Teams & Riders Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

[movingtarget]

Pinot has become very predictable in the TT unfortunately. Maybe he needs a coach or a better one.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Or maybe he overperformed in 2016.

A good Pinot would've done between 10th and 20h.
Now he's at the level of Nairo Quintana. His normal level? Maybe.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

Pinot has become very predictable in the TT unfortunately. Maybe he needs a coach or a better one.

And no TTs after rest days.

 

[lartiste]

What happened today?

 

[Tonton]

Re:

What happened today?

Two scenarii come to mind:

1. Thibaut is weakening, and from being a GT rider standpoint, that's worrisome.

2. Before the Vuelta, the declared goal was "having fun and winning a stage". The greedy ones like me wanted a podium. Just like we doubted Nibali and Porte's real intentions, two weeks in, the GC picture seemed to be very real. After the ITT, with the time gaps, a top-5 was somewhat unlikely. Pinot could have defended his 7th place...but he has ben 7th before. Taking it easy, lose a little time, now he's like Majka, probably allowed to go in breaks. And win a second stage. Bonus, maybe, ninja his way back to 7th.

We'll see in the days to come.

 

[Bolder]

I wonder if focusing on improving TT wouldn't have other benefits for Pinot? As is stands now he's capable of winning any stage, but not able to sustain a high level through a GT, and is guaranteed to be in a hole after an ITT. That lumps him in with about a dozen other riders, frankly. In other words, he's "nothing special" among those with podium hopes. If he could get to the point where he won't lose 1 minute + on a 30 km itt (relative to the top placed GC riders), he'd be able to save some energy on the climbs. And, the training might help him on longer stages, even if he lost a bit on the very top climbing end...

 

[lartiste]

Re: Re:

What happened today?

Two scenarii come to mind:

1. Thibaut is weakening, and from being a GT rider standpoint, that's worrisome.

2. Before the Vuelta, the declared goal was "having fun and winning a stage". The greedy ones like me wanted a podium. Just like we doubted Nibali and Porte's real intentions, two weeks in, the GC picture seemed to be very real. After the ITT, with the time gaps, a top-5 was somewhat unlikely. Pinot could have defended his 7th place...but he has ben 7th before. Taking it easy, lose a little time, now he's like Majka, probably allowed to go in breaks. And win a second stage. Bonus, maybe, ninja his way back to 7th.

We'll see in the days to come.

If the first is correct it is bad. I still see Marc Madiot nearly fell out of window of his car, celebrating Tibopino won his first stage at TdF.

I hope for second option. This was not his year, hope next one will be better.

 

[Rollthedice]

It was an almost year. Good Giro, his body just broke down. Won a stage race and Covadonga. I don't think he's weakening, maybe that elusive big win will come. Worlds would be a good place to start.

 

[Tonton]

The more I think about it, the more I believe that there's a calculation: Thibaut was not in the first list for the WRRC team, he wants to show that he can win bike races. A second stage in the Vuelta would coerce Guimard into getting him in the team.

Fans like me want a podium out of this Vuelta, that's not what Tibo said all along, though. "Have fun, win a stage", raise his arms for the first time in '18. Finish a GT strong, not in an ambulance. Get his spot in the French team in Austria. After the ITT, he couldn't get the butter and the money for the butter as we say in French (stage win and podium). The podium no longer was a viable option. 7th or 9th, same thing.

With regards to ITT, in '16, he was bigger and the trade-off was not being as good of a climber, not being as nearly as explosive, he was a total diesel doomed to be at best a Dumoulin Light, as he was when he beat Bardet at the Dauphine. Riding pace, little pure climbing skills. Considering how Dumoulin fared in '17 and '18, maybe that was the way to go...I don't know.

The next two days will give the answer. If it is what I think it is, Tibopino could be in the BOD tomorrow: MS and Movistar won't care, the Mas-SK-MAL will watch each other, not want to chase him and be depleted. Never a big gap, but give him 2' or 2'30" at the bottom of the climb (what he had when he won AdH), and he wins.

We'll see. Needless to say, I hope I'm right .

 

[Alexandre B.]

He was immensely strong today.

Chapeau!

