ToB in top 10 stage races in the world?

[SirLes]

Reading the info on the Tour of Britain one of the organisers describes it as one of the top 10 stage races.

As a Brit it would be nice if that were the case but is it?

Top three are the grand tours obviously

Then I would have thought (In no particular order) ToC, P-N, T-A, DL, Tour of Switzerland. Of course one could argue that some of those races' importance is to do with indicators of TdF or similar form rather than the title itself but I still think they come next.

That makes 8 straight off and I've probably missed a couple.


What do we think.

Pure marketing BS or is there a nugget or more of truth

 

[Netserk]

Major lol @ ToC.

Tour de France
Giro d'Italia
Vuelta a España
Dauphiné Libéré
Tour de Suisse
Paris - Nice
Tirreno - Adriatico
Vuelta al País Vasco
Volta Ciclista a Catalunya
Tour de Romandie

 

[SKSemtex]

Tour of Basque Country must be ahead for sure.

 

[Pricey_sky]

If you put the races in groups of 10 I would put it in the 2nd division, it's not upto the standard of PN, TA, Catalunya ect but it's growing well and is now quite well thougt of.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Define what criteria you need to place in the top 10. Prestige, WT points, etc. Tour of Beijing is more important in terms of WT points but I doubt it ranks that highly in other things.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Major lol @ ToC.

Tour de France
Giro d'Italia
Vuelta a España
Dauphiné Libéré
Tour de Suisse
Paris - Nice
Tirreno - Adriatico
Vuelta al País Vasco
Volta Ciclista a Catalunya
Tour de Romandie

I agree with this list.

 

[The Hitch]

Reading the info on the Tour of Britain one of the organisers describes it as one of the top 10 stage races.

As a Brit it would be nice if that were the case but is it?

Top three are the grand tours obviously

Then I would have thought (In no particular order) ToC, P-N, T-A, DL, Tour of Switzerland. Of course one could argue that some of those races' importance is to do with indicators of TdF or similar form rather than the title itself but I still think they come next.

That makes 8 straight off and I've probably missed a couple.


What do we think.

Pure marketing BS or is there a nugget or more of truth

TOC?

The WT ones must come first, (at least those with a history, can ignore Beijing)

1 Tour
2 Giro
3 Vuelta
4 TDS
5 Tirreno
6 PN
7 Dauphine
8 Pais Vasco
9 Volta Catalunya
10 Romandie
11 Tour of Poland
12 Tour of Benelux
13 Tour down under

If one wants to go maverick then races like the Volta Portugal and Vuelta Colombia mightbe up there.

But sticking to the (main) European peloton after the wt races the top 10 would probably be

14 California
15 Tour of Britain
16 Tour of Austria
17 Volta a Algarve
18 Colorado
19 San Luis
20 Trentino
21 Vuelta a Burgos
22 3 days de panne
23 Criterium International

Beijing starts making its way up the ladder in the next few years carried by its wt status.




Of course no way you look at it is tob in the top 10. But this ridiculous overhyping happens all the time. I remember the organizer of the Tour of Singarak saying it was almost like the Tour de France. Armstrong and co had a big campaign that involved the UCI to try to make California out to be bigger than the giro and vuelta, even tried to destroy those races so that Cali could take their place ligget said the Tour down under was the 4th biggest race in the world.

And in Britain of course we already saw the headline that the Surrey cycle classic will be as big as Roubaix by 2016

Idiots at the top of the sport. Thats what it is. Total idiots.

 

[Netserk]

TOC?

The WT ones must come first, (at least those with a history, can ignore Beijing)

1 Tour
2 Giro
3 Vuelta
4 TDS
5 Tirreno
6 PN
7 Dauphine
8 Pais Vasco
9 Volta Catalunya
10 Romandie
11 Tour of Poland
12 Tour of Benelux
13 Tour down under

If one wants to go maverick then races like the Volta Portugal and Vuelta Colombia mightbe up there.

But sticking to the (main) European peloton after the wt races the top 10 would probably be

14 California
15 Tour of Britain
16 Tour of Austria
17 Volta a Algarve
18 Colorado
19 San Luis
20 Vuelta a Burgos
21 3 days de panne
22 Criterium International
23 Settimana Coppi e Bartali



Of course no way you look at it is tob in the top 10. But this ridiculous overhyping happens all the time. I remember the organizer of the Tour of Singarak saying it was almost like the Tour de France. Armstrong and co had a big campaign that involved the UCI to try to make California out to be bigger than the giro and vuelta, even tried to destroy those races so that Cali could take their place ligget said the Tour down under was the 4th biggest race in the world.

