The Sidebar Thread

[MarkvW]

Anyway gooner and martin don't understand context...don't believe a person should defend himself...

Martin has serious anger issues...and took me saying I look forward to meeting him sometime, as he alluded to maybe knowing my friends, as a threat!!!

Martin let's be clear here - I was not threatening you!! I know the word context has brought up difficulties in understanding - but no threat.
Meanwhile Martin threatens me that I better not be threatening him!!

I think it was quite reasonable for him to take your post as a threat, given your past history here.

 

[Digger]

Dear me, it's worse than last night's infantile squabble.
You guys seriously need to cool down.

Digger: We've no history.
Having read your recent posts and the above links supplied by the others, I'd suggest you do yourself a favour and shut up for a while.
You have been caught out, fair and square.
Clearly, it's making you upset.
I suggest you take a time out, pour yourself a glass of something nice.

Martin saying I am threatening him is awfully upsetting alright!!

By the way in relation to last night you said the good old days of the clinic - those the days of BPC being banned everyday...get real man.

 

[Digger]

I think it was quite reasonable for him to take your post as a threat, given your past history here.

well you are wrong - it was not a threat.

Anyway martin seems to be loose and fast with threats himself...


my past history on here...funny you should say that...never been banned Mark...so you may want to back that one up

 

[The Hitch]

Unbelievable, a tweet that can't be more crystal clear showing him calling Kennaugh a bully and he still denies it.

In honour of your username, could you please stop digging.

In Spain they pronounce "v" as "b"

So when they read Martin Vickers' name aloud their like - joder, you're named after your number 1 character trait.

 

[Digger]

Anyway do Gooner and Martin actually believe Sky are clean?

Martin just so we are clear here, that is a question and not a threat.

 

[ebandit]

clinic

Anyway do Gooner and Martin actually believe Sky are clean?

clinic talk.............to the clinic please

thanks!
Mark L

 

[Mellow Velo]

Martin saying I am threatening him is awfully upsetting alright!!

By the way in relation to last night you said the good old days of the clinic - those the days of BPC being banned everyday...get real man.

You made claims that they exposed as false.
Becoming indignant and using lots of exclamation marks
is an ineffectual deflection.
Clearly your are embarrassed and frustrated, but you are still in the wrong.

The Clinic used to be both more diverse and factually informative.

Hitch: I see you are around.
I should have said yesterday that I wasn't painting all in the Clinic with that same brush.
You and a few others keep it real under testing conditions.
Appreciate that you got my meaning, anyhow.

 

[Digger]

You made claims that they exposed as false.
Becoming indignant and using lots of exclamation marks
is an ineffectual deflection.
Clearly your are embarrassed and frustrated, but you are still in the wrong.

The Clinic used to be both more diverse and factually informative.

Hitch: I see you are around.
I should have said yesterday that I wasn't painting all in the Clinic with that same brush.
You and a few others keep it real under testing conditions.
Appreciate that you got my meaning, anyhow.

No they weren't! ...the day I am embarrassed by the skybots........and their naivety....

I have been in the clinic with five years...and you are looking back through rose tinted glasses. It is still as it ever was...some good and some bad.

 

[ferryman]

And everyone take a deep breath. Digger/Martin/Gooner let it go. You've spatted this one to death. It's only cycling FFS.

 

[the sceptic]

Anyway do Gooner and Martin actually believe Sky are clean?

Martin just so we are clear here, that is a question and not a threat.

They will avoid this question and say they are "not sure" and "waiting for more evidence". Its very convenient.

In Spain they pronounce "v" as "b"

So when they read Martin Vickers' name aloud their like - joder, you're named after your number 1 character trait.

My favourite MartinB moment was when he was surprised Tyson Gay was doping.

 

[The Hitch]

Hitch: I see you are around.
I should have said yesterday that I wasn't painting all in the Clinic with that same brush.
You and a few others keep it real under testing conditions.
Appreciate that you got my meaning, anyhow.

Ok, apologies then.

 

[martinvickers]

No they weren't! ...the day I am embarrassed by the skybots........and their naivety....

I have been in the clinic with five years...and you are looking back through rose tinted glasses. It is still as it ever was...some good and some bad.

Denial, not just a river...

 

[martinvickers]

My favourite MartinB moment was when he was surprised Tyson Gay was doping.

Indeed, I rather was, and developments since have tended to suggest I was right to be - Gay appears to have been caught out by naivite/stupidity with regards 'anti-aging' treatments - still should be banned, of course, but not exactly Ben Johnson in terms of intention...

 

[the sceptic]

Indeed, I rather was, and developments since have tended to suggest I was right to be - Gay appears to have been caught out by naivite/stupidity with regards 'anti-aging' treatments - still should be banned, of course, but not exactly Ben Johnson in terms of intention...

 

[Digger]

That picture is funny man!

 

[The Hitch]

Indeed, I rather was, and developments since have tended to suggest I was right to be - Gay appears to have been caught out by naivite/stupidity with regards 'anti-aging' treatments - still should be banned, of course, but not exactly Ben Johnson in terms of intention...

You were surprised a guy with the 2nd fastest time ever in a multi million dollar sport which has served as doping testing ground and battlefield for decades, would dope?

Well, I think that helps explain quite a lot of your posts and opinions then.

 

[Digger]

Martin are you also the person running this twitter account? https://mobile.twitter.com/martinpmcevoy

 

[martinvickers]

You were surprised a guy with the 2nd fastest time ever in a multi million dollar sport which has served as doping testing ground and battlefield for decades, would dope?

Well, I think that helps explain quite a lot of your posts and opinions then.