 

[ice&fire]

Two stage wins and none of them from a breakaway. We'll see great things from him in the future.

 

[IndianCyclist]

Re:

Two stage wins and none of them from a breakaway. We'll see great things from him in the future.

In winning stages yes in GC no as his health does not support him for 21 days

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Two stage wins and none of them from a breakaway. We'll see great things from him in the future.

In winning stages yes in GC no as his health does not support him for 21 days

Well his 2017 Giro was very good but the TT let him down again but yes it's the consistency over three weeks that is the main issue, and in this year's Giro he succumbed to illness just when it seemed he had secured a podium position.

 

[Kwibus]

Re: Re:

For a fan, I think Pinot is one of the more human riders. They all, of course, do thing on the bike that are beyond the comprehension of most of us, but with Pinot you really get the full gamut of emotion, the frailties and the bravery, all immediately visible. I’m never sorry to see him win.

Thisbis exactly what I love about him. Gotta take the good with the heartbreak at times

I think I've said something similar about Pinot on the day he dropped out of the giro.

Great rider. I really love this guy, including the ups and downs.

 

[lartiste]

I am really happy for Tibopino and Tonton , congratulation both.

 

[Tonton]

Re:

I am really happy for Tibopino and Tonton , congratulation both.

Cheers my friend . Now let's see what tomorrow brings . His last stage 20 in a GT was what I call 9/11 on wheels for Tibopino. The one before was a win. Fingers crossed...

PS: and sure enough, El Tibo wins and Guimard takes him in the team today.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Great ride yesterday! He was probably arguagly as strong as Yates. When he's on one of his days, he's a world class climber and rider, but unfortunately he's not consistent enough for Grand Tours. Let's hope he rides a good WCRR (he very well could) and focuses on one-day races and one-week races instead, where he could be in in the very elite.

 

[LeChuck]

Really fun Vuelta for the Pinot fans. He said today it might be the grand tour he enjoyed the most in his career. Hoping for more in 2019

 

[lartiste]

At the end of the day, great Vuelta for him and eventhough I cannot still believe it, finished 6th in GC.

If he will improve TT and consistence, he could win a GT. Hope for that!

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Pinot is still my favorite French rider. You want to give him more (in terms of end GC result) but he's too on/off. Still on his good days he is enjoyable to watch

 

[yaco]

Has been an excellent year for Pinot - I suspect he will ride the TDF in 2019 as his major target - Whether this will be for GC or stage hunting is yet to be seen.

 

[Leinster]

With the form of Tibo, and Alaf right now, and the big names from other countries (Bala, Nibali, Uran) looking weak, and proven champs not featuring in the high mountains (Kwiat and Sagan) and the Brits not sending Froome or G, (and maybe Simon threw all his effort into winning red, not rainbow) are France climbing high on the list of favorites for Innsbruck?

 

[Tonton]

Re:

With the form of Tibo, and Alaf right now, and the big names from other countries (Bala, Nibali, Uran) looking weak, and proven champs not featuring in the high mountains (Kwiat and Sagan) and the Brits not sending Froome or G, (and maybe Simon threw all his effort into winning red, not rainbow) are France climbing high on the list of favorites for Innsbruck?

...that's a lot of ifs .

Even if all are on their A game, Tibo has a chance...not a big one, but race tactics will be crucial. Will Alaf and The Don watch each other? Nibali is playing possum, but he'll be ready. Kwiat scares me. And of course, knowing that final downhill like the palm of his hand will be a must.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Re:

With the form of Tibo, and Alaf right now, and the big names from other countries (Bala, Nibali, Uran) looking weak, and proven champs not featuring in the high mountains (Kwiat and Sagan) and the Brits not sending Froome or G, (and maybe Simon threw all his effort into winning red, not rainbow) are France climbing high on the list of favorites for Innsbruck?

Rigoberto Uran and Adam Yates rise into form.

 

[Simurgh]

Would it be too ridiculous to suggest, that he could have been in that select front group at the end, if France rose for him? (And not closing gaps for Bardet/Alaphilippe). Either way, it was a good race and the top 3 definitely deserved their placings, congratulations!