The worst Grand Tour you can remember

[Krokro]

To be fair , the perfect answer : Every Tour nowadays. Le Tour constantly disappoints cuz of Skybots or poor competition around Froome. Good point is Sagan showing off, Cav epic seasonal come back, last km arch fall, Froomey without bike and that's pretty much all. No suspense, no competition. It's just a no match and boring af to watch. /topic.

 

[fabramowski]

This is the most boring tour that I have watched, even the highlights are boring. It seems to get boring every year. They need to change it so the teams don't know the course ahead of time and just let them know the towns it starts and stops at, and give them the course details the day before. This would alleviate teams building a team for just the tour and which we have seen for the last up teen years so far. Maybe they need to just return to a one man team.....

 

[staubsauger]

Well today was the first time I actually got the feeling the Tour is about to really start. On Sunday it's over already again. Somehow that's enough said I guess.

Even with a weaker Giro at the beginning the Tour once again fails to equal the entertainment of the corsa rosa!

The Vuelta gonna be a fun race once again. But I hardly recognize it as a true gt to be honest. It's like an amusement arcade of cycling.

 

[El Pistolero]

You know what would be cool? A Tour just for classic riders. Lot's of cobbles, Sterrato/Ribinoù, flat stages with high risk of echelons and a lot of hilly stages. No time trials or mountains. I'd like to see that for one year, they can return to the traditional formula after that. Will never happen of course, but I think it would make for an entertaining Tour.

The race would start in Belgium of course, take place mainly in France and do a couple of detours to Italy. A Tour that the likes of Sagan or Van Avermaet could win.

The Eneco Tour has been a great one-week stage race last few years because of this. It's easily one of my favorite WT stage races of the year.

 

[ggusta]

Re: Re:

So are you unhappy with the very idea of 3 week stage races with the winner usually determined by climbing and time trialing prowess? What else could possibly cause you to dislike them all?

I'm unhappy with races where the winner can usually be picked beforehand or when they aren't even 50% over. Races that need crashes or mechanical failures to make them exciting annoy me and generally I find that the racing in GTs is extremely conservative and predictable. We are constantly promised a real race yet it is almost never delivered. There are of course exceptions, there was some hyperbole in my initial statement, but in general that's how I feel. I watch them for the spectacle but that's it.

Of course I'm aware that my views are probably a minority on here, but I can still air them. If people don't like them they are free to ignore me

I completely support your right to air your views. I don't get this ' where are the mods ?' shtick lately anytime anyone mentions something that anyone reads some sort of undertone into. Deal with it folks, it's a freaking message board, it isn't like we are lobbing live grenades at one another....sheesh....

Having said that.... did you actually watch the 2012 vuelta....and if you did and you still feel the same way, why do you? And if you don't see things precisely as I do, I am reporting every post you ever make until the end of eternity....

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re:

You know what would be cool? A Tour just for classic riders. Lot's of cobbles, Sterrato/Ribinoù, flat stages with high risk of echelons and a lot of hilly stages. No time trials or mountains. I'd like to see that for one year, they can return to the traditional formula after that. Will never happen of course, but I think it would make for an entertaining Tour.

The race would start in Belgium of course, take place mainly in France and do a couple of detours to Italy. A Tour that the likes of Sagan or Van Avermaet could win.

The Eneco Tour has been a great one-week stage race last few years because of this. It's easily one of my favorite WT stage races of the year.

Froome would still be the favourite, thats the scary part.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

You know what would be cool? A Tour just for classic riders. Lot's of cobbles, Sterrato/Ribinoù, flat stages with high risk of echelons and a lot of hilly stages. No time trials or mountains. I'd like to see that for one year, they can return to the traditional formula after that. Will never happen of course, but I think it would make for an entertaining Tour.

The race would start in Belgium of course, take place mainly in France and do a couple of detours to Italy. A Tour that the likes of Sagan or Van Avermaet could win.

The Eneco Tour has been a great one-week stage race last few years because of this. It's easily one of my favorite WT stage races of the year.

Froome would still be the favourite, thats the scary part.

No, Sagan would be.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re: Re:

You know what would be cool? A Tour just for classic riders. Lot's of cobbles, Sterrato/Ribinoù, flat stages with high risk of echelons and a lot of hilly stages. No time trials or mountains. I'd like to see that for one year, they can return to the traditional formula after that. Will never happen of course, but I think it would make for an entertaining Tour.

