.

 

[KoopaCycling]

enric mas is better than pidcock (GT) and remco only lost time to him when he was injured.

edit: I see the usual suspects are finding facts laughable.