Tour de France 2019 stage 14: Tarbes - Tourmalet 117 km

[hrotha]

Re: Re:

Why wouldn't AV want to ride for GC?

Because he likes winning stages more than getting eighth on GC.

Does he? His behaviour for years now clearly contradicts this.

 

[Oude Geuze]

Only reason Ineos looks weak is Kwiatkowski who’s obviously not on form and the fact that support riders Thomas and Bernal are there to ride GC in absence of Froome. If he was here it would have been businesses as usual, Thomas, Bernal and Poels would have crushed the field and killed any racing. The only surprise this year is the strength of Alaphilippe, and even though I would have liked to see peak Froome in one last hurrah, I’m loving this tour!

Except Poels went early too, something tells me Ineos is losing their edge.

Poels always have on and off days, especially in the two first weeks. There would probably have been 3 Ineos riders at the finish today with Froome in the race, keeping a tempo just shy of blowing up Thomas and scaring anyone else away from attacking. Then, in the third week, they would be 4 until last km.

 

[Blanco]

Re: Re:

Apparently Quintana never told anyone on the team he was having a bad day or not feeling well. Also feel a bit for Valverde who said he didn't want to ride for GC in the Tour this year (or anymore in general) and kept saying he wanted to go stage hunting. Now he's likely being asked to ride for GC and take up co leader role with Landa. I do think Landa did the best he could. He said he was he was on his limit and even went into the red in the last KM to stay as close as he could.

Why wouldn't AV want to ride for GC?

Because he didn't want to ride Tour in the firs place!!!

 

[woodburn]

I couldn’t believe it when they stopped to stare at each other when Thomas cracked. Freaking ride. Pinot and the rest may regret not getting more time.

 

[Armchair cyclist]

What is the point of Simon Yates soft pedalling for the first week if the first time that Adam needs him he accompanies him for a while and then finishes 10 minutes behind him?

Wants another stage tomorrow?

 

[Tigerion]

The moaning on this forum is pathetic. That was compelling viewing with a dramatic finale and yet if the GC guys aren’t trying to push each other off cliffs or attacking in the neutral zone loads of you start crying and complaining how boring it all is. Accusing the riders of cowardice is appalling. Stop moaning or follow another sport. I loved today and have loved every minute of this enthralling Tour.

swap Alaphillipe with Froome and no one would call it compelling

If Froome was totally isolated on the final climb of the first mountain stage I would certainly find int more interesting than any recent tour

 

[gregrowlerson]

Re: Re:

This was a truly great stage, and not only because Pinot won, but that we actually got action rather early with Movistar finally taking up the mantle, and later FDJ. I would have liked Jumbo taking the initiative a bit earlier than they did, since they had three riders deep into the finale. I noticed Thomas hanging on the back of the group and had a feeling that he might didn't feel too well today, but history in mind, I didn't dare to hope that it was more than Froome-style yo-yoing. The question is whether it was an off-day - if it isn't just an off-day, will Bernal step up?

Let's hope that their indecision will lead to their downfall.

Exactly what I was thinking! If they don't know which horse to bet on, when others turn up the heat in a crucial moment...that is the chance for Pinot, Kruijswijk and I guess even Buchmann too!

As others have said, it was truly great to see INEOS fall apart - not because I have an inherent dislike for them or their riders, but rather a dislike that stems from me not liking superiority in general - especially not superiority that has gone on for so long; since the start of this decade! And unfortunately superiority in cycling usually equals strangled defensive racing, where the outcome is 99% given beforehand. When the Alaphilippe/Pinot raid happened, I genuinely started to believe that someone (Pinot) could challenge INEOS - even though I expected an honorable podium placing in the end. Today is the first time since 2014 I guess, that I genuinely believe that INEOS can be beaten, and that they won't have a rider in yellow, when entering Champs-Elysees. Let's see, if the euphoria today will dampen tomorrow, like Froome did the day after Machucos.

Bernal never hesitated at all to consider waiting for Thomas when he started to slip off the back, so I don't think that indecision will be their downfall. Bernal and Thomas look likely to be allowed to ride their own races. And both are still as favoured to win as anyone (if we discount JA). Even if Thomas loses a minute on stage 15, he might recover after the rest day. Bernal could easily be the strongest rider in the alps.

 

[Pantani_lives]

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

What is the point of Simon Yates soft pedalling for the first week if the first time that Adam needs him he accompanies him for a while and then finishes 10 minutes behind him?

Wants another stage tomorrow?

This season hasn't worked out for the Yates brothers. Simon looked much better last year.

 

[Kwibus]

Re:

Still... Alaph is a guy who couldnt win PN or Pais Vasco because he cracked eventually. I still think it seems unlikely he won't here?

So far he seems fine, but they will need to attack him to defeat him I think. This stage was all about high pace and dropping riders while nobody attacked from the front.

 

[Kwibus]

Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Thats really fast, so cant say its a weak field.

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Re: Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Thats really fast, so cant say its a weak field.

Yeah. The fast ascent of Soulor did some damage, too.

 

[yaco]

Re:

What is the point of Simon Yates soft pedalling for the first week if the first time that Adam needs him he accompanies him for a while and then finishes 10 minutes behind him?

