The thread of "Neilson Powless is not powerless anymore thread"

[firefly3323]

He is making me glad I selected him for my CQ team!

 

[perico]

One of the more underrated riders in the peloton. I doubt he is ever able to make the transition to a GC rider like they talked about previously, but there really isn’t a reason to do so because he is a really good rider as he is.

 

[BR2]

He is making me glad I selected him for my CQ team!

I don't have him on my cq-team this year, but I am glad for him anyway, because I just like him as a rider. He's not afraid to attack or work and a really good allrounder, slightly unpredictable.

 

[firefly3323]

I almost didn't take him (i did have him last year) because of his cost of 800 but I couldn't not take him because of exactly what you said.

 

[red_flanders]

Is this his first stage race victory?

EDIT: Looks like he won some Nature Valley whatever 2.2 race back in the day.

 

[Bolder]

I wonder about his potential. He looks really lean, like a...GT contender? He was 12th in the Tour last year, not that he was within sniffing distance of the real contenders, but it shows he never packed it in. IIRC Jumbo thought he could be a mountain domestique (he came up with Kuss, correct?) but wasn't happy with his progress. But he really does have a nose for being at the pointy end of a lot of races.

 

[Potomac]

I think he's a natural GC candidate. But he isn't (at least not yet) one of the greats. One day races and stage wins are probably his best bet for glory and decent GC results to earn UCI points for his team.

 

[Oldermanish]

I wonder about his potential. He looks really lean, like a...GT contender? He was 12th in the Tour last year, not that he was within sniffing distance of the real contenders, but it shows he never packed it in. IIRC Jumbo thought he could be a mountain domestique (he came up with Kuss, correct?) but wasn't happy with his progress. But he really does have a nose for being at the pointy end of a lot of races.

The physical similarity between Kuss and Powless is no accident. They've been racing together since the junior days. I saw them both as Juniors (briefly as they dropped my old self) before I quit racing and they were clearly excellent climbers and decent crit riders, too. Kuss seems content according to the forum analysis and a few quotes. Powless may be maturing and willing to do a bit more on his own. He should IMO.

 

[perico]

I wonder about his potential. He looks really lean, like a...GT contender? He was 12th in the Tour last year, not that he was within sniffing distance of the real contenders, but it shows he never packed it in. IIRC Jumbo thought he could be a mountain domestique (he came up with Kuss, correct?) but wasn't happy with his progress. But he really does have a nose for being at the pointy end of a lot of races.

I’ve always seen him as a San Sebastián type. He can win the Week long races but seems to excel in the hilly 1 day races.

 

[Oldermanish]

I’ve always seen him as a San Sebastián type. He can win the Week long races but seems to excel in the hilly 1 day races.

I'd say it's hard to know his total upside. He was raised in the slower US system and worked his way up fairly quickly. That doesn't expose you to much but week long races so you could be right. It'll be interesting to see what opportunities come to him.

 

[Anderis]

I see on PCS that Powless is expected to ride some cobbles this year. That's going to be an interesting experiment.

The 2021 WC, where he finished 5th, had almost exclusively cobble specialists in the top15, so perhaps there's some potential there.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

I see on PCS that Powless is expected to ride some cobbles this year. That's going to be an interesting experiment.

The 2021 WC, where he finished 5th, had almost exclusively cobble specialists in the top15, so perhaps there's some potential there.

I'm not sure them being cobble specialists had anything to do with doing well at the WCC.

 

[Roku]

I wonder about his potential. He looks really lean, like a...GT contender? He was 12th in the Tour last year, not that he was within sniffing distance of the real contenders, but it shows he never packed it in. IIRC Jumbo thought he could be a mountain domestique (he came up with Kuss, correct?) but wasn't happy with his progress. But he really does have a nose for being at the pointy end of a lot of races.

I think he's a natural GC candidate. But he isn't (at least not yet) one of the greats. One day races and stage wins are probably his best bet for glory and decent GC results to earn UCI points for his team.

Once, he was heralded as a potential GT contender. He won't ever be so, I can't see him earning anything else than a fringe Top10 earned by aggresive racing and breaks. He is not that good on successive multi-mountain stages and usually sheds (lots of) time.

His 2022 TdF placing was achieved via multiple breaks that allowed him to anticipate the race. His GC GT ceilling is a Guillaume Martin kind of rider.

You don't (or shouldn't) sacrifice a proven winner on hilly classics and minor one day races, stage hunter and contender on week-long races for especifically targetting a long shot on a GT Top-10. At least I wouldn't do so when you have better chances of shining.

 

[Anderis]

I'm not sure them being cobble specialists had anything to do with doing well at the WCC.

Apart from Powless, the least prominent cobble riders in the top17 of that race were Boivin and Hoelgaard and those are riders who still have finished a WT cobbled race in the top10 in recent years.
There are two possibilities:

1. We've got that result by sheer accident
2. There was a significant crossover between the skillset required to do well on that course and to do well in cobbled races in general

I'm not going to argue it's either one or another but just had a thought that maybe we don't have to discount the second option too easily.

Once, he was heralded as a potential GT contender. He won't ever be so, I can't see him earning anything else than a fringe Top10 earned by aggresive racing and breaks. He is not that good on successive multi-mountain stages and usually sheds (lots of) time.

