The Top 50 Under 23 Riders of 2010

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theyoungest said:
Nah, both Degenkolb and Matthews are more versatile: equal to Phinney in sprinting ability, nearly as good in the TT, but way better uphill. But I'm not in the jury, of course.
Yes, Matthews and Degenkolb are a little more versatile but for some reason Phinney seems to be a little more impressive. That's the impression I've gotten so far at least.

One problem with my assessment is that it seems l'Avenir and his ITT nationals win won't factor into the ranking.
 
Jun 28, 2009
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Yes, Matthews and Degenkolb are a little more versatile but for some reason Phinney seems to be a little more impressive. That's the impression I've gotten so far at least.

One problem with my assessment is that it seems l'Avenir and his ITT nationals win won't factor into the ranking.
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So this means no Ben King or Andrew Talansky both of which deserve to be in the Top 50 without a doubt?
 
Jan 11, 2010
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Clemson Cycling said:
So this means no Ted King or Andrew Talansky both of which deserve to be in the Top 50 without a doubt?
You mean Ben King, I guess? Before the US nationals, he didn't really have any earth shattering results, did he? Talansky probably is in the top-10, at least that's where I would rate him.
 
Clemson Cycling said:
So this means no Ted King or Andrew Talansky both of which deserve to be in the Top 50 without a doubt?
Ben King probably not... Wasn't really on the radar in a big way before his recent win... Talansky has obviously appreciated a great deal since his wonderful Avenir, but I imagine he'll comfortably be in the 5th-8th range in the list. He had already posted some good looking results, and I imagine most of us who closely watch the U23 races already knew exactly who he was. And either way the list last from last year was already out of date, since it didn't take into account Romain Sicard's late season heroics, which would've certainly elevated him from 8th to 1st for last year's list.

BTW, it doesn't matter a massive deal. Guys like Tejay van Garderen, Sagan and Modolo were ranked below guys like Kittel, Silin, Kritskiy, and Ghyselinck (the latter three who have done very little in their first pro-year.... not that that rules them out or anything). Plotting the progression of U23s into the pro-ranks can be an extremely fine art, and the screw-ups can look glaring when looking back (Reus in 2005 is worth a chuckle). But all in all the lists a pretty damn good, and it's certainly a worthy enterprise.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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theyoungest said:
Nah, both Degenkolb and Matthews are more versatile: equal to Phinney in sprinting ability, nearly as good in the TT, but way better uphill. But I'm not in the jury, of course.
How much does versatility matter for a ranking like this though?

Phinney hasn't shown any ability to ride uphill. But he has shown the ability to mix it up with top sprinters (though probably not in great form) with a couple of top 10's at Qatar, and seems to be a pretty exceptional flat-time trialist and one of the better cobbled riders for the U-23 crowd.

Is being what many would consider the best U23 level time trialist and cobbled rider combined with a solid sprinter a better resume then someone who isn't as exceptional in any area but more of an all-around talent?
 
Mar 18, 2009
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Moondance said:
Guys like Tejay van Garderen, Sagan and Modolo were ranked below guys like Kittel, Silin, Kritskiy, and Ghyselinck (the latter three who have done very little in their first pro-year.... not that that rules them out or anything)
In the case of one of them, it's a bit hard to do anything when you're out for the year with a leg broken in (literally) half a dozen places
 
Jan 11, 2010
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Moondance said:
BTW, it doesn't matter a massive deal. Guys like Tejay van Garderen, Sagan and Modolo were ranked below guys like Kittel, Silin, Kritskiy, and Ghyselinck (the latter three who have done very little in their first pro-year.... not that that rules them out or anything). Plotting the progression of U23s into the pro-ranks can be an extremely fine art, and the screw-ups can look glaring when looking back (Reus in 2005 is worth a chuckle). But all in all the lists a pretty damn good, and it's certainly a worthy enterprise.
Strange sense of humor you have. Not much to laugh about this, is there? So much potential, and so little luck.
 
Moondance said:
Ben King probably not... Wasn't really on the radar in a big way before his recent win... Talansky has obviously appreciated a great deal since his wonderful Avenir, but I imagine he'll comfortably be in the 5th-8th range in the list. He had already posted some good looking results, and I imagine most of us who closely watch the U23 races already knew exactly who he was. And either way the list last from last year was already out of date, since it didn't take into account Romain Sicard's late season heroics, which would've certainly elevated him from 8th to 1st for last year's list.