And in Britain of course we already saw the headline that the Surrey cycle classic will be as big as Roubaix by 2016

Idiots at the top of the sport. Thats what it is. Total idiots.

Why do you hate Trentino?

 

[The Hitch]

Define what criteria you need to place in the top 10. Prestige, WT points, etc. Tour of Beijing is more important in terms of WT points but I doubt it ranks that highly in other things.

Tour of Britain may be more prestigious than the Tour of Beijing but that is not a battle for top 10.

 

[therhodeo]

Its the new TOC nothing more. Its the hype of the week tour for the country that's currently winning the TDF.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Tour of Britain may be more prestigious than the Tour of Beijing but that is not a battle for top 10.

The ToB will always be the Milk Race to me just as the (League cup) Capital One Cup will be the Milk Cup.

 

[veji11]

total marketing bull**** NOW, but it doesn't mean it can't quickly be the case : a selective 10 day race where you would have poor weather, good use of the different dales and hills etc could quickly become a classic.

 

[Catwhoorg]

The ToB will always be the Milk Race to me just as the (League cup) Capital One Cup will be the Milk Cup.

I still call it the Milk Races as well.

ToB is top #10 only in the twitter feed of @UKcyclingexpert.

I wouldn't be surprised if it makes the world tour level (or whatever that ends up being called) in the next 10 years.

 

[Ferminal]

Get B1 and B2 doing the commentary and it can be #2 behind the Tour, although that title rotates depending on the month.

 

[martinvickers]

Reading the info on the Tour of Britain one of the organisers describes it as one of the top 10 stage races.

As a Brit it would be nice if that were the case but is it?

Top three are the grand tours obviously

Then I would have thought (In no particular order) ToC, P-N, T-A, DL, Tour of Switzerland. Of course one could argue that some of those races' importance is to do with indicators of TdF or similar form rather than the title itself but I still think they come next.

That makes 8 straight off and I've probably missed a couple.


What do we think.

Pure marketing BS or is there a nugget or more of truth

This, and let's be honest, can you blame them? May as well sell it. It's getting more important, but it still is what it is..

 

[martinvickers]

Major lol @ ToC.

Tour de France
Giro d'Italia
Vuelta a España
Dauphiné Libéré
Tour de Suisse
Paris - Nice
Tirreno - Adriatico
Vuelta al País Vasco
Volta Ciclista a Catalunya
Tour de Romandie

Good list there - think Suisse is maybe a little high.

Don't blame the guy for trying to sell his race, and it's certainly on the up...but not top 10, not a chance.

See how it goes this year as a 2.HC, but I don't think it has the hills for the 'big time', though P-N showed there is another way this year...

 

[martinvickers]

TOC?

The WT ones must come first, (at least those with a history, can ignore Beijing)

1 Tour
2 Giro
3 Vuelta
4 TDS
5 Tirreno
6 PN
7 Dauphine
8 Pais Vasco
9 Volta Catalunya
10 Romandie
11 Tour of Poland
12 Tour of Benelux
13 Tour down under

If one wants to go maverick then races like the Volta Portugal and Vuelta Colombia mightbe up there.

But sticking to the (main) European peloton after the wt races the top 10 would probably be

14 California
15 Tour of Britain
16 Tour of Austria
17 Volta a Algarve
18 Colorado
19 San Luis
20 Trentino
21 Vuelta a Burgos
22 3 days de panne
23 Criterium International

Beijing starts making its way up the ladder in the next few years carried by its wt status.




Of course no way you look at it is tob in the top 10. But this ridiculous overhyping happens all the time. I remember the organizer of the Tour of Singarak saying it was almost like the Tour de France. Armstrong and co had a big campaign that involved the UCI to try to make California out to be bigger than the giro and vuelta, even tried to destroy those races so that Cali could take their place ligget said the Tour down under was the 4th biggest race in the world.

And in Britain of course we already saw the headline that the Surrey cycle classic will be as big as Roubaix by 2016

Idiots at the top of the sport. Thats what it is. Total idiots.

You're wrong on this, quite wrong. They aren't idiots. they're salesmen, and quite good at it. I think you probably know that - it's the fans they take for idiots. And not incorrectly.

I do think ToB hitting roughly around or under ToCalifornia and TDU seems about right - good races, getting better, but they don't have the history. Difference going forward maybe is California has access to serious climbs that Britain doesn't.

 

[Ferminal]

Suisse should be ahead of the Vuelta tbh.

 

[del1962]

You're wrong on this, quite wrong. They aren't idiots. they're salesmen, and quite good at it. I think you probably know that - it's the fans they take for idiots. And not incorrectly.