Wants another stage tomorrow?

MS made a wise tactical decision asking Haig and S.Yates to drop back halfway up the last climb - Save energy and go for more stages - The worry is that Haig appears stronger than the leader - Haif had to stop and wait for A.yates on the second last climb.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Thats really fast, so cant say its a weak field.

How was it different from 2010?

Anyway, super short stage, tailwind and absolutely ideal pacing up the climb.

It's also very, very hard to just look at climbing speed alone. Last year for example, the Zoncolan speeds were off the charts while the Finestre climbing speeds were super slow.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Thats really fast, so cant say its a weak field.

Well the favorites had hardly anything to do with the time. This was just a case of teammates setting the perfect pace all the way from the start of the climb to the finish. Put an in shape froome in that field and I'm certain he would have dropped Pinot easily

 

[Fergoose]

Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Blimey, that does change my perception a bit. I know there was a tempo being set for almost the whole climb and some GC riders lost contact, but it didn't look like a particularly aggressive ascent at all.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Thats really fast, so cant say its a weak field.

Well the favorites had hardly anything to do with the time. This was just a case of teammates setting the perfect pace all the way from the start of the climb to the finish. Put an in shape froome in that field and I'm certain he would have dropped Pinot easily

Depends on what Froome. He hadn't exactly done a PSM since, well, PSM. I think Pinot's peak form is a bit underrated, especially after the end of last year.

 

[carton]

Great win by Pinot! Very well earned. Great to see him show the steel to match his talent. I really hope it's between him, Bernal and Stevie K at the end. Great racing by Manny Buchmann as well, way to take the race by the horns when most would shy away.

But also, great job by Movistar, really. They get so much senseless crap from people with seemingly no memory, but they take the race on time after time, with steadfast faith in their (at times manifold) leaders, ride or die. They make mistakes, hilariously so at times, but they go for broke more than any team in the last twenty years. It's an mesmerizing feature of the cycling cultural tapestry how quickly bravery gets dismissed as idiocy once the dice comes up snake eyes. A willful blindness to everything that is not memorialized by a notch on the palmares.

Surprising stuff from Alaphilippe, once again. As someone a fan of the way he approaches bike racing, I really hope he cracks soon. As I liked to see Thomas crack a bit today. It's the wabi-sabi that makes the whole exercise just a bit more authentic, to me. It's a weird place to find oneself in, just goes with being a cycling fan nowadays, I guess.

 

[Fergoose]

Re:

Great win by Pinot! Very well earned. Great to see him show the steel to match his talent. I really hope it's between him, Bernal and Stevie K at the end. Great racing by Manny Buchmann as well, way to take the race by the horns when most would shy away.

But also, great job by Movistar, really. They get so much senseless crap from people with seemingly no memory, but they take the race on time after time, with steadfast faith in their (at times manifold) leaders, ride or die. They make mistakes, hilariously so at times, but they go for broke more than any team in the last twenty years. It's an mesmerizing feature of the cycling cultural tapestry how quickly bravery gets dismissed as idiocy once the dice comes up snake eyes. A willful blindness to everything that is not memorialized by a notch on the palmares.

Surprising stuff from Alaphilippe, once again. As someone a fan of the way he approaches bike racing, I really hope he cracks soon. As I liked to see Thomas crack a bit today. It's the wabi-sabi that makes the whole exercise just a bit more authentic, to me. It's a weird place to find oneself in, just goes with being a cycling fan nowadays, I guess.

In this instance Soler and Amador were seen having an argument while setting tempo and the Movistar train were repeatedly looking over their shoulder for their hiding team leader. You can be both brave and laughably idiotic, and this was one of those days courtesy of Movistar. There is no excuse for yesterday in the era of team radio.

I do agree with not criticising teams for making an effort that doesn't quite come off, but that wasn't the case yesterday.

 

[carton]

Re: Re:

In this instance Soler and Amador were seen having an argument while setting tempo and the Movistar train were repeatedly looking over their shoulder for their hiding team leader. You can be both brave and laughably idiotic, and this was one of those days courtesy of Movistar. There is no excuse for yesterday in the era of team radio.

I do agree with not criticising teams for making an effort that doesn't quite come off, but that wasn't the case yesterday.

I agree with most of this. I think you can both criticize them (and Nairo in particular) for not being in sync, and commend them for their courage to go for the win. I would just do the latter far more than the former, but ymmv.

 

[Pantani_lives]

Re: Re:

Average speed on Tourmalet was over 22 km/h for the first time, but it's hard to compare, because it wasn't exactly the same climb and it usually isn't a MTF.

http://www.climbing-records.com/search?q=tourmalet

Thats really fast, so cant say its a weak field.

How was it different from 2010?

According to the numbers 2019 was slightly longer and less steep. Maybe the first kilometers were different?

 

[Forever The Best]

Didn't they take the Fignon road in 2010?

 

[Gigs_98]

Re:

What is the point of Simon Yates soft pedalling for the first week if the first time that Adam needs him he accompanies him for a while and then finishes 10 minutes behind him?

Wants another stage tomorrow?