BTW, it doesn't matter a massive deal. Guys like Tejay van Garderen, Sagan and Modolo were ranked below guys like Kittel, Silin, Kritskiy, and Ghyselinck (the latter three who have done very little in their first pro-year.... not that that rules them out or anything). Plotting the progression of U23s into the pro-ranks can be an extremely fine art, and the screw-ups can look glaring when looking back (Reus in 2005 is worth a chuckle). But all in all the lists a pretty damn good, and it's certainly a worthy enterprise.
Yup, it could really be predicted Reus would end up in a coma, fight back, only to be hit by Pfeiffer..

:confused: funny, worth to chuckle indeed
 
theyoungest said:
Schadenfreude... like I said, strange sense of humor you have. A bit sick, actually.
Please.... Don't take it so seriously. Your reaction to what I wrote caused me to go over-the-top with the link.

I know that Reus has been through a lot of [EXPLETIVE DELETED]. The chuckle wasn't meant as a Nelson-from-the Simpsons style "HA-HA!" but rather a rueful reflection on how something can go so wrong for a poor guy. Life does kick some people squarely in the nuts. I didn't mean to hate on the guy.... If that's what you think i did. What I wrote then clearly didn't convey what I wanted it to say. For this I apologize to all whom I have offended.
 
Jan 11, 2010
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Moondance said:
Please.... Don't take it so seriously. Your reaction to what I wrote caused me to go over-the-top with the link.

I know that Reus has been through a lot of [EXPLETIVE DELETED]. The chuckle wasn't meant as a Nelson-from-the Simpsons style "HA-HA!" but rather a rueful reflection on how something can go so wrong for a poor guy. Life does kick some people squarely in the nuts. I didn't mean to hate on the guy.... If that's what you think i did. What I wrote then clearly didn't convey what I wanted it to say. For this I apologize to all whom I have offended.
That's not really Schadenfreude, though. But ok, I see what you mean.
 
Jun 28, 2009
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Ben King did win the U23 Road Race and the U23 Criterium as well this year. Definitely deserves a spot in the top 50 U23 riders right now (probably the top 25). He also has a contract with a Pro Tour team for the upcomming season. I guess there is still the chance that he cracks the top 10.
 
The Hitch said:
Very very interesting,


Who will get number 1 this year. I think Henao (9th last year) definately deserves it but i feart it will go to Sagan.


Looking at previous editions they dont always work out.


How on earth did Andy Schleck not make the top 10 in 07 when he came 2nd in a brutal giro, coming 3rd on the Zoncolan.

For those who dont want to go looking through the links here is a quick list of who came first.

04 Dekker
05 Kai Reus
06 Grabovsky (Gesink 2nd)
07 EBH
08 Coen Vermeltfoort
09 Rasmus Guldhammer

Looks like the bias towards Dutch in cycling isnt limited to these forums:rolleyes:
Bauke Mollema appears a few time so maybe he shouldnt be seen as such a joke


Tony Martin appears top 5 in about 3 additions.
Thanks for the info Hitch.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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Clemson Cycling said:
Ben King did win the U23 Road Race and the U23 Criterium as well this year. Definitely deserves a spot in the top 50 U23 riders right now (probably the top 25). He also has a contract with a Pro Tour team for the upcomming season. I guess there is still the chance that he cracks the top 10.
I doubt it. I could see arguing for him in the 41-50 range, but not the top 10, not even with his nationals win. The highest I could see him ranked before that win would probably be about where Jesse Sergeant ended up.
 
Jan 11, 2010
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kurtinsc said:
I doubt it. I could see arguing for him in the 41-50 range, but not the top 10, not even with his nationals win. The highest I could see him ranked before that win would probably be about where Jesse Sergeant ended up.
Maybe the two Ben Kings together could amount to a top-10 placing? Although TBH I don't remember any noteworthy results from either of them.
 
Jul 27, 2010
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Clemson Cycling said:
Ben King did win the U23 Road Race and the U23 Criterium as well this year. Definitely deserves a spot in the top 50 U23 riders right now (probably the top 25). He also has a contract with a Pro Tour team for the upcomming season. I guess there is still the chance that he cracks the top 10.
I agree. I was at the Espoir Nats and he crushed both of those races. I figured that for sure he would be a top 50 rider.
 
Sep 8, 2010
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Like I said before. We started collecting the riders in august to present a ranking and the texts right before the world championships. And please consider that the presentation of the riders is the important thing, not if he is on 23 or 18 or something. Of course the ranking helps, but it is not the most important thing about it.
 
They definately missed out on Quintana then.

Kelderman in 4th, well, he is from 1991, that is a pro

It's also funny the authors noticed the same thing as me about Wuyts
So it is not surprising that you could hear the disappointment in Michael Wuyts´ voice when he had to announce that Eijssen had cracked on the road up to Risoul. Even more so when wearing the leader´s jersey of the Tour de l´Avenir. But let´s begin at the begin
 

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