The race would start in Belgium of course, take place mainly in France and do a couple of detours to Italy. A Tour that the likes of Sagan or Van Avermaet could win.

The Eneco Tour has been a great one-week stage race last few years because of this. It's easily one of my favorite WT stage races of the year.

Froome would still be the favourite, thats the scary part.

No, Sagan would be.

No, Froome would be.

 

[Miburo]

Well Elpist is right now, this tour is worse than the giro and no matter what happens in the last 3 stages it'll never be as good as what nibal did in the giro unless Aru goes insane, but he would need to win the tour then and that ain't gonna happen.

2012 was still worse imo.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

You know what would be cool? A Tour just for classic riders. Lot's of cobbles, Sterrato/Ribinoù, flat stages with high risk of echelons and a lot of hilly stages. No time trials or mountains. I'd like to see that for one year, they can return to the traditional formula after that. Will never happen of course, but I think it would make for an entertaining Tour.

The race would start in Belgium of course, take place mainly in France and do a couple of detours to Italy. A Tour that the likes of Sagan or Van Avermaet could win.

The Eneco Tour has been a great one-week stage race last few years because of this. It's easily one of my favorite WT stage races of the year.

Froome would still be the favourite, thats the scary part.

No, Sagan would be.

No, Froome would be.

Why?

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

The actual answer is Valverde would be the favourite, unless the hills are very small indeed or unless multiple cobbled stages were as flat and hard as Paris Roubaix.

 

[Cannibal72]

I'd have Nibali as the favourite for a race like that. The thing about a 'classics grand tour' is that the racing in a classic is completely different (and usually quite a lot faster) than even the most classics-y grand tour stage. I could envisage Sagan winning a classics GT, but maybe not a rider whose speciality is a fast finish after a hard race, like GVA. Kwiatkowski would also be a good bet, as would peak Cancellara and maybe even Alaphilipe.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re:

The actual answer is Valverde would be the favourite, unless the hills are very small indeed or unless multiple cobbled stages were as flat and hard as Paris Roubaix.

Nope, if such a thing were to happen, Sagan would lose a bit of weight, so he can challenge on the toughest of hills (remember that Tirreno-Adriatico stage in 2013? Where he almost dropped everyone, including Contador and Froome).

And obviously the cobbled stages would be as hard as the Ronde van Vlaanderen and Paris-Roubaix, they would be the replacement for the mountain stages. The length would also be 250km+.

There's no doubt in my mind that Sagan has the potential to be a much better rider for the hilly classics than Valverde.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

And obviously the cobbled stages would be as hard as the Ronde van Vlaanderen and Paris-Roubaix, they would be the replacement for the mountain stages. The length would also be 250km+.

Well if that's the set up, there's nothing to discuss. It's simply a race for the cobbled riders, with Sagan, as the best climber among them, more likely to be defeated by a crash than by anyone else.

Good luck finding enough cobbles of the requisite difficulty to design a parcours where they can replace the mountains though. My assumption was that there would have to be quite a lot more in the way of difficult hilly stages than difficult cobbled ones.

 

[Cannibal72]

And obviously the cobbled stages would be as hard as the Ronde van Vlaanderen and Paris-Roubaix, they would be the replacement for the mountain stages. The length would also be 250km+.

Well if that's the set up, there's nothing to discuss. It's simply a race for the cobbled riders, with Sagan, as the best climber among them, more likely to be defeated by a crash than by anyone else.

Good luck finding enough cobbles of the requisite difficulty to design a parcours where they can replace the mountains though. My assumption was that there would have to be quite a lot more in the way of difficult hilly stages than difficult cobbled ones.

I imagine finding really, really tough pave aside from Roubaix would be very hard; not necessarily because the cobbled farm tracks in the rest of Northern France/Wallonia are too easy, but because they're too hard. Roubaix would be unrideable without the Amis doing remarkable work to keep the cobbles in reasonable condition, and I can't easily imagine that there'd be sufficient volunteers to do the same kind of immaculate caretaking for a three-week grand tour. (Equally, though, a lot of the flat pave has been tarmacked over.)

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

And obviously the cobbled stages would be as hard as the Ronde van Vlaanderen and Paris-Roubaix, they would be the replacement for the mountain stages. The length would also be 250km+.