I was mildly surprised that an athlete with his anti-doping record, length of 'palmares' and background would dope, yes. And as I said, facts tend to suggest I was correct. How bizarre.

The 'performance' <=> 'doping' meme is as much bunk here as anywhere else.

The 'natural anti-aging' nonsense he bought into (about which Lauryn Williams has done an excellent blog), and the rather obvious trail of positives he seems to have left behind using it (a whole series at the nationals as mem serves), suggest quite strongly a very high score on the naivite/stupidity chart, much less so on intent - not by any means the work of a hardcore and seasoned doper to be so obvious and careless.

Should still be banned, lets be clear. But not the red and tooth and claw doper you were hoping for.

 

[peloton]

Martin are you also the person running this twitter account? https://mobile.twitter.com/martinpmcevoy

That's lame Digger.

 

[The Hitch]

I was mildly surprised that an athlete with his anti-doping record, length of 'palmares' and background would dope, yes. And as I said, facts tend to suggest I was correct. How bizarre.

How do the facts suggest you are correct? Only testing positive for a lesser product is now proof of cleanliness?

Someone get Marian Jones here titles back. Lance too while we are at it.

 

[martinvickers]

How do the facts suggest you are correct? Only testing positive for a lesser product is now proof of cleanliness?

Someone get Marian Jones here titles back. Lance too while we are at it.

1. It's not a lesser product. It's a testosterone bust, all told. Old fashioned, hardcore and obvious. The nature of the drug has f*** all to do with it, and I never suggested it was some lesser drug. Less strawmen, please.

2. The man's in his thirties. He's been consistently fast for the best part of a decade. If he's an experienced and successful career doper, why would he start being careless and sloppy now? The word is that he has a whole batch of positives from one period - no sign of an experienced doper knowing how to cycle to ensure a neg test.

3. He's pretty much co-operated with USADA since this broke. His anti-aging guru all but did a runner. No Marion Jones/ Lance armstrong denials, court cases - not one. Literally the first presser, he said, yep, positive, I took it, let down by someone i trust, no sabotage story from me. A story backed up by Lauryn Williams blog, despite her having no skin in the game as she wasn't a customer.

He absolutely deserves banned. It was stupid on more than one level. He took something deliberately, albeit not appearing to understand its ingrediants, and was, at least, cavalier about his intake. But the evidence points pretty strongly to stupidity, not mendacity. Now, I could be wrong. I'm not clairevoyent, and not remotely embarrassed that I'm not, either. But what we know, so far? Doesn't undermine his previous stance.

 

[The Hitch]

1. It's not a lesser product. It's a testosterone bust, all told. Old fashioned, hardcore and obvious. The nature of the drug has f*** all to do with it, and I never suggested it was some lesser drug. Less strawmen, please.

2. The man's in his thirties. He's been consistently fast for the best part of a decade. If he's an experienced and successful career doper, why would he start being careless and sloppy now? The word is that he has a whole batch of positives from one period - no sign of an experienced doper knowing how to cycle to ensure a neg test.

3. He's pretty much co-operated with USADA since this broke. His anti-aging guru all but did a runner. No Marion Jones/ Lance armstrong denials, court cases - not one. Literally the first presser, he said, yep, positive, I took it, let down by someone i trust, no sabotage story from me. A story backed up by Lauryn Williams blog, despite her having no skin in the game as she wasn't a customer.

He absolutely deserves banned. It was stupid on more than one level. He took something deliberately, albeit not appearing to understand its ingrediants, and was, at least, cavalier about his intake. But the evidence points pretty strongly to stupidity, not mendacity. Now, I could be wrong. I'm not clairevoyent, and not remotely embarrassed that I'm not, either. But what we know, so far? Doesn't undermine his previous stance.

That's all well and good but all this post does is say why he isn't guilty for what he got caught for.

You haven't yet told me the facts that make you conclude that you were right to think he wouldn't dope

I was mildly surprised that an athlete with his anti-doping record, length of 'palmares' and background would dope, yes. And as I said, facts tend to suggest I was correct. How bizarre.

What facts suggest you were correct to be surprised that he doped?

 

[Granville57]

He took something deliberately, albeit not appearing to understand its ingredients...

In 2013.

That. Is. Adorable.

 

[martinvickers]

That's all well and good but all this post does is say why he isn't guilty for what he got caught for.

But he IS guilty. That's the odd thing. It may not be type 1 doping evil a la armstrong/johnson/marion/De Bruin, but he took it, and should not have.

What facts suggest you were correct to be surprised that he doped?

To cut a long story short, a half decent experienced doper, happily winning medals and avoiding positives for a decade, doesn't make this sort of frankly amateur c0ck up and then just fess up to it. It doesn't make sense.

 

[martinvickers]

In 2013.

That. Is. Adorable.

Get the facts of the case, and read up Lauryn Williams blog. It's informative.

http://lauryn-williams.com/the-good-the-bad-and-the-hgh/

Note, she doesn't even name Tyson Gay specifically, no special pleading for him, not that sort of blog (btw, i checked, it is tyson). It's really about the industry itself.

Now read this

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way...rinter-tyson-gay-s-doping-to-anti-aging-cream

which confirms what i suspected reading the blog, and later had confirmed.

THere may be a different story we don't know of - Gay may have known rightly what he was taking - but there's a consistency to this 'mother of all f***-up" stories here.

The ingredients were on the jar. He ought to have known. and he deserves a ban for it, absolutely. But rank stupidity is still not exactly the same as malign intent, however we dress it. Hopefully we'll find out more as time goes on.

Edit: p.s. apparently, according to letsrun, the link to this anti-aging master was Jon Drummond; he sent Gay and tried to send Williams. For what it's worth.