His 2022 TdF placing was achieved via multiple breaks that allowed him to anticipate the race. His GC GT ceilling is a Guillaume Martin kind of rider.

People have said similar things about Geraint Thomas (and other successful GT riders) in the past, just saying. As long as you demonstrate an ability to climb with the best from time to time and add some versatility atop, then you just never know for sure about their ceiling, IMO. Riders can make astonishing progress sometimes.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Apart from Powless, the least prominent cobble riders in the top17 of that race were Boivin and Hoelgaard and those are riders who still have finished a WT cobbled race in the top10 in recent years.

Sorry. For some reason i thought you were talking about Imola, but obviously you were talking about Leuven.

 

[Bolder]

Once, he was heralded as a potential GT contender. He won't ever be so, I can't see him earning anything else than a fringe Top10 earned by aggresive racing and breaks. He is not that good on successive multi-mountain stages and usually sheds (lots of) time.

His 2022 TdF placing was achieved via multiple breaks that allowed him to anticipate the race. His GC GT ceilling is a Guillaume Martin kind of rider.

You don't (or shouldn't) sacrifice a proven winner on hilly classics and minor one day races, stage hunter and contender on week-long races for especifically targetting a long shot on a GT Top-10. At least I wouldn't do so when you have better chances of shining.

I don't disagree, more just pointing out that he pushed on to the end of the Tour rather than completely packing it in, so 3 weeks at a pretty high level isn't something he can't do.

Even if he'll never be a GT podium finisher, he could podium the Dauphine (like Martin), Suisse, P-N, maybe Basque Country someday.

I pretty much thought his career was over when Jumbo cut him loose, so he's already surprised me in a positive way. It's not all that often that a promising young rider find more success at a small team after being cut by a super-team.

 

[Oldermanish]

Once, he was heralded as a potential GT contender. He won't ever be so, I can't see him earning anything else than a fringe Top10 earned by aggresive racing and breaks. He is not that good on successive multi-mountain stages and usually sheds (lots of) time.

His 2022 TdF placing was achieved via multiple breaks that allowed him to anticipate the race. His GC GT ceilling is a Guillaume Martin kind of rider.

You don't (or shouldn't) sacrifice a proven winner on hilly classics and minor one day races, stage hunter and contender on week-long races for especifically targetting a long shot on a GT Top-10. At least I wouldn't do so when you have better chances of shining.

I don't think you can ever define a rider this young; especially considering his US exposure. It was a variety of races and many very fast criteriums. Road surfaces are usually not great, either so he, Kuss, Mateo and the rest have much in common with race history.
Conversely, projecting that a young phenom will dominate the Tour and be the next Whomever is fun but equally speculative. It's always up to the rider to control their fate as much as possible and most American riders know that.
Would a DS exploit and manipulate a specific talent just for points? No doubt; it's their job. National teams do the same to junior riders, probably more than professional teams. IMO the US lack of major, long and hilly stage races has already allowed for the variety of skills some of these youngsters have. They had to get very good to even travel to other continents.

 

[Oldermanish]

Apart from Powless, the least prominent cobble riders in the top17 of that race were Boivin and Hoelgaard and those are riders who still have finished a WT cobbled race in the top10 in recent years.
There are two possibilities:

1. We've got that result by sheer accident
2. There was a significant crossover between the skillset required to do well on that course and to do well in cobbled races in general

I'm not going to argue it's either one or another but just had a thought that maybe we don't have to discount the second option too easily.


People have said similar things about Geraint Thomas (and other successful GT riders) in the past, just saying. As long as you demonstrate an ability to climb with the best from time to time and add some versatility atop, then you just never know for sure about their ceiling, IMO. Riders can make astonishing progress sometimes.

Very much agree.
Geraint was a track racer. Points races and pursuits make for what? Great TTers and durable high-intensity performers if the adjustment to longer events is made early enough. Same for MTB and CX performers. Those disciplines require exploration of the Red Zone in every event.

 

[Potomac]

Very respectable in Tour des Alpes Maritimes et du Var

 

[Potomac]

7th at MSR

Well done.

 

[jmdirt]

7th at MSR

Well done.

Yes, he looked solid today!

 

[Oldermanish]

Very much agree.
Geraint was a track racer. Points races and pursuits make for what? Great TTers and durable high-intensity performers if the adjustment to longer events is made early enough. Same for MTB and CX performers. Those disciplines require exploration of the Red Zone in every event.

Looks like Powless explored that redzone effort against the fastest Poggio ascent. Excellent postioning up to 3km from the summit and the turbo wash at one corner pushed him back to around 20th. Hard to come back that late on the climb, particularly with the pack split that happened almost at the same time. Taking 3rd in the field sprint after 6.5 hrs in the saddle shows some serious strength. Congrats!

 

[tobydawq]

Looks like Powless explored that redzone effort against the fastest Poggio ascent. Excellent postioning up to 3km from the summit and the turbo wash at one corner pushed him back to around 20th. Hard to come back that late on the climb, particularly with the pack split that happened almost at the same time. Taking 3rd in the field sprint after 6.5 hrs in the saddle shows some serious strength. Congrats!

It wasn't a field sprint, to be fair. It was a group of seven.

 

[RedheadDane]

I see a major problem with his results:
They're getting increasingly worse.

 

[Potomac]

I see a major problem with his results:
They're getting increasingly worse.

Maybe it will be a sinusoidal pattern.