Well if that's the set up, there's nothing to discuss. It's simply a race for the cobbled riders, with Sagan, as the best climber among them, more likely to be defeated by a crash than by anyone else.

Good luck finding enough cobbles of the requisite difficulty to design a parcours where they can replace the mountains though. My assumption was that there would have to be quite a lot more in the way of difficult hilly stages than difficult cobbled ones.

I never said there wouldn't be a stage like Liège-Bastogne-Liège. Obviously there would be a couple stages like that. The cobbles would probably break the race up a lot more than the hilly stages though. And the race could also visit the French/Spanish Basque country while we're at it. The likes of GVA can win the CSS anyway.

And there would be a Golden Kilometer in every stage, just like in the Eneco Tour, all strategically placed. My race would be brutal and chaotic.

And I lied about the no time trials part, there would be a downhill time trial on the Poggio. :lol:

There would be very few uphill finishes though, to prevent conservative racing.

 

[carton]

Re: Re:

The actual answer is Valverde would be the favourite, unless the hills are very small indeed or unless multiple cobbled stages were as flat and hard as Paris Roubaix.

It would depend on the bonuses. If no time bonuses were given, Froome would still be the favourite. With bonuses it might be Bala. Reason being that recovery is, perhaps even more than power, what separates GC riders. It's why Dan Martin, Valverde (coming off the Giro) and Alaphillipe were expected to fade at the end of the Tour. Sagan might have the consistency over three weeks without taking one day off, he might not, but we don't know. He's the only one of the non-GC riders I might be tempted to wager on in such a race.

 

[SKSemtex]

Such a Tour would be great. I do not think the Sagan would be favourite as with such a tour you would need very very strong team as it would be impossible to control. Multiplied attack anywere , anytime, by any team. Plus we have not any prove he can handle 19 days of riding without resting fewdays in Gruppeto.
I think Nibali would be my pick, but I am sure Froome with special training will be fine again. His wats are scary plus he proves he can handel almost everything, even the dry cobbles.

 

[Flamin]

Unless something dramatic happens in the remaining stages, this Tour is right up there with the 2012 Giro, worse than the Tour in 2012. And I like Froomey, while I dislike Wiggins.

 

[Carstenbf]

2007 without a doubt. Race was never the same for me after that.

 

[SKSemtex]

I have a feeling this tour will be just fine if borgs allow the carnage for podium places.
We have the winner, but fight for podium can be more interesring than fight for titul last five tours combined .
It's not likely as borgs are borgs, Froome like stage winnings with no gifts, but we still can dream on. Anybody saying here he is not expecting fireworks next two stages is probably lying.

 

[Ramira]

I have a feeling this tour will be just find if borgs allow the carnage for podium places.
We have the winner, but fight for podium can be more interesring than fight for titul last five tours combined .
It's not likely as borgs are borgs, Froome like stage winnings with no gifts, but we still can dream on. Anybody saying here he is not expecting fireworks next two stages is probably lying.

I couldn't agree more.

One of the issues many people in here seem to have is that they only care about the yellow.

While of course it's great to see a true battle for the yellow, I find fights for the podium almost as interesting. Exciting cycling is exciting, even if it's not for the yellow.

Not to mention there has been incredible racing in the breakaways. The victories by van Avermaet, Sagan (with Froome), Froome (in the descent), Dumoulin, de Gendt, Pantano and Cummings were all exciting and beautiful to watch (for some reason I don't rate Zakarin there, probably because it wasn't that exciting, and his style is so ugly).

Basically if you only care about the yellow, yes this was a boring tour. If you care about each stage individually, and the fight for the podium, this has been one of the better tours in recent years (not to mention the last contested tour was probably Evans in 2011, so there's not been true competition in the last 5 editions).

 

[hrotha]

What's the most km of action among GC contenders that we've seen at the Tour this year so far, Luchon aside? 2?

 

[Forever The Best]

Re:

What's the most km of action among GC contenders that we've seen at the Tour this year so far, Luchon aside? 2?

10-11 km at Montpellier

 

[Hugo Koblet]

The only thing I remember from the 2012 Tour is Froome waving at Wiggins, but the only thing I'll remember from this Tour is Froome running up Ventoux. Equally bad GT's imo.