I do think ToB hitting roughly around or under ToCalifornia and TDU seems about right - good races, getting better, but they don't have the history. Difference going forward maybe is California has access to serious climbs that Britain doesn't.

If you accept the TOB is a continuation of the milk race then it has a lot more history than the TDU, TOC, and actually preceeds some of the WT stage races (and thats not including Bejing and Eneco),

so is it history or the quality of riders that race that makes a stage race bigger, I guess it is the quality of riders which means a WT race will always be bigger.

 

[theyoungest]

Suisse should be ahead of the Vuelta tbh.

As should a couple of other races, in terms of level. I'd even rate the Vuelta al Pais Vasco above the Vuelta proper. (Horner won both, so he won't mind)

 

[The Hitch]

If you accept the TOB is a continuation of the milk race then it has a lot more history than the TDU, TOC, and actually preceeds some of the WT stage races (and thats not including Bejing and Eneco),

If tob gets history from the milk race, eneco tour gets it from the tour of Netherlands.

 

[theyoungest]

If tob gets history from the milk race, eneco tour gets it from the tour of Netherlands.

The importance of races is also pretty locally determined, a Dutch rider would rather win the Eneco Tour than the Tour de Pologne, for instance. In fact, a Dutch rider actually won the TdP last year and I think if I weren't a cycling follower I'd have heard nothing about it.

 

[The Hitch]

The importance of races is also pretty locally determined, a Dutch rider would rather win the Eneco Tour than the Tour de Pologne, for instance. In fact, a Dutch rider actually won the TdP last year and I think if I weren't a cycling follower I'd have heard nothing about it.

Well, I'm polish and I didn't hear anything about it either

Though I was on holiday with no internet access and when I got it back it was 3 weeks later and the vuelta was on.

But last year the tdp was a disgrace with 2 stages in Italy. 2009-11 it was a very good little race and will get back to that this year I think.

But if we are talking locally entrenched, tdp is bigger in Poland than I think most non gt wt races are in their countries. Pretty much all those other countries hold far bigger events in other sports. In Poland Tour de Pologne is the only real world level sporting event. It's a big deal to have top tier athletes come, even if you don't know any of them, if it's the only time all year it happens.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Poland is a strange one in that it's current WT iteration is fairly young but the race is enormously old and historic, it's just undergone a radical alteration fairly recently which means a lot of that history is often overlooked when discussing the race.

I like this year's course. I wasn't so keen on last year's. I understand having the race mostly in the south for the hills, but crossing borders in a one-week race is fine only up to a point. In a GT, the distant beginnings (Giro in Denmark, Vuelta in the Netherlands, Tour in Rotterdam etc.) aren't such a problem as even if they have the long transfer (not always needed e.g. Tour in Benelux or UK) they have rest days available and still the scope to have 90% of the race in the host country. But for shorter races, really going that far off-piste is a bit much. If the Tour de Pologne wanted to go into Slovakia like this year, or the Czech Republic to climb, Idunno, Lysá Hora or Zlaté Navrší (actually, I'd mark out like a little girl if they did the latter, especially if they went via the climb to the biathlon course at Jakuszyce out of Poland into CZE and then via Rezek to the base of the final climb), that would be no problem. Even if they went right into the southeast and went for an MTF in the Ukraine on Uzhok Pass, then fine, but all the way to Italy is just unnecessary. I want the Karpacz stage back, too!

Off topic now of course, so back to the ToB. No it isn't within the top 10 stage races in the world. It shouldn't pretend to be. It's fast rising, the courses are no doubt getting better, and it's nice that it's less repetitive as more places seek to involve themselves in cycling, and the lineups for the teams are getting better and justifying the increase in status (though it may be disappointing for some teams like An Post).

There is so much potential in the Tour of Britain that it could feasibly make itself a much more important race; but even with the Milk Race background it can't compete with many races for history to get prestige that way, and there's a long way to go before the fan interest is enough to compete with, say, País Vasco. In order to get prestige without the history they've got to make it so that it is a real bright spot on people's palmarès, which right now, save for perhaps the Britons, it isn't. Therefore, it needs to be a real hard race. There is the scope to make this the stage race par excellence for Classics riders, using some of the great cobbled climbs and Ardennes-like hills that Britain has to offer. That's the way I'd like to see them take it and that could give it a real prestige. It could become a genuine spot of interest with regards to training for the Worlds with several of the world's best Classics riders showing up, and yet the course could still be varied, it wouldn't end up like the Danmark Rundt where everybody knows the all important stage is the Vejle one, or Dunkerque where it's all about Mont Cassel (even if that stage is invariably great).

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Suisse should be ahead of the Vuelta tbh.

What is wrong with you?